Thinking of Magnepan ... finally!

the price was really good on that set of 1.7i’s with magna risers with local tx pickup... am sure they sold in a jiffy...

worry not, there will be others

@arafiq

despite my often finding @secretguy 's commentary here cynical, spiteful and crass, in this case i agree with everything he is saying about the maggies

as you know, there is much much written here on a-gon about maggies big and small, old and new - i trust you have read through those posts carefully

my short advice is you must try them in your home, as much as share my thoughts here, i would be the first to admit that others’ words cannot convey what these speakers can do, especially when one’s prior reference are speakers such as harbeths fritz's other nice box speakers...

maggies are very very special speakers when given a room environment (and amplification) in which they can shine -- they have a level of beauty, fullness, coherence, wholeness and purity/clarity of sound that is a simply level (or two) above

i would say start with a nice used set of 1.7i, get them on magna riser stands (many used sets are sold with them) outlay is quite reasonable,resale not difficult,  try with and without subs (which i think you already have) - done right current gen maggies do not lack bass... though they don't produce the kind of pistonic woofer midbass in your chest 'punch' that some rock/edm listeners want

... and like pretty much ALL speakers extant, a pair of rels underneath bring them to a significantly higher plane of performance

get the speakers don’t worry about trivia like mods etc etc (those are minor and easy).... you’ve got a good amp for them now, as impassioned as i know you are in this hobby, experiencing maggies is a bucket list thing for you... one which might open a door to a new level of musical pleasure

 

$.02 maggies a virtually always presented at shows with tube gear powering them

this is incorrect (at least for the last 15-20 years)

maybe maggies have tube amps driving them in some room demo’s, but those would not be in the proper room that wendell demos his maggies as the principal exhibitor

maggie/wendell used to use bryston amps, then more recently switched to pass labs... neither are tube amps

in most recent shows where wendell is showing the little ’secret weapon’ dipole bass thingies....  he is using a schiit vidar to prove his point with a very cost effective amp... but once again, solid state

a few additional comments on what has been said

I have owned 3 sets of Maggies and love them dearly. Properly set up, Maggies have bass, but a subwoofer is always a good idea. Cross it over around 80 Hz. If you think of your walls as mirrorr, you will get the idea: angle the maggies toward the listener, the space between them 8 feet apart in your room. Try to angle the speakers 30 - 45 degrees to the back wall and about 2 - 3 feet out. The idea is to bounce the back wave off the back wall and onto the side wall, where it bounces again, lengthening the path of the back wave before it gets to the listener. Also the inevitable cancellation that wil occur around the sides of the speaker is upset by the differing distance from the speaker edges to the back wall, and minimized (due to the angleing of the speaker to the back wal). I recommend the 1.7i as your first pair.

@boomerbillone’s description above is terrific, very well said

other points

-- sub integration, if you use rel’s and their high level connection, is not any more difficult than integrating them with any other serious speaker - and in absolute terms, not hard, but you have some patience and rigor in your approach - current rels certainly have the speed to keep up with the maggies

-- better jumper and fuse bypass are easy and make a small but noticeable difference... outboard crossovers usually aren’t worth it, just buy a better maggie!...

-- i versions imo add a noticeable degree of warmth and weight to the sound that my ears very much appreciate

i think one of the most instructive things about this thread of @arafiq’s is the sheer number of magnepan supporters who have chimed in with their enthusiasm and suggestions for proper use ... owners old and new, of maggies old and new, the vast majority expressing their delight

in a forum where there are usually vastly differing opinions, widely varying suggestions, frequently diametrically opposite recommendations (topping d90 dac vs mhdt tubed dac, for instance, in another current thread, lol)... the sheer number of happy owners and supporters standing to be counted, many of whom are long tenured yet rarely post, speaks amply of the quality and value of this line of speakers 👍

@swede58

there is a subtle but definitely noticeable difference as i heard them ... non i sounds leaner through lower register of piano and male voice... mostly in the midbass/upper bass is the impression i get -- both are limited in true bottom octave - but the i has more ’bloom’ around bowed or plucked acoustic bass for instance

but not so much that amp choice, sub support and placement cannot bridge the tonal gap between the two i believe

@arafiq

knowing you through this forum, i would definitely start with 1.7i over 3.7i you can always go to 3.7i later if you fall in love with what maggies do -- 1.7i much less expensive, less imposing in the room, and if you get light colored cloth they are quite ’architectural’ and some think even pretty standing there - 1.7i set up right driven right will definitely give you the true maggie excellence and sonic experience from which to assess next steps (if any) - but be sure to have at least one rel sub to support the bottom end

sorry but i snorted my morning coffee through my nose... laughed so hard at the earlier post

omg -- we idiots have all been listening to complete crap before dannie richie came along, and made all walks of speakers listenable -- no doubt that jim winey and wendell diller have been lost souls with cotton balls in their ears for 40+ years - if they only had mister speaker savior danny r as a childhood mentor 🤣😂😁

i had to get that lick in... no offense to @bdp24 -- but this danny richie stuff gets me going... so never mind me, back to your regular programming...

