Tekton Double Impacts

David:

Running REW graphs and using the same mic, converter, amps, and speakers WHEN the DAC is changed, the response is significantly different -- mostly in the midrange. The 3 DACs checked so far include the Sabre 32s in an Oppo 105D, an Emotiva DC10, and the aforementioned RME UFX. Can provide graphs if you are interested. Suggest this might be the result of the analog electonics after the DAC's chip, but this is just a guess. You can, BTW also hear these differences when REW does the sweep.

Converter Update.

After trying a number of DACs have found the ideal one for my set of DIs. It is an RME UCX that I had available as a unit no longer being used in the studio. Set up with its TotalMix computer interface, it provides readings of JRiver files that are startling realistic. In particular, it is superb at soundstage localization AND, just like the DIs, disentangles dense textures (such as large orchestras) with great accuracy. If you run across a unit, give it a try.

An Oppo 105D (=Sabre32), an Emotiva XMC1 and Stealth D-1, and an Audient studio converter. Would have liked to try some of the Schiit products but they do not have remotes and, so, will not work in this installation. Someone on this forum recommended a product but, at $2500 it was out of my range. Also tried another RME converter, the UFX, and it was similarly excellent. One of the advantages of the RME connections is that TotalMix avoids any kind of Windows driver need and, so, provides a custom connection to the DAC that is controlled entirely by RME's architecture. Am using a wired remote to control the UCX and this is not ideal but, at least, works.

Let me know if you have other candidates.

Kenny:

I, too, have done a number of REW measurements on the DIs and agree completely with your comments. Unfortunately I posted some of the results on another site and was overwhelmed with negative comments. Many pundits do not understand the nature of room acoustics as they affect speaker response.

What shocked me was that the response at 20hz was dead on at 0db. This is better than the Hsu Research subwoofers I have tested. For my listening habits there is no need for a sub.

Thanks, Kenny.

I, too, listen mostly to jazz, pop, and bluegrass music but the DIs have rekindled my enjoyment of classical feeds -- largely orchestral ones that have large soundstages. Suspect you found this one long ago, but, if not, the Bela Fleck and the Flecktones "Live at the Quick" DVD is spectacular on the DIs. Wooten's bass solo can be used as a primer for illustrating the DI bass response.

BTW, if you're looking for a practice piano, there are excellent sampling instruments available as are the Korg keyboard controllers hooked up to a VST/computer. Allows the aficionado the opportunity to blend their musical and audiophile interests. Nothing beats a grand, however.

doctorsubie:

I have gotten grills and was under the impression from Eric that he made them in bunches and was so occupied now. Give him a call and see. Much prefer the look of the large DI cabinets with the grills installed and don't notice any appreciable sound difference.

A number of posts have suggested they are using subs with the DIs and I, apparently, am in the minority in not feeling any need for them at all. In particular, I like the finely detailed bass response and soundstage advantage of having the bass follow the stereo feed. Noted elsewhere that the REW checks in my large room are solid down to 20hz -- although my ears start checking out at around 25...

Jeffrey:

Can you compare the soundstage qualities of the DI and the ULF? Your comments on piano accuracy are interesting to me as I have tried playing self-made recordings (24/96) of my German grand on the DIs and this is one area where the speaker only got a B-.

Your comparable comments between the DI and ULF will be of interest to a number of us DI owners. Thanks.

Craig

Jeffrey:

Your contributions to this site are the reason why the free Internet works. By contrast, the self-serving "experts" that hang out on other sites confuse the issues and make it more difficult for potential buyers to make the right decision. One honest buyer is worth more than all of the speaker "experts" combined. To paraphrase Samuel Clemens "if "expert" posters keep shedding darkness on the issue, soon we'll know nothing at all..."

Am wondering about the "elephant in the room" meaning, the cabinet size and design. Does this work for your room? The DIs I have are large enough to make a statement in a very large living room. Wonder if a cabinet this size would overwhelm and, as well, be overly minimalist in design.

Weigh in, fellow Tekton owners.

Craig

David:

Can you describe the sound improvement of the gliders? Have never used these animals and would like to know if they would help with my DIs positioned on very hard wood tile.

Thanks.

Yes, David, very helpful. Will order some this weekend.

Thanks again.

Craig

Now I'm a believer too...

On the advice of the above posters decided to try Herbie's Threaded Stud Gliders and damned if they don't work.

Installation showed me that the DIs can become very dusty in a month and that the pointy feet don't work at all on a hard wood tile surface. The gliders are a much better way to level and secure the speaker and, especially, to make fine spacing adjustments afterwards. Went with the inch and a half thread in order to raise the speaker just a little and found the tightening nuts essential to get a nice stable result.

Immediately tried out known bass examples to see if there was any change -- like to use Flight of the Cosmic Hippo (Fleck) and Tarnation (Thile and Meyer). The bass was less ringing and more realistic. Interestingly, it was possible to turn the volume up a  little with this added tautness in place. Then tried Mahler's 6th with its opening double bass punctuations. Here too, the bass lines were better separated and more realistic.

