On a $2500 budget, I'd get a Teres 245 with a Rega RB250 and a Denon DL103.
When you want to upgrade the arm, you can get the OL or Expressimo mods, and get much improved performance without having to sell the arm.
When you want to upgrade the cartridge, you could move to a DL103R, or a Shelter 501.
You won't have to upgrade the TT. It's already as good as just about anything out there.
I think this is a sensible package, that allows room for upgrading without losing money.
The performance will stun you, and if you could afford an extra $100, then get the DL103R to start with. It is well worth the extra, and you won't believe how good it sounds for the money. |
Mike, it's very hard to say whether it will be a factor or not. I have a traditional suspended wood floor on joists, over a crawl space. I have my Teres near the outer wall, and I have no problems with any "dancing" of the TT during play, even when I walk over to it. I don't have to tip-toe around. My large Rottweiler even rough-houses around on the floor right in front of the TT while it's playing, and there is no effect on the TT. On the other hand, I used to have a Linn LP12 that is a suspended TT, and that used to skip any time I walked across the room. And it was properly set up, because I am a Linn setup technician.
So it is very hard to predict what type of behavior will occur on a wood floor. All I can say is that I got better results on my wood floor with a non-suspended TT. I don't know what will happen in your case.
I will say that the Teres will handily outperform anything else you can get near that price range. If the wood floor is a problem, you can address the floor problems by bracing the floor joists underneath. If it is on the 2nd story, then I'm not sure how to handle it. I can only say that getting a suspended TT is no safe bet for that problem either. I found that out with my Linn. |
The "warmth" of the British tables, especially Linn, comes from a midbass coloration inherent to the table. It sounds warm, but actually lacks some of the lowest bass, and is not as tight in the bottom end as some other tables. The British tables do excel at PRaT, and sound very musical, so the colorations do not bother some folks, because they are getting a good musical presentation. I enjoyed my Linn for many years, and the colorations didn't bother me at all. But now that I have the Teres, I am getting all the PRaT of my Linn, and killer, tight, deep bottom end, and about twice as much detail, without the colorations. There is simply no contest between the two.
I think that the Teres 245 will give significantly better bottom end to your system, and it is not a "dry" sounding TT at all. It has tremendous impact and dynamics. I'm using Lowther single-drivers, which are notorious for weak bottom end, and my bass response is very good for as deep as the speaker will go(about 40Hz). I am not wanting for warmth in the bottom. The Teres will really deliver the bass. Very tonally accurate too. Naturally it helps to have a good arm and cartridge with it, also.
I have the Origin Live Silver tonearm, and a Shelter 501 on my 245, and this thing performs exceptionally well. Way beyond the norm for the price range it cost. My whole rig was only $3750. In my estimation, you'd have to pay triple for any new TT that would have a chance to beat it. |
Dennis, the sound of a TT is affected by the type of stand it is placed on. A mass-loaded TT like the Teres or Verdier would sound good on a very heavy rigid stand like yours. A Linn would sound bad on a heavy stand like that. Linn likes a lightweight stand. |
So Frank, tell me. How is the Shelter doing on the WB arm? I had another guy ask me about that, and I was wondering what your impressions are. |
Mike, the Teres has no dust cover. If you want to keep dust off, you have to cover it with a light cloth of silk or nylon, or something like that.
The DL103R is not imported into the US. I got mine from a member named "Martin". You can email him through the Audiogon system. He is a dealer in Singapore. He has very good prices on the DL103R($230). He is a reliable person to deal with. Mine arrived 10 days after order, and he takes Paypal too. He puts ads on the Audiogon classified for DL103R from time to time.
The DL103 and DL103R are from the same family of cartridges. They have very low compliance(5cu) and are not suitable for unipivot arms at all. The R model has 99.9999% copper coils and a slightly lower output(.27mv). It tracks better, and sounds way better. For sure worth the extra $80. I have had both on my system recently and compared them back-to-back. The 103R is a full step better than the regular 103. Either one of them is extremely good sounding for the money, and I don't think you'll find any other cartridge near the money that can touch it. But the 103R is better and worth it if you can get it. If you want to read an in-depth review, then click on my "Reviews" next to my name, and there is a complete review and comparison of the two 103 models there. |
Frank, that's great. I'm glad to hear that. Now I can file that in my useful information, and be able to pass it on to others. It's nearly impossible to try everything yourself, so it is really great when I can get the opinion of someone else who knows what they are listening to, and can give a meaningful opinion.
I'll bet you are really enjoying it. I know that I love my 501. It's a real winner. |
Mike. The Sota is also a very nice TT, as Sean and Nrchy point out. You would not go wrong with it either. I have my preference for the Teres however. |
Mike, I use a mass-loaded TT stand, which has granite slabs over wood, and topped with MDF covered with formica on the surface. I don't believe in soft isolation on a TT. I think isolation is the worst thing that you can do to a TT. In my opinion, direct coupling is the only thing that allows true dynamics and bass response. I would never isolate my TT. If I have a problem with the floor, then I fix the floor, I don't wreck to sound of my TT, in order to try to band aid a floor problem. The system I use now is a makeshift stand that I threw together. But it does the job, and has no "mushy" parts between the TT and the floor.
Regarding the comparison of sonics between the Teres and Sota tables, I am hesitant to say, as I don't want to tweak anyone's nose, but in my opinion it is no contest, the Teres walks away from the Sota. Sota is a nice table, but the Teres is in a whole other league, sonically. The main competition for the Teres 245 all cost over $10k. There is one other TT that would compete with the Teres in a similar price range, and that is the Redpoint TT. You can see it at the Redpoint website. I considered it too ugly for my tastes. Also I think that their motor/contoller doesn't do as well. But sonically, it would compete, if you want to pay $850 more than the Teres 245 and get a butt ugly TT. The Redpoint is an offshoot of the Teres project, and uses the same main bearing. The guy doing Redpoint is one of the original Teres project participants, Thom Mackris. Personally, I think the Teres is just as good sounding or better, and looks 100% better, and costs $850 less. This is the only TT that could be considered competition for the Teres under $10k with arm. IMHO, of course. |
Mike, it has to do with the frequency of the vibrations that come up the stand, and enter the suspension. I did not do the actual research on this, Linn Products did it. They recommended a light rigid stand for their TT as far back as the early 1980s.
Since the Teres is a mass-loaded design, more mass in the stand helps the TT even more, as it couples to the mass of the stand via the cones.
Nobody can predict the health of a high-end audio company 20 years down the road. That is impossible. Many companies that you now consider to be "big dogs" could easily be out of business that far out in the future. What I can say about the Teres TTs is, that all of the items in their TT will last a lifetime, except possibly the belts and motor. The motor is a Swiss made Maxon DC motor that can be obtained directly from Maxon, or even substituted. The belts you make yourself out of silk cord anyway. Nothing else will wear out as long as you are alive. I don't consider that to be an issue. I want the best sound for the least money, and the Teres is where it's at. |