 

@bdp24

i sure did watch that d-r video, as well as others... thank you

i wonder what danny could do with a set of eminent's in his hands!!??  😂

as a public service, let me post here what is stated at the magnepan website... in their faq section

it is always good to know what the manufacturer of the speaker says about how to use it how to drive it...  you can choose to debate or ignore the advice, but it is useful to know what they say, given they have a stake in users enjoying the speaker

 

WHAT IS THE BEST AMPLIFIER FOR MAGNEPLANARS?

We have a very small staff and none of us have the time to test amplifiers. But, we have decades of experience with a class of amplifiers that work well with Magneplanars.

The short answer is direct-coupled, Class A/B designs with high current capability. But to learn more, you’ll need to read further.

First, let’s address a misconception: The more expensive Maggies require better amplifiers.

It is true that most customers use better electronics on our more expensive models. But technically, it is not because the more expensive models are more demanding on the amplifier. The loads and efficiencies are very similar. Typically, the customer has a larger budget for amplifiers and, of course, the speakers respond with better sound.

Some individuals assume we won’t make product or amplifier recommendations for "political" reasons. Not true. We CAN’T make specific recommendations because WE DON’T KNOW. It is too much work to keep up with changing models and the vast number of products. As it is, our small staff is not getting all of our work done. However, the following guidelines will be helpful. Class A/B amplifier designs that come close to doubling power at 4 ohms have a long and successful track record.

The most common question is about the amount of recommended power for Magneplanars, but, first, it is important to understand the role of current and the power supply. High current and the capability of the power supply is a good indicator of the QUALITY of the amplifier. The amount of power you will need is a matter of QUANTITY. High current and total power are two separate issues. The ratio of the power at 8 ohms and 4 ohms defines the quality of the sound probably more than any other aspect of the sonic performance. Typically, if the engineers got this right, they probably did a good job in other areas of the design.

The power supply is "what separates the men from the boys." A receiver is very efficient and cost-effective way to get is all in one package, but there are "issues". Unfortunately, consumers want all the "bells and whistles" without understanding the importance of power supply. Many manufacturers offer the "bells and whistles", but, compromise the power supply to be price competitive. There are a few manufacturers that are the exception.

Everyone understands they need plenty of power, but the role of power supply is not understood. There is one important concept you need to understand when shopping for an amplifier or receiver: and it is somewhat like understanding "good" and "bad" cholesterol. The ratio is very important. An Gold Standard for an amplifier would be to double the power at 4 ohms. This concept is important even if you are buying an 8 ohm speaker. If the amplifier is rated at 80 watts at 8 ohms, it should (ideally) produce 160 watts at 4 ohms (or close to it). None of the receivers will do that. However, this is the benchmark of a good amplifier design. A 10 watt amplifier that produces 20 watts at 4 ohms "speaks volumes" about the PHILOSOPHY of the designer. (But, of course, it does not tell you if a 10 watt amplifier is enough for your room.) In the final analysis, buy an amplifier that comes as close to doubling the power at 4 ohms as your budget will allow.

A good receiver might produce 30-40% more power at 4 ohms. Most receiver manufacturers don’t want to talk about 4 ohm ratings because they have cut the "guts" out of their products to keep the cost down. Some receivers produce the same power at 4 ohms as the 8 ohm ratings. Or they use a switch on the back for 4 ohms to reduce the power and to prevent the receiver from self destructing. Others warn against 4 ohm speakers and will only offer a 6 ohm power rating. Regardless of what speaker you buy, we don’t recommend any of these receivers. There are a few manufacturers making receivers with good 4 ohm capability. But, we can’t keep up with who’s doing what. All you have to remember is to ask: "What is the 4 ohm power rating?" If the 4 ohm rating isn’t available, find another model or brand. It may take some digging to find the 4 ohm rating, but there are a number of receivers on the market that are rated for 4 ohms. For example, the THX rating requires that the amplifier section must be able to drive 4 ohms continuously. Even an inexpensive receiver like the 50 watt NAD C725 BEE (suggested retail of $799) is advertised to be stable with impedances down to 1 ohm and has peak power of 200 watts. So, don’t be fooled by pretty front panels. Its what is on the inside that counts.

