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The best tweeter is no tweeter

In a recent review in Stereophile for the Elac Carina over an AMT based speaker (I’m a fan of AMTs by the way) the author, Herb Reichert, makes this statement:

My personal experience suggests that the overall sound of any loudspeaker is greatly determined by the designer’s choice of tweeter.


and then he goes on to list some speakers with AMTs, some of which I like, some of which I hate, which he feels share the same qualities. And it got me thinking about something as I hook up my home theater again. In my mind, the very best tweeters are completely invisible and transparent. I do not suggest you should use a single-driver, full ranger with a whizzer, heavens no. That’s just wrong (grin) and a clear cry for help.


What I am suggesting is that in the very best tweeters in the world, of which some are AMTs, and many are not, you simply cannot tell what they are.


That is, they are absolutely transparent. You do not perceive sound emanating from them at all. Music is just there, in front of you. Some of these are ring radiators that are really reasonably priced. Some are German or Spanish AMTs, some are diamond or Be tweeters.


In fact, my home theater has both ring radiators and AMTs in them, both of which may be found among the most prestigious brands of speakers. Though they have entirely different operating principles and materials, their performance is absolutely seamless. I barely use EQ except for the sub and center due to the latter’s location on a shelf. What both of these tweeters share is incredibly smooth output (unlike crappy AMTs or Be tweets) that is flat to beyond 20 kHz.


Please, buy what you like, but to me, if you want to talk about a world class driver, it’s not one you can sit in front of and say "aha! I know this is an Aluminum/Be/Diamond/AMT tweeter!!"


If you can tell the type of tweeter you are listening to, I can assure you it is not among the best in the world.
erik_squires

Showing 6 responses by mozartfan

mozartfan
2,143 posts
 
If you can tell the type of tweeter you are listening to, I can assure you it is not among the best in the world.
erik_squires
I finannly  understand what Erik is trying to get across. 
All tweeters suck.
I concur after extensive experimentation past few months. I hate all dome tweeters, Now I did purchase a AMT, as per Erik
I hate it. 
Its not efficient, sounds like a  tinny cheap piece of junk./
Now as  for tweeters.
My 1963 made in the USA Magnovox horn tweeter, = best in the world. 
However just as good/better is the 
Full range/Point source drivers comming out of Germany.
a  FR/PS  is the finest tweeter in the world. Other than of course the pricey FC from Japan/Germany.
Ribbons, AMT.Domes all junk , trash as far as I'm concerned. 
Horns or FR/PS, Nothing superior. 
Full Range out of china are all junk, trash. Garbage. The sens is too low and distortion  levels  do have fatigue, Cheap,  but really not worth the money. 
mozartfan
2,143 posts
 

kw6596 posts02-23-2020 9:18pmI am listening to the Monitor Audio Gold 100 5g in my second system. Very natural and musical 👌
~~~ At least this is your limited exp. 
Wait til you hear a  true FR, 
Then you can say like Jimi Hendrix,, 
*Have you ever been experierienced??
WEll I have*
mozartfan
2,143 posts
 

prof2,764 posts02-24-2020 7:55amTo me the vast majority of speakers sound like a compilation of drivers, and artificial in that way.

An exception has been my Thiel 3.7 and 2.7 speakers.  They are as perfectly coherent as I’ve ever heard in the mids and highs.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Next to a  good quality FR/PS, all speakers in mids/highs will not stand up to a shoot out,
Including your beloved Thiel's. 
Yeah yeah, I know, *My  Thiels are wonderful....**
Once you get a  FR/PS in your system, then the Thiels weakness will be fully exposed. 
Everyone here should get at least 1 chinese FR just for testing purposes only,. Then you will understand why I am a  totaly fan-atic over high sens drivers. 
make ita  DL FR, sure its $400/pair, you can dump it on ebay at half price. Now you will have your 1st experience in FR. Perhaps audio shows will start back in 2022, and there you can actually hear a  true FR , AER and Vox. 
Waiting line to get in the room.  You will have to listen from outside  in the hallway. 
mozartfan
2,143 posts
 
Ebay, $75/pair
xover a 2.2 cap.
trust me thats was quite enough.
I ’m going FR for mids./highs.
The Magnoxov 1963 horn tweeter is a hidden gem. Best tweeter as far as i;’m concerned.
USA engineers really put attention into that horn. btw its Phenolic cone which Richard Gray says is the best dome for horns, = More musical vs Titanium.

Erik I am very surprised you have not come around to FR/PS drivers as yet> whats up with that?
I thought you were in search for the worlds best sounding speakers??
mozartfan
2,143 posts
 
I do not suggest you should use a single-driver, full ranger with a whizzer, heavens no. That’s just wrong (grin) and a clear cry for help.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Look In late Oct / RMAF there will be a  room with Vox and AER,
Go listen with a  UNBIASED ear, to the highs in these 2 speakers,
Then come back and report.
The older models with whizzers may  have issues reproducing highs. 
The new models represent a  new development.
AMT's would never work for me, Sure it was a  random pot shot buying some cheapies on ebay, but they give me a idea of what to expect from that  design. 
Just go to the RMAF, and report back on the FR/PS speakers in the high fq's. 
Jere is one FC from 1929,, which to my ears, has incredible soundstage ~~presence~~ at least in the mids. 
EDIT  upon 3rd listen 
 Plase Include the highs as STUNNING , natural , super high fidelity, This is ~~1929~~ mind you.  
Blows away most speakers I've heard over the years, 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qrqv5nOjLuw


mozartfan
2,143 posts
 
If you can tell the type of tweeter you are listening to, I can assure you it is not among the best in the world.
erik_squires
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 
maybe not rthe very best in the world, But this KASUN 3.5 inch paper cone double magnet, sure comes darn close to worlds finest.
Sure beats out the Legendary Seas Millennium, and a  Vifa Clone Neo tweeter anda  1963 Magnovox tweeter horn, and , and and.
I had it sitting on my shelf,,,hummm , one more shot,,
WOW factor high.
and get this made in china but is in facta  TRUE 91db if not higher. 
= Not lying.

My tech geek LOVES his paper tweeters in his Radio Shak 7B speakers, , These KASUN are even better.

I had to make a long search for these guys, 
So you are benifiting from hours and hours and hours of reaserch to find this Kasun. 
Thought I;'d  pass it on. 
and yes the ONLY dealers are on ALIEXPRESS, ships super fast.
Easy ck out.

There are more than 1 sellers.
 Here is one.

https://www.aliexpress.com/i/32828214587.html


now aftera few pair are SOLD, you watch the price climb $10+. 
You just watch. I know how Ali works. 
These hidden gems are worth their weight in gold.
If I did not post, you'd never in a  million years find this rare tweeter. 
Only on AUDIOGON. Worlds best all things high fidelity forum. 
The Hifi guy
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