You have to be kidding Glory 6K? that is a great price from their retail of 17k I believe. This was suppose to be the "it" of OTL amps and among the best period from what I've read and heard, Jtinn was a dealer and major proponent of this amp. I do trust your ears Jonathan. I only heard them once at a show with Pipedream speakers so have no opinion in anything familiar. I certainly would listen first before unloading and if you decide you really love them.....you might want to consider some kind of ventilation system but it seems from looking at your set-up with the staircase directly behind the speakers that it might be a bit of a challenge. |
Hi Glory
Is the problem the amp or the heat? My guess is the latter. Whatta ya gone ta do? I also live in Florida and can absolutely relate. So far as the seller and what he told you, Cavaet Emptor, you know the rest. The question is are you happy with this amp in your system? you haven't said. I am curious though, for my own personal information, is the Tenor really better than the Atma-sphere in your opinion and how might you describe the differences? |
One other thing Glory fyi. If you can't make the Tenors work for any reason there is another OTL amp option. I recently read on a thread a response from a dealer of these speakers, Audiofeil that the Berning zh270 was one of the best he heard with these speakers brought into is store by an owner auditioning. Unfortunately this amp is no longer made and they are becoming more difficult to come by on the used market as most who own don't want to give them up, yours truly included. However they do have a 30 watt zh230 that is supposedly more refined at less power. Unfortunately the jump in price was quite a bit over the zh270, in the 8k range I believe. Advantages wide bandwidth performance, low heat, extremely low noise, it uses an advanced switching power supply, long tube life, self biasing, OTL clarity and transparency as it uses an impedance converter but no output transformer the best bass control I have heard on any tube amplifier in my experience. I am not in any way affiliated but since you live in Florida you are most certainly invited to my place (Rockledge near Cocoa Beach) for a listen to decide for yourself if it might be an option IF you can't make the Tenors work for any reason. Good luck!
PS The Berning is a no nonsense design if you consider aesthetics important. It will not compete with the beautiful Tenors as it is very simple and unassuming on the outside no exposed tubes which can be an advantage in a smaller space. The advantages are all in the brilliant design by one of the most brilliant amplifier designers in the industry. |
So far as the zh270 going up in price 10 fold, i'm not too sure about that Lewm. I wasn't aware that they were ever 2500.00 when they were first introduced but if that was the case I can't imagine Berning doing anything but breaking even if one is to consider that the amps took him 30 hours to assemble. The wiring for the impedance converter alone must be done manually and I can only imagine how tedious that task alone is. Yes indeed, at 2.5K it must be one of the greatest values ever in audio. at its final price with all the modifications I believe it listed at 5.5K
There were some substantial improvements, at least in my experience with several of the mods that improved the amp's performance no less than a wiring change and a few input caps along with some other lesser changes including cryoed outputs. The total net gain was significant. While I have done a direct AB to a Joule VZN80 in my system many years back the Joule clearly was harmonically richer with greater density where as the Berning was somewhat leaner. This was before I performed any of the mods and tweeks including much experimentation with vibration isolation. Sure would love to do an AB with the Atma-sphere in my set-up, I have always been curious all these years. I can imagine your system, great choices! |
"I would rather listen to this amp one hour and turn it off for the sake of heat in the summer than listen all night to a lesser sounding amp."
Enjoy your amp Glory. I hope you find a solution to the heat from those big 6C33C outputs, keep us posted, love to hear your system! |
"Looking a little deeper at Tenor back then this goes to show you the company they kept at consumer shows and dealer show rooms with the likes of Pipedreams and Karma. Marketing know how of high dollar crap aimed at the gullible with deep pockets, and it works well."
Your comments are interesting Blackburn. At that same show I heard the Lamms matched with the Kharma 2-way, 3.2 I believe? In any case I found that set-up among the best at the show. I was quite taken by the Lamm amps and now completely understand the buzz on that amp. The Pipedream/Tenor set-up was in a large room and in my experience under show conditions it is much more difficult to make a large speaker come together in such a short period of time. While the sound certainly wasn't bad it wasn't magical either. In any case it was quite easy to recognize the transparency and musicality of the Tenor amps, the speakers seemed to be the issue. |
Clio09 I don't mean to rain on the parade concerning Trancendent amps, I owned the T-8 prior to the Berning, great amp btw, but to paraphrase Senator Lloyd Benson to Dan Quale during their debate for VP in '88, "Mr. Trancendent you're no Mr. Tenor. In any case Glory, the Trancendent is a great product but I doubt it comes anything close to what you have been listening to the past few days. The Berning is a step above the Transcendent in all parameters or I wouldn't have switched. The issue with the Tenor is dealing with the heat only. I doubt there are any other issues in question based on your observations. The Trancendent is Class AB vs. Class A operation of the Tenor therefore less heat and of course the sonic compromises but it still runs warm, more than the Berning. |
One point about the Trancendent that does bear consideration is that it is a quite inexpensive for its performance. I am not sure what the current pricing is but you DO get a lot for your money. In retrospect, it is unfair comparing a higher priced component that performs at the highest level to one that is really an overachiever at its price point. The T8, a 25 watt stereo amp, idles at 300 watts, not sure how hot it gets when playing but is more than enough juice for those Zu speakers. The Berning idles at 100 watts and maxes out at 300 watts full power, cooler than virtually all tube amps let alone the Class A OTL variety. |
Glory, I am glad this seems to be working out for you. On a further note it seems like these amplifiers throw off new levels of heat considering the power rating, 720 watts per amp!!! I'm not sure this is at full power or just when you turn them on, it wasn't clear but the venting through the fireplace chimney seems like a great solution. The outputs on these babies must be biased REALLY high which might be a big contributor to what you are hearing. I can't imagine what your energy cost might be adding a/c costs to compensate for the heat generated. I know the VZN80 was in the 700 watt range but it is stereo. I was listening in February when the weather is cooler and it REALLY warmed up the room in short time. Ventilation seems the only real practical option, enjoy! |
Ralph out of curiosity, why is this amp putting out so much heat, 720 watts per monoblock? This seems quite high based on the number of output tubes at least compared to the Joule which uses this tube as well. |