SO thanks to those above who put me onto these gliders; your knowledge and information is one of the ways that these threads work. Haven't found this kind of low cost improvement since I discovered Blue Jeans Cable and their Belden 1800f cable a number of years ago.

BTW, took the precaution of getting some replacement speakers for the DIs (I blow woofers and tweeters every now and then...) and they came this week. Uniformly high quality speakers and it is a big plus for me to be able to order replacements on the open market at the most competitive price. Don't let anyone lead you to believe these are "cheap" speakers. If you order a complete set at the best Internet price it will cost you around $1200. A couple of woofers and tweeters are around $200.

Mac48025

You might want to check out the Bernstein Concertos and Orchestral Works available at Amazon -- 80 CDs for about $120. These are truly great recordings, many still the best of any recorded.

The original Columbia tapes were resampled by Sony at 24/96 and they issued them as a direct transfer to Redbook CD. Everything in the original tape is clearly presented, including the original tap hiss.

So, use some software package to remove the hiss and you’ve got a state-of-the-art sound that surpasses any 21st century recording I have heard (ADD can be that good). I rip them into JRiver and then use the Restoration Suite in the German DAW Samplitude to remove the hiss -- takes very little time but 80 CDs will requires an afternoon or so.

Curious that Sony left this hiss in the CDs when it is so trivial to remove it with modern DAWs. Could it be because they offered, at the same time, each CD individually in SACD format at $35-65 each? No hiss in the SACDs...

Am now listening to the Norah Jones "Come Away With Me" SACD and it is startling in accuracy. The engineers got the original right and the SACD processing brings her into your room.

David_Ten and Ron1264:

Used pillows rather than a stool in the same way and noticed the improvement. This led me to design and construct some wall panels that have cleaned up the issue entirely.

Have found that Herbie's gliders not only tighten up the bass but, because of the added vibration control, contribute to a more accurate soundstage. And, as well, if you damp the wall behind the soundstage area (= wall space between the two DIs) then the depth of the stage will open up as it does not have to compete with reflected waves.

David_Ten:

Wanted to remove any reflected sound from behind the speakers so designed large 3'X4' boxes 3.5" thick that hold "clean" acoustical insulation (read no fiberglass) and designed an interior structure (a bit complicated)  that would hold this loose insulation in place when held on the wall. All is covered with speaker cloth. Works very well and has made the room more transparent and musical without acquiring that "dead" sound that I have in the music room and studio from a complete stoppage of all reflection (good for recording but not so great for listening -- use Next Acoustics products for this studio purpose). Sent some photos to Eric and he might pass them on to you if you two communicate. Since then have done the same with the space between the speakers and the soundstage is now very clear. You can point to the horns in dense orchestral textures with no problems. Could not find a design that would do this on the web and, so, built my own. It's easier than dealing with a third party when you have a specialty need.

 A second note on precision and detail.

This afternoon, had the first opportunity to listen to a favorite Bluray performance of Holst's The Planets by Salonen and the Philharmonia Orchestra (Signum Vision recording). Have been using this recording for years to check for detail and accuracy in orchestral instruments -- many of which have very complex tonal structures.

The DIs distinguished themselves in reproducing each instrument clearly and with accurate timbre. The DIs are much more accurate than the Maggies I used for years (yes, more detail and precision) and just a bit more accurate than the Emotiva T1s that I use at my other home and like very, very much.

What struck me especially about the DIs with this very sophisticated recording (huge number of mics and bluray cameras) was how good the bass response was. Contrabassoons and bass clarinets were heard in ensemble passages as never before. The double basses extend throughout their entire range in uniform volume and sound completely well integrated into the total orchestra sound.

So, if you have questions about precision and detail with the DIs, listen to this Bluray. It will tell your ears the story.

Corelli:

Exactly. My suspicion is that the ribbons have a slight amount of over-ring that cannot be physically damped at a minute time level. This momentary uncertainty will kill the sense of soundstage. Regardless, they were a fine speaker but have found that a full range tower has so many inherent advantages.

Can't match your biking activities but the Cavalier Spaniels have had their share of walks this holiday...

Mac48025

Get ready. The packaging and attention to detail in the box structure are truly opulent. You will genuinely enjoying pulling the CDs out of the well-designed folders -- if you can find the one you want out of 80 possibilities.

A number of recordings are the best I have ever heard: Copland's Appalachian Spring, Tchaikovsky's  Serenade for Strings (stunning) and Hindemith's Symphonic Metamorphoses. Bernstein's recordings of his own pieces are justifiably legendary. They literally spring out of the DIs.

BTW, there are no symphonies. They are in the first set, now out of print. It sold for $80 and is now being hawked on Amazon for $1k. What is Sony thinking?

If you need a broad selection of symphonies, go for the Karajan collection of 80 CDs (EMI/Warner) with his first orchestra, the Philharmonia, and his second, the Berlin Philharmonic. The last half of this set is worth the price; much of the first half is in mono and holds little attraction to me.

There is a good amount of hiss in the Bernstein set and will provide you with additional options if you like.

