The Audio Research Reference 10 is here $30k

Mitch, I'm a big ARC fan. But let me help out with a little perspective. I used to own the Ref 3 and I liked it a lot. But upgrade fever kicked in and ARC ballyhooed (sp?) the new revolutionary Ref 5 as being in a different league than the Ref 3.

I picked up a used Ref 5 for a good price. In my humble opinion, my reaction is it's a little drier than the Ref 3. Maybe bass is a touch tighter. But are we talking "different league" or change measured in "tweaks"? I think the later.

I used to own the PH-7 phono pre too. ARC came out with the PH-8 which was "cut out of the same sonic cloth" as the Ref Phono 2. For the life of me, I'm not getting it.

Ok, last chance. Perhaps foolishly, my Ref 5 is scheduled for the factory SE upgrade at the end of the month. I've read comments that say it will take the Ref 5 to 85+% the way to the Ref Anniversary. We'll see.

I'll report back after the upgrade breaks in. In the meantime, hold your dough. I predict the Ref 3 will be a classic for years to come.

Pops, if you can pick up a used PH-7, I think you will be quite happy. I spent serious bucks to move up to the PH-8. I am not convinced the PH-8 is leagues better than the PH-7. I'm not even sure the PH-8 is even better than the PH-7 -- yikes, heresy!

Ralph (Atmasphere), I wonder if the 90 day policy is the result of new ownership? Seems to me that a well thought out product takes time to design, test and roll-out. And a really good product should have staying power with a long shelf life.

For example, my amp, the VS-115, has been in the current line-up since 08 or 09. It's time may be up soon. As an fyi, some dealers and ARC fans previously commented that the VS-115 was nipping at the heals of the "old" Ref 110. I think I'll stick to the VS-115 for a while longer. It's a great amp - a real workhorse.

I also own the Ref CD-8 which was also released in 08 or 09. Just got discontinued for the Ref CD-9, which costs $16K. The CD-9 has flexible input capabilities that I don't care about. I think the DAC may be the same as the CD-8, except ARC told me that its upsampling algorithm is greatly improved and the sound is in "another league" compared to the CD-8. I'm sticking to the CD-8 for now.

As I mentioned above, I'm gonna do the Ref 5 SE upgrade later this month. No surprise, it's also in "another league" compared to the old Ref 5, may 85+% of the Ref 40.

Boy oh boy, I'm concerned that ARC may run out of leagues.

After I waste my dough on the SE upgrade, I'm gonna refocus on buying new CDs and LPs. Maybe a new carty too. Time to start listening to the music again and not the gear.