And furthermore...I still think that a much simpler mod (that what EA and RAM are doing) would be almost as good. Parts...$200. Labor...$200. Profit...$300. Total cost $700. Maybe I will play around with one of my amps after all.
Tube Amp for Magnepan 3.6 - Rogue Zeus/VTL-MB450
Hey Audiogoners,
First post to A-gon and I need your advice! I've researched this site extensively, read thousands of your threads, and purchased good product through you folks. So here goes.....
Bought a used pair of Maggie 3.6Rs -absolutely love them! [Chose over ML Odyssey, Ascent i (also liked), Maggie 1.6] They're accompanied w/Supernal tweeters and an AMC B1-20 sub. I'm upgrading my stack from ss to tubes. Caught the addiction! Having listened to tubes while auditioning e-stats/planars, I've concluded that they just make the sound more "real life" -at least for my taste (go to alot of live shows). I just love that sound!
Also picked up a used VTL 2.5 tube pre-amp along with the 3.6s. Had no prior knowledge of VTL. The 2.5 presents a beautiful large deep soundstage (3D), brings everything to life, sounds tubey -not overly tubey. I've heard some pre-amps I like better (Viva Linea), but at a much higher price point.
So, I want to upgrade two things -Amp and CD
Amp:
Having had such good experience with VTL, I'm tempted to pick up a used pair of VTL-MB450s (at half list), never having heard them. Also considering Rogue Zeus (used)-listened through modest set of electronics/speakers. The Zeus is so powerful that it actually carried the entire system. Bass is tremendous -best I've heard in a tube amp so far. Could have been a tad more articulate in the mid/highs, and didn't present a deep soundstage, but I'm tending to attribute these limitations to the electronics/speakers that accompanied the setup. My sense is that the Zeus could power my 3.6s very well, and drive them to their potential. Zeus is also very well made. Liked the warm standby switchable mode as well as built-in tube biasing. Knocks -it's So friggin' heavy (even more of a monster in real life), & pumps out a ton of heat. Definitely an Uber-amp.
Is there anyone out there in Audiogondom who has listened to both the Rogue Zeus AND the VTL-MB450, and can give me a real life comparison???.....
Other products I've auditioned ...to give a sense of my listening tastes (please DO NOT BE OFFENDED as I'm not trying to knock a brand of gear you may own; it's all good):
ASL Hurricanes - listened opposite Zeus, w/better electronics/speakers. Found them to be more articulate (tubey) in the mids (real nice), lean highs, definitely light bass (compared to Zeus).
Jolida 3000 monos - sounded decent w/3.6s. Tad syrupy. Definitely not the bass slam/quickness of Zeus. Good sound none the less.
Sim Audio Moon W-5 (I know it's ss, but comes highly recommended with the 3.6s) - listened while auditioning Metronome tube CD (w/Moon stack, Triangles). The whole setup disappointed me. The sound was flat, not dimensional. Maybe it was the setup. I'm still stumped.
Can't find Wolcotts in my area. Haven't auditioned VAC.
So, VTL-450 or Rogue Zeus? And why?
Second question, CD.
Tubes?
I really like the Shanling 200 sound, but have heard consistently horrible stories (from 3 of 4 dealers) about reliability. Heard they've addressed firmware issues, but still leary about dropping bucks on a unit with double digit failure rate.
Others...
Metronome CDv2 demo - just sounded flat an uninspiring (maybe it was the system).
Jolida 100 modified - sounded good; lively, crisp, warm but not too tubey.
AMC DB6 modified (with an AMC DAC9 modified) - decent, but not as articulate or sweet as Shanling, not as crisp as Jolida, and didn't seem all that well built. I do like the DAC9 by itself though.
Eastern Electric Mini Max -good for the money, well built, but simply can't compare to Shanling sound.
Audio Research top loader -didn't enjoy w/Krell stack
Musical Fidelity 308 -beautiful crisp highs; maybe should audition w/tube stack.
Wadia 861, McCormick ($3K) -just didn't enjoy them
So, I'm stuck. I like the Shanling sound, but not its Word Of Mouth reliability.
