Thorsten Loesch vs Amir


Let the games begin!

 

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/is-the-ifi-audio-zen-one-signature-dac-a-waste-of-money.36833/

 

An interesting conversation should be developing concerning the credibility of  the numbers race by the measurement is everything crowd and the rest of us out here in the real world.

 

It's an interesting read so far, the following quote from Loesch in the thread is what I would call as plain as the nose on your face:

“I will not particularly criticise Amir, but I'm looking forward to the day when he finally fixed the groundloops/pin1 problem plaguing his AP2 measurements, something really basic.”

Amir will not address that statement in any credible way since this would be an admission that he is totally incapable of dealing with the intricacies of proper measurement details and would make all of his tests suspect. Even if Loesch's opinion that maybe Amir was dumb enough to have pin 1 connected to the shell of his xlr connectors when he performs a test there is obviously some reason for the constant apologizing for the 'I tried everything I could to get rid of that 60hz crap but couldn't do it.' Not to mention the interference and noise sources common in a residential neighborhood which would negate the chance of any single test results being repeatable.

Now, if you were to choose any amplifier (especially any Class D) test on the site with a favorable sinad value and recommended by Amir the majority of them would show that amp operating within its linear range with a thd+n level approaching -80db or more so often from tests other than sinad Loesch's opinion that performance on a level far, far less than the cult at ASR drool over ( sans any personal experience) is audibly unimpeachable.

The question of equating accuracy of reproduction to measurements will go on forever, no doubt. My question is, will it be answered over at ASR.

If Amir is dumb enough to go up against Loesch what will soon happen is that  Amir will get frustrated and Loesch will be banned from the site.

larabee

Showing 1 response by thespeakerdude

I think the warning here is to avoid the cult of personality prevalent in consumer audio that is almost completely absent in professional audio. My customers never ask "who" designed a particular speaker. They do ask for particular engineers when it comes to system implementation, integration and tuning, but design? Never.

I don't know why, but I wasted time looking at Thorsten's posts, and some of Amir's replies. I never came across anything on XLR connectors, just one comment about power cables. I did come across Thorsten's strong opinions against ABX while at the same time, I think, putting forth superiority of the ITU methodology. We do extensive formal listening tests so it is something near and dear to my heart. I agree with Thorsten in principle on many areas of testing, differ in some, but also disagree with his fundamental premises on ABX (including that it is discredited, which is not true).

The overall impression I get from both of them is that they are not used to, and certainly do not like being challenged by people who are able to do it effectively and calmly. To me, they both try to browbeat their detractors as a way to avoid addressing the arguments made against their positions. I doubt I would enjoy a spirited discussion with either of them. I am reminded of one of my favorite comedy sketches by George Carlin. I will just say obviously neither of them is stupid, and I don't think either of them is nuts, so that leaves one option.