I too have participated in DG recordings and concur with terraplane8bob’s accounts of DG micing technique; multi-micing galore and placement way too close up to be able to capture a realistic sense of instrumental timbre and texture was my experience. If I am not mistaken, at least one poster who considers DG’s string sound to be the best also considers Decca to be the worst. Precisely the opposite of what I hear. Go figure. For me, Decca/London recordings, in general, are among the most realistic sounding and DG among the worst. Kenneth Wilkinson recordings in particular can have stunning string sound.
the sound of massed violins in classical orchestral recordings
why do massed violins have this sort of gritty sandpapery reverberation in classical orchestral recordings?even in some sections of a piece, when the violins are playing softly in the background, you hear that gritty overtone more than the melody.when I listen to the Houston symphony in Jones Hall,sitting fourth row, facing the violin section, I don't hear that sound.I have three systems { two of them mid-fi ] and I hear the same thing-even with headphones.in all instances, the other parts of the orchestra are clear. my main system : Vanalistine Trancendence 10 tube preamp,a 35 year old solid state Proton D1200 amp, [have tried NAD,Project, Musical Fidelity amps--they don't sound any better],Onkyo dx7555 CD player [Stereophile class B],and Project Carbon turntable with Grado Black 2 cartridge [ the Ortophon Red was too bright ] through Magnepan MG12/QR speakers.Tried a highly regarded Elac speaker--no change as far as the violins go, but way inferior to those dramatic Maggies.So, there you have it. Is it the equipment? Is the state of the art not up to recording violins? Is it me? [its o.k.-I can take it}. In closing,a couple of years ago,I had phone conversation with a well known person associated with a major speaker company about this. His response :[ paraphrased ] Violins are a problem--don't like 'em. Any input will be appreciated. Thanks.
Showing 5 responses by frogman
**** a friend who played in the high school orchestra and he was next to the violin section. To this day, he can’t stand the sound of violins and massed strings **** Well, high school 😱......... Funny you should mention this. Just before the COVID shutdown, I attended my son’s HS band concert in which he played 1rst Clarinet. The sound of a HS clarinet section is something that is indescribable. |
**** harsh glare, a kind of steely sound **** Yes, but could also be described as “gritty, sandpapery”. Gritty and sandpapery is what I like to call a “soft grain”. Soft, because use of the term “grain” is usually associated with a harsh sound. I hear a soft grain, akin to what one sees when one gets very close to a picture in a newspaper....one can see the ink dots. The sonic image is not saturated enough. For me, good pure analog sound still fills in more of the dots that complete the sonic picture heard with live orchestral violins. |
What recordings have you listened to that cause this effect? Please tell us. I agree with the comments that the quality of the recording is key. I have heard what you describe, to one degree or another, from even the most thoughtfully put together audiophile systems... when the recording quality is not very good. Yes, massed violins are very demanding in both the recording and playback processes, but what you describe is an especially obvious problem with digital recordings, especially early digital recordings; whether on LP or digital media. You are a live concert goer, so you know of what you speak. If you don’t have this, buy it ($, sorry) and get back to us. Not Houston, but close enough? 😊 Glorious (correct) string sound. If you still hear what you describe above, there’s something going on with your equipment. https://store.acousticsounds.com/d/64100/Donald_Johanos-Rachmaninoff_Symphonic_Dances__Vocalise-45_R... Btw, the main reason that massed strings are so hard to record/reproduce is not so much “transient spikes” as it is the fact that the violin produces an extraordinarily complex wave form. One note from a violin contains over a dozen harmonics. Transient issues occur on the initial attack of a note. After the initial attack (initiation) of a note, the sound of a violin, even an entire section of violins, can be as you describe from your live experience...smooth, even silky smooth. A drawn bow across a violin string produces a continuous sound, not an interrupted one with multiple small transient attacks as has been suggested. Back to the issue of the complex waveform. It is difficult enough to record/reproduce a single musical wave form that is so complex. Consider that over half the instruments in an orchestra are string players and about half of those are violin players. Each one of those violins produces a somewhat different already very complex waveform due to the differences in the instruments themselves and the way that they are each played....all playing at the same time and often the same note. Is it any wonder? |