Tannoy Stirlings on the way!

Everything depends on all the specifics, obviously, but just in terms of size of the room, they should be a good match, @mesch .

I'll be interested to hear your experiences with them, so make sure you report back!

@pehare

Cool. My experience was I felt like I was always peering *down* into the soundstage. I do sit a bit higher than many, probably, so that doubtless contributes, but even down at a normal sofa height I felt like I was looking over the balcony at the band. My listening room is also part of the mix, of course. Everybody’s mileage will vary.

@cd318

Always nice when you can find an inexpensive solution. Fourteen inches would be a fair bit more lift than I need, especially with some rake thrown in. I’m finding I like the rake because as I move further back away from my main listening position, the sound rises to meet me, so to speak. The treble doesn’t disappear behind the half-wall that divides my room from the kitchen.

@comchenry 

I gave serious thought to those Revels.  The beryllium tweeters, in particular, were intriguing.  But they're a "standard design" modern loudspeaker.  Since I already own several of those, that didn't seem like the best use of my audiophile dollar. 

The Tannoys, otoh, were unlike anything I'd ever owned.  In terms of exploring the world of audiophilia, that made them a better buy for me, in my mind.  (One of the other final candidates was Maggies.)

And I ain't gonna lie: the romance factor of the Tannoys was definitely in play.  They look like something from the 1940s, which indeed they kind of are.  Each pair is built by a single person.  To me, they are more a product of craftsmanship, while the vast majority of speakers are more a product of mass (on an audiophile scale) production.

It'll be interesting to hear your comparison.  As you said, room interactions is a big wildcard.  Which PrimaLuna do you have?

@mesch 

Hey, congrats, man!  Skol!  That's awesome.  Like @lalitk , I'm curious about the rest of the system (and the room).

Be sure to report back with setup, experiences, etc.!

If @comchenry buys his, now, I'm sending Tannoy an invoice!

@mesch 

I'm not familiar with your gear.  I'll have to look into those pieces.  I looked pretty hard at the XA25 (or XA30), too, but ultimately went a different direction.  At the time I upgraded my electronics, I was still thinking I'd probably be going with a low-efficiency monitor, like the Dynaudio Special 40 or maybe a Focal, so I went for more power.  The XA25 would be plenty for the Stirlings, though.  The needles on my MC152 rarely get past 1.5W.

What's the word, fellas?  Got your Stirlings in place and making sound?

@mesch 

I saw that, yeah.  I'd never heard of Raven Audio, so I went and checked them out.  Glad to hear you're enjoying your Stirlings!

In other news, my room treatments from GIK will be here Monday.  Time to start experimenting all over again.

Hey, that's awesome, man!  Congrats!

We're having pretty similar experiences, it sounds like.  Soundstage and imaging are hugely important for me, and these do a really nice job at both.  Mine are further out from the back than yours, and about the same from the side walls.  I've also got more toe-in, with the axes crossing in front of me.  I took my time, making small adjustments and living with them for a good while, but I ended up pretty much where the manual recommends.  It seemed to help tremendously with the imaging.

I'll be interested to hear where you land with the stands.  I'm still trying to figure that one out, myself.  Have you experimented with rake at all?

Loving the additional perspectives!  Sounds like there are some excellent pairings out there.  (Six months break-in might be a bit much for me, though!)

@douger  Hey, thanks!  We've managed to keep it on-topic and not descend into endless debates and bickering, which seems to be a bit rare.  The fact we all seem to love what Tannoy is turning out probably doesn't hurt.

@mesch I'll be interested to hear which mode you prefer as you get more time with the LM211.

Learning is always good, and usually fun.

I meant to ask before, since you mentioned jazz, what are you listening to?  I listen to a lot of jazz, myself.  Jazz, blues, folk, Americana, and rock/pop, mostly.  Currently have Bud Powell's "Live at Massey Hall" going in the background.  (I generally do my serious, in-the-listening-position listening late at night.)

I guess I don't want to pull the conversation too far afield, but a little discussion of what we're listening to on these speakers seems in order.

I'd like to revisit the question of amplification for these speakers.  What about something like a low-power class A amp?  The Pass Labs XA-25, say, or the INT-25?