A new type of amplifier (Class D) has become more popular because it is a "green" design and uses less power plus it is smaller in size compared to conventional amplifier designs. We have heard reports of Class D amplifiers shutting down when driving 4 ohm loads or sound quality that is less-than-desirable. Quite frankly, some sound very poor on Maggies. However, more recent designs of high-end models are much better. Because we do not have the time to determine which models of Class D designs are compatible with Maggies, we must take a conservative approach. Direct-coupled, Class A/B designs with high current capability have proven a good choice for many decades.

HOW MUCH POWER DO I NEED?

We are asked this question every single day. We wish that we could be of more help, but individual tastes vary. If someone tells you that you need an amplifier with ___ watts, how can they be so sure if they are not listening with you in your room?

You can get a lot of free advice in the chat rooms on the internet. Most of it is of very little value (or misleading). Often, their power recommendations are influenced by their listening habits and room conditions. If they have a strong opinion of what you need for power, take it with a grain of salt.

Personal tastes are "all over the map". We hear of customers that are perfectly happy with 50 watts and others using 1000 watts. Without the option of listening with you, we have no way to give meaningful advice. The most reliable way to answer this question for your particular needs is by visiting a dealer or arranging to hear a pair of Magneplanars. If you listen to your music at your normal volume, in a room that is approximately the same size as your room, with an amplifier similar to what you plan to use, an accurate power requirement can be determined for your listening habits. This is a lot to ask, but it is the only reliable method of determining the power needs for a specific individual.

There is a persistent impression that the larger Maggies require more power. It is true that most customers with the more expensive models have more powerful amplifiers. But, the popular assumption is not correct. They typically have a larger budget. If and when you upgrade your electronics is a separate decision.

did i stumble into a class d amp thread? 😁🤣

we should take statements wendell/magnepan make at face value, even if somewhat dated

- they don’t have time to listen to everything

- class d used to sound bad, now they are better...so if you wanna try, go for it...

- but their reference has been and continues to be top flight, strong class ab... hard to argue with this, this is a highly successful enduring company with legions of happy customers, thus there is a rich and relevant experience base to draw upon

happiness comes in many flavors, some people like to try new stuff, hear new gear at the bleeding edge, others prefer stuff that they know will work well, be done, know they have the right stuff 

@arafiq

if your class d amp sounds good with other speakers you have owned and liked, chances are that they will do just fine with maggies

as you know i have a set of agd audions, after trying many other class d amps i did not enjoy, and the agd’s do very well with my 1.7i’s as well as 3.7i’s...

@mesch enjoy your maggies!! do you have subs? iirc you are coming from klipsches, yes? i cannot think of a more different musical presentation, as special as both are have fun!

@mesch

ahh yes tannoys, not klipsches...😁

please try a rel sub (or better, a pair) when you have a chance with the lil maggies -- i think you will love it

for little maggies (or even large ones) it is in my experience quite transformative of the listening experience!

 

@arafiq

my memory is failing me a bit, not recalling if you are in texas, or are an east coaster (nc?)

there are a couple nice used pair of maggies, in texas, available for local pickup... 1.7i as well as lrs ... on the ’other’ used gear site 

if you are close, they could work well for you! 🍺

 

i would say that in my experience, once you get to 1.7i and above, alot of the sound quality depends on how the speaker loads the room (and how loud one wants to listen)... i still have both the 1.7i and 3.7i and the size of the panels load my room very differently (17x22 well treated dedicated room) and i would imagine going to even bigger panels of the 20.7 and 30.7 would definitely be too much of a good thing... in fact i feel the 3.7i in my room can already overload the room in the midbass if i am not careful and i need to get the placement just right (and employ dsp control) to make them sound just right

there are those who have said that 3.7i has the true ribbon tweeter over the 1.7i quasi ribbon unit... i think both have absolutely outstanding treble, with the 3.7i having more treble energy - but i do not think the 3.7i resolves noticeably better than 1.7i

@yyzsantabarbara 

did you still keep your benchmark ahb2's?  they should do well with the lil maggies in your room!

when a product/brand has sooo much market presence and success, such legions of owners across generations who love the performance, there are bound to be some that don’t get it

nature of the beast --- unanimity of opinion and preference is simply unachievable in this field

we all hear differently, we value different sonic traits, expectations can affect what we perceive as well (i have been to so many highly touted gourmet restaurants with expectations so heightened it become impossible to be ’pleasantly surprised’ ... or maybe the demo(s) are/were simply faulty in some significant respect