But, in any case, ENJOY!

mac48025:

Have you heard what make/model of dome tweeter Eric is now using in place of the original SB Acoustics ring ones? Wonder what affect this will have on his patent concept of low mass drivers.

mac48025:

That's exactly why I asked. Was under the impression that ring tweeters were much lower in mass than dome ones and, therefore, how this change might alter his balance ideal.

Congrats on your SNs; mine are much later, 229 & 230, but still have the original SB tweeters that sound fine to me.

And gosh, lpretiring, I’ve got a nice set of Bose 901s in the garage, hardly used and only 3 years young. Great holographic soundstage, not so much anything else...

Can you make you a really good deal.

Mac:

If you're looking for scary recorded "shots" check out the Telarc Wellington's Victory album (Beethoven) with 1) digital firework sounds so loud that 2) there is a warning on the label. Normal volume levels will cause immediate ear fatigue and destroy most tweeters.

The Telarc engineers got carried away, you see...

But my canine family knows about the big boxes and sleep behind them when the music is active. Their 'decoration' occurs when I am not looking. On those rare occasions when they have been caught, they were spanked.

But Cavaliers are not a dogsmart breed and do not remember this kind of correction for any length. They are about interpersonal relationships and lap dog love. And they are professionals in these two areas...

Mac:

Make sure one of your first listens is to the Gershwin: Rhapsody in Blue. This is easily the best recording of this standard -- by a long shot. Perfect for the NYP, Bernstein, and that pianist. If you're running a tube amp, let me know how the timbres sound.

lpetiring:

No, because the 901s were always on elevated stands, they avoided the dreaded canine addition.

On the other hand, have a pair of Maggies that were liberally anointed and they come with a can of Resolve liquid and a hand brush. After multiple treatments, they should be like new (LOL).

Seriously, as a lifelong audiophile, equipment that enters never leaves. Once a piece is drawn into the black hole, the only movement is to the other side of the hole -- the Goodwill...

Jeffey:

Did you use any mounting feet/dampers on the ULFs? Considering their weight wonder if this is helpful and, if so, what types of devices are appropriate.

Sorry to see that the DIs are going down in comparable quality.

Vitop:

No, they are a family of Cavalier King Charles Spaniels.

AND, they have that many names because they are more important than you or me (LOL).

mikirob:
Thanks so much; your response is why these threads work. Am thinking of giving a tube amp a try and have been looking at the primaluna dialogue premium -- because it has substantially better specs than other units. Could not find out from them the class of their amp although it is push-pull. Would not consider anything other than class A.

Have been listening to the Bernstein set for over 2 weeks now and revisiting the favorites I heard when they were released in the 60s and 70s. All of these performances are "good," a surprisingly-high number are "great," and another number are the best of all time (e.g., the Hindemith). It was a confluence of fortunate events: a great conductor, a great orchestra in the preeminent city of its day, AND Columbia records. Columbia was being supported by its Dylan recordings and took the opportunity with the NYP and Bernstein to invent close miking techniques for the orchestra with mixing principles closely tied to the musical content and major themes. The result was spectacular in its day and presaged all later recording techniques.

WHEN YOU REMOVE the tape hiss, these recordings sound better to my ears than any 21st century recording.

SO, don't miss the "Intermezzo" from the Bizet suite. The flutist should have been knighted after that performance...

Whacky:

Got 1 and 1/2 inch lengths for my threaded gliders and am glad for the extra length.
When you put them on, you have to tilt the box a little to remove one set of the older feet and add the new ones. The Herbie feet will not accept too much tension on the outer portion of the circle; so its best to screw them all the way in, then tilt the box for the other set. Once that second set is installed at its final height, you can retilt the box yet one more time and raise the first set a second time to match. Doing it this way removes the chance of breaking the outer edge of the rim.

Kenny: Once again, thanks and also this shows, once again, how this thread continues to work for those interested in informed responses.

Have heard back from Colin and ordered the Nord Stereo with both of the available op amps. Hope that one or the other will provide the kind of sound ideal perfect for my DIs.

Your room is large, but not quite the space I have: 20X22 with 14 feet ceilings and two adjoining rooms stretching out the two lateral dimensions to over 32 feet. As a result, the Emotiva monoblocks with 500 wpc, 4 ohms, do a good bit of work. Will see if the Nord is an improvement.

BTW, find that the DIs sound good in all three adjoining rooms when they are cranking hard. The full sound is very balanced and pleasant.

Reviewers talk uniformly about how good the bass response is with Class D and we shall see. Am able to make adjustments with Apqualizr.

SO, stay tuned around late July for another report.

Kenny:
Colin told me that they keep the declared value at $299 and, so, the customs people do not check it. He also promises to meet his 2-week deadline.

BTW, just got a Bohemian SACD of Dvorak's Slavonic Dances (Fischer/Budapest Phil) AND, for the second time, heard the DIs do something I had not heard before. Heard live, the Dances have this guttural power in the low-mid and bass regions that I can best describe as "Slavic rumble." The DIs reproduce this sound eerily accurately. Have never heard this quality reproduced in another speaker. Kudos once again to Eric...