Accuphase kit interests me, but I've never heard any of it.  From what I've read/heard people say, it seems like they have an atypical class-A sound; cooler, flatter, a bit recessed by comparison.  I'm working from memory here, but I think that's a pretty fair summary of what I've seen.  None of that is inherently bad.  It all depends on the rest of the system and the room and the listener's preference.  It's just atypical for class A.

Have you found that to be the case with it driving your Canterbury's? 

Thanks for all the input, everybody.  I truly appreciate it.  Lots to think about.

@lalitk 

I think there may be a bit of a misunderstanding.  I didn't actually make a "generalization about a component [I] never heard."  Because I haven't heard it, I made a generalization about what I've seen/heard others say about it.  That was all I could do.  If it came across otherwise, it wasn't intentional.

I think I’m going to stay with what I’ve got, for now. I am awfully curious about how these sound with, say, tube amps, but I’m not finding anything out there that meets all my criteria, so I think I’ll just plow that money into the house fund. (A house with a dedicated listening room!)

@pani How would tilt cause time or phase issues on a coaxial driver?

I haven't waxed mine, yet, so I can't speak to that problem.  All I can suggest is as much air circulation as you can arrange, and open windows (weather permitting).  All those VOCs gotta have somewhere to go besides up your nose.

Interesting.  Always go with what your ears are telling you.  They're the only measuring device that counts. 

Mine didn't start out tilted.  They started flat and pointed straight ahead.  I arrived at the tilt and toe-in over some weeks of listening and making small, gradual adjustments.  I can't say I've noticed any loss in coherence with them tilted, and I really don't have a space that makes bulky or heavy stands very convenient.  I have to temporarily move my Stirlings out of the way semi-frequently. 

Well, I went and did it.  I'm now on the list at Decware to get a Zen Torii Mk. V.  (I'm guessing it'll be a year, at least, before I actually get it.)  If you're not familiar, the Torii is a zero-feedback, push-pull circuit designed to behave -- or at least sound -- like a single-ended one, while putting out 20wpc.  I looked at all their different models, including the SETs, and landed on the Torii as the best fit for me.  I also looked at Icon Audio, the Line Magnetic components, Cary Audio, etc., but I kept coming back to the Torii.  I can't say I'm excited, exactly, to hear it with my Stirlings; that's too far off in the future.  But I am looking forward to hearing it.

In the more near-term, I also upgraded my digital front end. I've been using a bel canto streamer with the Mac preamp's DAC module.  That module is no slouch; it's a fully balanced design, using ESS chips.  But, I've always wanted to try an R2R DAC.  I like what I hear about them.  So I've got a Denafrips Pontus II on the way.  Pretty excited about that. 

Also on the way is a Hifi Rose RS250 streamer to replace the bel canto.  Frankly, that's mostly about the user interface.  I don't use the DAC in the bel canto, and I won't use the one in the RS250, either, so neither unit is contributing anything to the sound.  (OTOH, I am stuck using an RCA coax connection from the bel canto to the Mac pre, and with the new stuff I can run USB from the RS250 to the Pontus, and a fully balanced analog signal from there to the Mac.)  Mainly I wanted something with a display that shows track information, album art, etc., and the RS250 has a nice one.

So, my Stirlings will soon be getting fed better, and a while down the road, maybe quite a bit better.  Here's hoping they reward me for it. 😁

Thanks, @mulveling !

I thought about ordering a pair of mono SETs, which gives you 6wpc instead of 2.3, but in the end decided I’d prefer something with a bit more juice. I knew some of you guys said you ran into problems with lower wattage amps, and also I wanted to reasonably be able to try tubes with some of my other, less sensitive speakers. I watch the meters on my Mac amp sometimes, and it rarely bounces up to 15 watts, much less beyond that, so I think I’ll be covered with 20 when driving the Tannoys, at least.

As for the tubes themselves, that’s something I’ll be starting from zero knowledge on. I had a BAT preamp 25 or so years ago, but never futzed with the tubes before selling it. Then I picked up a 2nd-hand Jolida phono stage a few years after that, but it stopped working before I really had time to try tube rolling.

I did a little poking around on the internet last night, just trying to get a feel for what tubes are available of the types used in the Torii. Found some in the 4 output tube families you mentioned. Only one 7027 and no 807s, though. On the input side, I found some 6922s, but almost nothing from the 6DJ8 or 7DJ8 families. Seems like the AX7s and AU7s are used a lot more commonly. Could be I’m just not looking at the right sites.

