Tonearms longer than 12 inches

Very interesting post, I disagree with almost the entire thing but other than that very interesting.

The tracking error problem that has been brought up over and over is a mathematical problem, not a listening problem if you know what you are doing.  I still remember all the tonearm makers that were peddling 9" arms saying how the 12" arms were terrible due to the math, then within a few years they were all making them!!!  You know what that means, either the math changed (it didn't), they lied the first time, or they are lying now!!!!!!  Either way do you want to buy from people like that?

I have made arms from 9" to 16", all 3D printed and the length that works the best is 12", not because of tracking errors but because the longer the arm the effective mass becomes overly large and sounds wrong with the best cartridges.

Besides, the alignment issue is only a real one for those who cannot set up an arm correctly, it is not that hard just painstaking.  You are right about one thing though, the 10" to 10.5" length is the easiest to get the best sound from and is usually the best choice for most listeners, size wise and money wise.

HW

I agree Raul, the 10" Prime/Classic length arm is the one I recommend for almost everyone.  It is rigid (good bass) it is quiet (3D printing), it is easy to set up correctly, and does not cost an arm and a leg..  The Prime arm just got Product of the Year from Hi-FI Plus in England and the Prime has gotten more amazing reviews internationally than any table we have ever made mostly due to that arm!!  That 10" distance is the magic number for 99% of my customers.

The problem is I have 7 tape machines and hundreds of tapes, many of them master copies, and the 12" 3D printed arm sounds more like the tape than the 10" does.  We are talking subtle, it is not gob smack in the face!!!  It is a painstaking setup though and is probably not worth the energy in the end.

My son has been helping me clean up my basement and found a notebook from my days in college, opens it up and sees a math problem that took two pages to solve, it was about an electron in free space.  I get the math, I believe in math, but in the end I have the reference tape they made the record with on the same tape machine they made the record with so what is right is right, the 12" arm sounds very subtly more like the tape in the upper midrange, those violins are so smooth!!!!!

Raul, you correct about those long Japanese arms, I have been quietly selling off my SAEC and my FR-66 and others because they just don't cut it anymore.  Too many parts, too much metal, too much mass!!  Really nice to look at though.

HW

Is this the Albert Porter I have heard about over the years with the Technics tables???  Or am I old enough to be hallucinating again!!!

If so it is nice to meet you.

HW

A 12" arm with its shallower arc is like a linear tracking arm that is set up wrong, it is wrong over larger parts of its travel then a shorter arm.  I don't hear the difference the math claims but I do a very precise setup.

My 12" 3D arms when set up properly have the smoothest upper midrange I have ever heard, rivaling the best linear tracking air bearing arms.  The one piece totally damped design with no small pieces sticking out all over really does not resonate and that makes a uni-pivot work even better.   HW