Any other suggestions? Next on my audition list is the Cary 308t. Remember, I'm looking for that warm, lively, beautifully finished sound -but not too analytical.
Sim Audio Moon Eclipe? Rega Jupiter? Other?
Thank you folks.
First post to A-gon and I need your advice! I've researched this site extensively, read thousands of your threads, and purchased good product through you folks. So here goes.....
Bought a used pair of Maggie 3.6Rs -absolutely love them! [Chose over ML Odyssey, Ascent i (also liked), Maggie 1.6] They're accompanied w/Supernal tweeters and an AMC B1-20 sub. I'm upgrading my stack from ss to tubes. Caught the addiction! Having listened to tubes while auditioning e-stats/planars, I've concluded that they just make the sound more "real life" -at least for my taste (go to alot of live shows). I just love that sound!
Also picked up a used VTL 2.5 tube pre-amp along with the 3.6s. Had no prior knowledge of VTL. The 2.5 presents a beautiful large deep soundstage (3D), brings everything to life, sounds tubey -not overly tubey. I've heard some pre-amps I like better (Viva Linea), but at a much higher price point.
So, I want to upgrade two things -Amp and CD
Amp:
Having had such good experience with VTL, I'm tempted to pick up a used pair of VTL-MB450s (at half list), never having heard them. Also considering Rogue Zeus (used)-listened through modest set of electronics/speakers. The Zeus is so powerful that it actually carried the entire system. Bass is tremendous -best I've heard in a tube amp so far. Could have been a tad more articulate in the mid/highs, and didn't present a deep soundstage, but I'm tending to attribute these limitations to the electronics/speakers that accompanied the setup. My sense is that the Zeus could power my 3.6s very well, and drive them to their potential. Zeus is also very well made. Liked the warm standby switchable mode as well as built-in tube biasing. Knocks -it's So friggin' heavy (even more of a monster in real life), & pumps out a ton of heat. Definitely an Uber-amp.
Is there anyone out there in Audiogondom who has listened to both the Rogue Zeus AND the VTL-MB450, and can give me a real life comparison???.....
Other products I've auditioned ...to give a sense of my listening tastes (please DO NOT BE OFFENDED as I'm not trying to knock a brand of gear you may own; it's all good):
ASL Hurricanes - listened opposite Zeus, w/better electronics/speakers. Found them to be more articulate (tubey) in the mids (real nice), lean highs, definitely light bass (compared to Zeus).
Jolida 3000 monos - sounded decent w/3.6s. Tad syrupy. Definitely not the bass slam/quickness of Zeus. Good sound none the less.
Sim Audio Moon W-5 (I know it's ss, but comes highly recommended with the 3.6s) - listened while auditioning Metronome tube CD (w/Moon stack, Triangles). The whole setup disappointed me. The sound was flat, not dimensional. Maybe it was the setup. I'm still stumped.
Can't find Wolcotts in my area. Haven't auditioned VAC.
So, VTL-450 or Rogue Zeus? And why?
Second question, CD.
Tubes?
I really like the Shanling 200 sound, but have heard consistently horrible stories (from 3 of 4 dealers) about reliability. Heard they've addressed firmware issues, but still leary about dropping bucks on a unit with double digit failure rate.
Others...
Metronome CDv2 demo - just sounded flat an uninspiring (maybe it was the system).
Jolida 100 modified - sounded good; lively, crisp, warm but not too tubey.
AMC DB6 modified (with an AMC DAC9 modified) - decent, but not as articulate or sweet as Shanling, not as crisp as Jolida, and didn't seem all that well built. I do like the DAC9 by itself though.
Eastern Electric Mini Max -good for the money, well built, but simply can't compare to Shanling sound.
Audio Research top loader -didn't enjoy w/Krell stack
Musical Fidelity 308 -beautiful crisp highs; maybe should audition w/tube stack.
Wadia 861, McCormick ($3K) -just didn't enjoy them
So, I'm stuck. I like the Shanling sound, but not its Word Of Mouth reliability.
Any other suggestions? Next on my audition list is the Cary 308t. Remember, I'm looking for that warm, lively, beautifully finished sound -but not too analytical.
Sim Audio Moon Eclipe? Rega Jupiter? Other?
Thank you folks.