Just a quick update for anyone who may be interested. I ordered the Double Impacts exactly two weeks ago today in charcoal gray with the upgrade package, and they shipped yesterday and will arrive on Monday. Needless to say, I am delighted with the turnaround time.
In the next few weeks--once I get 50-100 hours or so on the DI speakers--I will be comparing them with my reference speakers, the justly celebrated Daedalus Ulysses speakers. Should be lots of fun, and I will report back with some impressions when I am able to form some.
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Thanks, guys. I think it will be an interesting contrast. I certainly agree that the Daedalus are special, and I could (and may) certainly live with them the rest of my days.
On the other hand, I am intrigued by the Double Impacts and feel that it is worth the gamble to give them a shot. Speaker preference, like most things in audio, is enormously subjective, so who knows how this might come out? One thing for sure, if the DI speakers are not as musical and enjoyable as the Ulysses, I will not be keeping them. But I am willing to take the gamble and find out.
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Thanks again, guys. I am looking forward to the comparison. Though I understand from many of you that the Tektons sound good right out of the box, my experience with new speakers is that they take anywhere from 50-100 hours--or even more--to fully open up and sound their best. Therefore, I am expecting this to be a process, rather than an "event," which is fine by me.
@david_ten I would say the Daedalus are the favorites by a field goal, but the Tektons are young, up and coming, and have big play potential, so an upset is certainly a possibility.
@mac48025 I have never heard those Legacy speakers, but I know they are highly regarded, as are some of other speakers the DI have replaced in other systems. That gives me hope that they will hold their own with the Daedalus.
@lancelock With the upgrade package, a new pair of Double Impacts is $3375 delivered. So the difference is $375, which is not necessarily insignificant, but is reasonable enough that I thought it was worth it. Audiophile Nervosa being what it is, I didn't want to get, like, and keep the speakers, only to experience that niggling feeling six or eight months from now that I might be missing that extra few degrees of refinement or impact--if I had only gotten the upgrade. Also, I want to hear the DI at their absolute best against my Daedalus.
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Yes, there is more discussion of the 508 over at Audio shark, as Charles stated. In fact, some of the folks there actually heard the 508 compared to both the 518 and 219 and posted some very interesting impressions. It is an informative and insightful discussion. I've had mine several months now and don't think I could love it any more. I think Wig loves his just as much, and we have both enjoyed quite a few awesome amps in our systems over the years, for whatever that may be worth to you. The 508 is built like a tank and sounds magical, especially with upgraded tubes. I love the looks of it, too. I would imagine any of those three LM amps would sound fantastic with the Double Impacts, speaking of which--mine arrived today, two days ahead of schedule!
I have them installed now and have been listening for less than an hour, so I will reserve judgment for a bit. I do like what I am hearing so far.--honestly, I am shocked by how good they sound right out of the box. I will need to play around with placement some and get at least 40-50 hours on them before saying too much. When I get to 100 hours, I will put the Ulysses back in and then we will see what's what. This is going to be a LOT of fun. The DI are clearly very impressive speakers. This going to be some tussle between two great sets of speakers!
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Corelli, et al--
They are sounding terrific. I just finished up the last week of a particularly grueling semester (I'm a college English teacher), so my listening time this week has been somewhat limited. I probably have somewhere between 20-30 hours on them. Last night it was easy to tell that the bass has both deepened and tightened, and the sound overall has opened up. I was impressed immediately with how dynamic the DI are, and impressed especially with the sound stage and imaging. From the start, it was very easy to "find" the instruments in their correct places on the stage. I felt initially that maybe the upper frequencies were just a touch veiled compared to my Ulysses speakers and that the DI might not be quite as "musical," but I did not have that same impression in last night's listening session, which was glorious.
My plan is to put another 40 hours or so on the DI and then do a fairly intensive A/B comparison with the Ulysses. One thing is certain--the DI are just as amazing as all of you have said they are, and they can hold their own with anything I've had or heard.
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Charles, when the family is around, I generally listen at a moderate level, which barely moves the needle on the meter on my 508 at all. When they are out, I will let it rip, but this amp and these speakers excel at any listening level, which I have not always found to be the case with other amps and speakers. One thing is for sure--the 508ia will drive the DI speakers with a ton of headroom to spare. Some might even call it overkill, but the sound is so beguiling and so great with all types of music, I would call it a great match. If all goes well, this week will be telling as I finally have some time and opportunity for some extended listening sessions.
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Greetings, all.
I have now had the Double Impacts for a couple of weeks and have between 50-60 hours on them. Speaking of Line Magnetic amps, I am driving my DIs with the 508ia integrated and can report without reservations that it is a spectacular match. At 48 watts, this thing is a powerhouse, which can really come in handy on some kinds of music or for some listening tastes, but it lacks nothing in finesse and musicality played at lower volumes. Just phenomenal with all kinds of music, which is also how I would describe the Double Impacts!
