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The Emperor DAC has no Clothes

I currently use the Rega DAC in a system comprised of Merlin TSM-MXr speakers on Skylan stands. Amp is the Manley Stingray II tube amp. Oppo CD player and Mac Mini feeds the Rega DAC with Pure Music and Cardas cables. My friends system is currently using an ARC integrated with Vanderteen 5a's. He's had the W4S Dac II, EE Minimax Plus, ARC 8 DAC and is currently trying out another borrowed Rega because I won't loan him mine again!

In recent weeks we've tried these DACs in both systems, tweaked and tried various setups. I posted in another thread that the Rega won out against the Minimax Plus and the W4S 2 and that he was partial to the little Centrance.

So here's the thing. The Rega and the ARC sound pretty much the same. So does the W4S 2 and the Minimax. We STRUGGLE to hear the tiny differences between these units! And by "struggle" I mean we use top level recordings and LISTEN LIKE MANIACS again and again. 99% of the time we could not pick these units apart. 100% of the we find that we could be happy with ANY of them! Of course there was a preference for the Rega and the ARC, but boy was it slight! The smallest tweak could shift the balance. A different set of cables, speakers or higher ceiling could easily effect things.

Between the two of us we have something like 65 years of experience with audio. I find it absolutely hilarious when someone posts that a DAC sounds "much" better than another DAC. How is it that we can't hear the same thing, nor can ANY of our friends? We certainly hear a HUGE difference in speakers and amps and very audible ones with cables. But GOOD stand-alone DACs appear to be doing a very good job. MOST people simply list the one or two they've heard in stores as their favorites. If you're looking for a "safe bet" in a DAC you can go with ANY of the models I mentioned above or some of the other fine units out there. Unless someone has your exact system, in the same room and your precise tastes, try not to worry overmuch about DAC A blowing away DAC B.

This was most apparent in trying out the EE Minimax Plus. He tried various tubes and it always sounded best in SS mode! And in that mode it sounded quite like all of the others and about as good as the much less expensive Centrance. So the point of this is to put your efforts and money into speakers and amp/pre. That's 95% of the type of sound you'll get. They determine the character of the system more than anything else.

Cheers!

Rob
robbob

Showing 5 responses by sibelius

sibelius
256 posts
 
My DAC rules:

1) Almost all DAC's have to choose between a few main chipsets. Right now, Wolfson and Sabre tend to be two of the more popular ones. Find out if you tend to prefer one particular chipset over another.

2) Don't spend megabucks on DAC's. We are talking about technology that churns quickly. I view my DAC like I view my laptop.

3) Try and find a DAC that is flexible regarding tweaking.

I bought the EE Minimax Plus because I prefer the Sabre chip to the Wolfson, the price is affordable ($1100) and the EE DAC allows a good deal of tweaking (SS or tube mode, easy Opamp changes). I fully expect that I will probably purchase a new DAC in a 2-3 year time period.
sibelius
256 posts
 
"one more thing, regarding the minimax sounding better in solid state mode.

no one says in what respects the sss mode sounds better. "

Mr. Tennis - In my system, the SS mode came across as having more detail and resolution. Tube mode came across a bit muddied or veiled in comparison. This is with the stock tube. Hope that helps.
sibelius
256 posts
 
Rob - agree with you. I was fully expecting to prefer tube mode, but ss mode just adds more to my system. The added detail and resolution is welcome, especially without the listener fatigue I tend to equate with SS gear. Having tube preamplifier and amp probably helps in that regard. For whatever reason, the tube mode just does not blend in well with my system. As you mentioned, tube mode may work very well in revealing SS system where the goal is to add some warmth at the source. As usual, there are no absolutes and individual system synergy tells the tale.
sibelius
256 posts
 
"more detail and resolution, does not intrinsically denote that the sound is better.

but i appreciate that someone has indicated a reason for preferring the solid state path.

i think that the availability of a tube circuit provides the opportunity to vary the sound of the unit."

Agree with you that more detail and resolution may not be wanted for all systems. I also appreciate the option of both SS and tube modes. In fact, I have ordered a NOS Mullard 12au7 to see if my impression of tube mode changes with a different tube. Regardless, I think the very fact the DAC + offers so much in the way of sonic tweaking is a big advantage in my book.
sibelius
256 posts
 
My experience has also been that the impact of a tube in a CD player or DAC is rather minimal. However, I've heard several people state their preference for EE DAC + tube stage after changing out the stock tube. I've ordered a NOS Mullard to replace the EH. Will see how that goes.
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