I have not yet put back in my Daedalus speakers for a direct comparison, though I have used them for so long that I do have some impressions of some key differences between the speakers (as well as some similarities) that only need to be confirmed by putting them back in. Should make for an interesting weekend.
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Thanks, Kenny. I am indeed having a blast with these speakers. I have had audiophile speakers that sounded great with audiophile music, but completely inadequate with good old fashioned rock and roll music and other "mortal" recordings. Now, the Daedalus speakers are dynamic and can rock, but I do not believe that they have the grunt, pressurize the room, or convey quite the "impact" of the Double Impacts. I never quite felt like I HAD to have a sub with the Ulysses, but now that I have had the Double Impacts for a couple of weeks, I can see--no, I can FEEL--what I have been missing.
There are other areas that await a more intensive comparison, but it is fair to say that I am duly impressed with these speakers and applaud Eric Alexander for creating them, and teajay and others here for bringing them to our attention.
I will post more impressions later in the week when I have swapped them out.
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Hi Charles, et al.
Well, nothing is ever easy in audio, is it? I have been spending quite a bit of time comparing the Daedalus and Tekton speakers, and my feelings have sort of evolved, I guess. When I first put back in the Daedalus speakers after two solid weeks of listening through the Double Impacts, my immediate impression was that the Ulysses sounded slightly "purer" and slightly more coherent. The bass wasn't as deep, but felt a little tighter and more focused. On the other hand, the DI speakers were, overall, more immersive and certainly easier to drive, though the Ulysses are also very efficient. If I had been forced to make a decision in the moment, I met have kept the Ulysses.
A couple of days later, I put back in the Double Impacts and found that I had really been missing their incredible sound stage and dynamics. Over the next several days, I perceived improvements in coherence and the bass, which seemed to gain depth and focus as they surpassed a hundred hours or so.
I put the Ulysses back in again, and this time the differences I perceived earlier were not as pronounced. Maybe the Ulysses were still just a touch more coherent with a tad more clarity in sorting out difficult passages, but we are talking a matter of degrees here. This time, I found that I was missing the DI's presentation and that the Ulysses might sound just a little boxy, by comparison.
One of my biggest fears is that despite all of DI's obvious strengths, they might not be quite as musical as the Ulysses over the long haul. That is one reason I have taken my sweet time doing this evaluation---I need to make sure I get this right before selling off the greatest pair of speakers I have ever owned. Indeed, the Ulysses are magical speakers, as beautiful to look at as to listen through.
The DI cannot match the Ulysses in the looks department, that is for sure, nor should they be expected to at their respective price points. But are they as musical? My conclusion is that they certainly are, and I don't think they are done breaking in completely yet. I still think there are certain areas where the Ulysses might hold a slight advantage, but there are also areas where the DI speakers have an advantage.
In summary, this has been quite a battle between two great speakers. As always, it is going to come down to the listener's sonic priorities and preferences, as well as whether appearance is a huge factor, which is not to say the DI speakers are unattractive--we are talking relative to the furniture quality Daedalus speakers here.
I am going to do one more intensive comparison in a few days, but these are my thoughts so far. It has been challenging trying to sort all of this out, but a lot of fun as well. Barring some eleventh hour epiphany, the Double Impacts are here to stay. They are just as terrific as everybody else here says they are, at least in my view and for my tastes.
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Thanks for all the kind comments, folks, and I appreciate in particular the nice remarks from Charles and Al, two longtime members here for whom I have the utmost respect. It is also great hearing from fellow Double Impact enthusiasts, a couple of whom put me on this trail to start with. And thanks to teajay for his outstanding, spot-on review.
As for the question about amps I have known and loved prior to the LM 508ia, yes, there have been a few solid state amps along the way, a couple in particular that I really enjoyed. I was very fond of a Plinius SA-102 that I had several years ago, which I can easily imagine sounding great with the DI speakers. I also once owned TRL Samson monoblocks designed by the late and much missed Paul Weitzel, which I ran along with his Dude preamplifier. They were also very fine sounding amps. I took them to a friend's house to compare directly with some very expensive Pass Labs monoblocks--I believe they were 160.5s--and I thought the Samsons were within the thinnest sliver of being as good as the mighty Pass (both were driving another pair of Ulysses speakers). I also had a couple of years with a Devialet amp that, while very clean and powerful, just did not engage me on a musical level. It was "impressive" and a technological marvel in terms of its versatility and power, but I found myself listening to music less and less when I had it.
The bottom line is that Charles is right. None of these amps have engaged me on a visceral level like the best tube amps I have owned, especially the VAC Renaissance 70/70 and now the Line Magnetic 508ia. For years I split the difference, running several different tube preamps with my solid state amps, because prior to the Ulysses, I had speakers that were not as efficient and I thought I needed solid state amps to drive them properly. I had several pleasing combinations, but was never completely satisfied, which is why I kept trying new preamps, believing that the next one might be the last one.
When I bought the Ulysses, with its much more amp-friendly efficiency rating, I couldn't wait to try a tube amp, and when I finally bought the VAC amp, I found what I had been missing. Pure bliss. I think the LM 508 integrated might be just as good, perhaps even better in some parameters (although I have yet to hear any amp surpass VAC's magical midrange).
As so many of you have already noted, one of the great attributes of the DI speakers is that you can drive them with just about anything. For sure, the 508 drives them beautifully. It has finesse and that tube magic--especially if you roll the 300Bs and 6SN7 tubes--and it can also rattle the china in your cabinet and the fillings in your teeth, if you're in the mood to "entertain" the neighbors. It sounds great at low volumes and great at high volumes. For me, a great tube amp just has that "breath of life" that keeps me up way too late listening to music.
Chris
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Welcome to this growing and cheerful gathering, Bill M, and congratulations on your order of the Double Impacts. Glad to hear that you are also considering the LM 508ia integrated, which I am enjoying so much that I have not been the least bit tempted to try a preamp with it. I think you'll find it is very good with the stock tubes, but shockingly good once you roll in the tubes to suit your listening preferences.
In my unit, I am using EML XLS 300B tubes, which are not exactly cheap, but are built to last and sound phenomenal in the 508. I replaced the 6SN7 tubes with Sylvania VT-231 military type tubes from the 1940s that I purchased from Brent Jessee, along with an RCA VT-229 to replace the 6SL7 stock tube. Each of these changes resulted in a very noticeable improvement in tone, texture, and layering.
I have yet to roll the 805 tubes, but will probably give the Psvane 805s a whirl later in the summer or early fall. I am so pleased with the sound at the moment, I am in no particular hurry to mess with it.
As for an earlier question pertaining to digital and/or analog, I greatly enjoy both in my system. I would say that I am fairly close to Kenny's breakdown of 70 percent digital to 30 percent analog.
Please keep us posted on your progress in building your system. If you need help finding a 508ia, let me know and I will hook you up with a dealer I found here in North Carolina. He's an incredibly nice fellow.
Chris
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Years ago, I ordered a Supratek preamp and waited nearly nine months to get it. There were quite a few others who waited nearly as long or longer, as the designer lives in Australia and is (or was) a one-man show. It was a long wait, but worth it in the end.
The difference is that people knew it was going to be a long wait going in. For what it's worth, I would recommend to Eric to "under-promise" and "over-deliver," rather than the other way around. Tell customers to expect their speakers in two weeks and deliver them in six weeks, they'll grouse on the forums or even cancel their orders. Tell those same customers it will take two months to make their speakers and when they get them in six weeks, they'll sing your praises to the heavens. It is the same amount of time, but the perception is completely changed. Just food for thought.
The Supratek preamp was worth the wait. The Double Impacts--and I am sure the Ulfs and mini-Ulfs--are worth the wait. I love mine. They are not just a tremendous value. They are tremendous period.
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If you're serious about this, vitop, I have a New Old Stock carafe that was produced by Sunbeam for military use in the 1940s. These are almost impossible to find, and you have to watch out for Russian and Chinese knockoffs.
I can let it go for $8,000.
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@stfoth It's the real deal. I think there are like eight of these left in the world. You think you've had coffee? You ain't never had no coffee like this! |
Fancy shmancy coffee makers are all well and good, but if you are using the stock power cord with those things, your coffee is going to be flat and unengaging, no matter what you put in it. And don't get me started about kitchen treatments.
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@shadorne
Have you heard any of the Tekton speakers, or are you just a fan of non sequiturs?
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@charles1dad
Hi Charles,
Ordinarily, I would make the same assumption, especially with a member with Shadorne's lengthy track record here. On the other hand, the "Tekton backlash" seems to have inspired quite a lot of comments made by people who admit that they have never heard the speakers. Strange and curious behavior, I'd say. Hopefully, Shadorne will give us the benefit of us experience.
In the meantime, I am leaning toward auditioning the SE, if Eric will allow a similar audition period to the Double Impacts. I would love to hear how they compare and perhaps improve upon these wonderful speakers.
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Congrats all around on those developing a brand new love affair with their SEs.
I received mine a couple of weeks ago, but have not had much time with them yet. I've been holding off on commenting until I get more hours (a lot more) on them--I found that my Double Impacts changed a lot after 200-300 hours of breaking in. I will say this much--anyone who has been considering jumping up to the SEs and has the wherewithal to do it should be saving their pennies.
More to follow...
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Glad to see this discussion motoring right along. I want to echo david_ten's observations on break-in. It took my Double Impacts at least 300-400 hours to reach their peak, and I am finding that the SEs are taking just as long or longer. Unfortunately, they were going through a "down" phase when Dan (kebouchard84) came by for an audition a couple of weeks ago, resulting in some looseness and lack of definition and impact in the bass and some stridency in the upper frequencies, especially on some recordings. For a few days, I found it difficult to listen to much of anything but acoustic, very well-recorded music. I had warned him in advance that they were still fairly early in the break-in process and that the sound would be unpredictable. Of course, he can speak for himself if he chooses, but I think he heard the potential in the speakers in spite of these issues. He spoke glowingly of his audition of the Double Impacts at grey9hound's place.
My SEs are sounding much improved now, glorious at times. Given my experience with the Double Impacts, I know this story will have a happy ending, though there is still some distance yet to travel. In some cases with these speakers, much patience is required, but the pay-off is extraordinary. Until then, it's a bit of a roller coaster ride, at least for some of us. The good news is that you do get glimpses of their greatness along the way.
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@olesno
Needless to say, I will be one very interested observer of how the Lyngdorf TDAI 3400 sounds with your new Tekton Encores. Speaking of which, did they ship yesterday as expected? |
@grey9hound
I couldn’t help myself. The Ulfs are just too big for our living room, but when Eric unveiled the Encores, I knew I would eventually have to try them! The truth is, I could have lived long term with either the Double Impacts or the SEs. But those Encores are just too enticing to pass up!
@charles1dad
I feel sure that the LM 508ia will be a fantastic match with the Encores, as it was with both the Double Impacts and the Double Impact SEs. If I can find a deal on a lightly used Lyngdorf, I think it would be great fun to bring it in and compare the sonic landscapes of my system driven by these two excellent--but very different--amps. I swore I’d never abandon tubes again after my failed foray with the Devialet--and I probably won’t--but then again, there are a lot of guys here, very experienced audiophiles, who are over moon with the Lyngdorf, which also appears to have excellent synergy with Tekton speakers. It’s hard not to be curious...the eternal curse of the audiophile. :)
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@charles1dad
Charles, the Lyngdorf fan club is growing by leaps and bounds, it appears. I spent some time reading in the archives today and could barely find a negative word about it. Very impressive testimonials abound. Moreover, it would be a great way to pile up some hours of break-in on my new Encores instead of burning up hours on the tubes in my LM 508ia.
Oh my, how good are we audiophiles at rationalizing what we want?
@grey9hound
Once I get all this sorted out, I will certainly extend an invitation. Love to have you over for a listening session.
@grannyring
Thanks for that info, Bill. Thanks to you and Al, I will be doing my due diligence on the analog aspect of using the Lyngdorf. I do enjoy spinning those records, so I have to get that right if I am going to try one.
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Thanks so much for that, Al. As always, you're an invaluable resource. I would imagine if I liked the Lyngdorf, I would sell the Atlantic, but the Allnic phono stage is something else altogether. I will certainly contact Lyngdorf to get more specifics before moving forward.
I hope all is well with you!
Chris |
My Encores are on the way! I need to order some Herbie's gliders posthaste. Would someone remind me of the correct size to |
@jcarcopo I will stick with the gliders. Thanks for the reminder on the specs.
Looks as if several pairs of Encores will be landing soon!
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@evolvist first and foremost, I am very sorry to hear of your health problems and that this has turned out to be such an ordeal for you. Especially toward the end of this, things obviously went completely haywire and seemed to spiral out of control.
I have had three sets of Tektons: the Double Impacts, the Double Impact SEs, and now the Encores. Rather than trade them in, I sold the Double Impacts and the SEs to other audiophiles, both of whom are very happy with the speakers, as I am happy with the Encores.
Maybe I have your account of this story wrong, but where it seemed to go wrong is the wrangling over the shipping costs of sending the Double Impacts back to Tekton. I guess I am not clear on exactly how much they were expecting you to pay and how much you ended up paying on your friend's account. Believe me, $300 is not a bad price for shipping speakers that size. I just paid nearly $600 to ship some speakers smaller than the Double Impacts cross country last week. If you balked at that or got into a protracted beef with the company over paying the shipping after having the Double Impacts for nearly a full year, it is easy to imagine why they would balk at sending you the Encores under the same conditions. If I have this wrong, accept my apologies and feel free to set us straight.
I'm sorry if I sound less than sympathetic, but there are probably two sides to this story, and we are just getting one side here.
I sincerely hope you find happiness with your next set of speakers and return to good health very soon. |
I have owned three pairs of Tektons: the Double Impacts, the SEs, and now the Encores. In all three cases, the finish was just fine. I am particularly fond of the Encores done in Spanish Tile soft gloss. Some say the Tektons are ugly, but I think these look very nice in my living room. For what it is worth, so does my wife. And the sound...wow. I fully expect that this will be my last pair of speakers.
I did not order the grills.
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