How’s the bookshelf evaluation going, @chorus ?

Ick.  Sorry to hear about the COVID.  Glad you're back on your feet.

That's a shame they sold your Tannoys already.  I guess I missed that you had traded them in.  I thought you were doing a side-by-side comparison with the monitors and were going to return them if they didn't work out.  What do you figure you're shopping for?  Another set of Tannoys, or something else?  They do make those little monitors.  I don't know much about them, other than that they do have the same design as the rest of the Prestige line.  No idea what kind of bass they produce.  Them and a compact sub might be more agreeable to the missus, though.

Interesting.  I thought all the Prestige GR models used alnico magnets.

I'll be darned. You sent me back to look at the manual. Sure enough, it says the magnets are barium ferrite.  Dunno if that's the same thing you're calling "ceramic," but it certainly is not alnico.

Interesting. Sintering came up in a different context, recently.  I'm thinking about getting a new cartridge.  One of the ones I'm looking at is the E.A.T. Jo No. 5.  The body of that cart is made by laser sintering some kind of powdered organic compound.

That all makes good sense.  Great stuff.

Only problem is now I want to upgrade to Kensingtons! lol  I have some kind of romantic attachment to alnico magnets.

@astolfor The Canterburys are too large for my space, and too heavy to be practical for a man with a bad back.  I'm not even actually considering upgrading to the Kensingtons right now.  I was only having a bit of fun about them.  I just dropped significant cash on upgrading other parts of my system.

Hello, there, and welcome!

I'm very happy with that combination, yes.  Being a restless audiophile, I want to try it with tubes, but the Stirlings sing wonderfully with the Mac gear we own.

I listen to 70s/80s rock only rarely, but lots of golden era jazz.  The Stirlings are a very good match for that, and I think they'll do just fine with the rock material, too, depending on how big your room is and how much bass you like to have.  If you want tons of thump and your room is medium-large or bigger, you probably want to step up to the Turnberry, or supplement with a sub, which is what I did (although I already had the subs).  The Stirlings produce plentiful bass, and it's good bass, but they aren't going to stove your chest in when John Bonham stomps the kick.

As for the electronics, they're the only ones I've heard the Stirlings with.  Maybe they're capable of much, much more with other gear; I wouldn't know.  But I have been listening to speakers and electronics for a long, long time, so I do have some idea what things should sound like, and I like what I'm getting.

Best wishes with the purchase!

So, I picked up a pair of scratch-and-dent Klipsch Heresy's.  I've got them next to the Tannoys.  They've been running a few days, now, and three things are already apparent:

1. Klipsch rates the Heresy's at 99 dB efficient, and Tannoy rates the Stirlings at, I think, 92. There is not 7 dB of difference in these speakers.
2. The Tannoys eat the diminutive Klipsches in bass depth and quality.  They should beat them at depth, being a much larger cabinet.  But the Klipsches are also just much, much boomier and uncontrolled.
3. The Klipsch soundstage is not as good, but it does do a wonderful job of throwing the singer or lead instrument right out in front of the speakers.

I'll have to look into those HRS Nimbus spacers.  At the moment I still just have a book stuck under the fronts.

Been a while since I posted in this thread.  Thought I'd check in.  Everybody still digging their Tannoys?  Any new amplifier, stand, positioning, etc., suggestions?

I'm still loving my Stirlings.  The things they do with well recorded choral music!  Probably the best speakers I've owned -- maybe even heard -- for that.  They excel with any kind of vocal, really, along with woodwinds, brass, and acoustic instruments.  I wouldn't call them the greatest things with hard rock.  They hold their own, but it isn't their strong suit.  I don't listen to a lot of that, anyway.  Nearest I get is some pretty heavy blues, sometimes.

I'm still running them in the same positions with the same rake angle and same McIntosh gear.  Only change is I got a bel canto streamer several months ago to replace the DigiOne+ as my Roon endpoint.  It's working like a champ.

@clweed, yes, I'm still using them with the same REL subs.

Thanks to the large-ish driver and cabinet volume, they do bass quite well on their own. That will depend a great deal on your room, though, obviously. My room doesn't have a large square footage, but thanks to a couple of partial walls, the effective *volume* of the room for bass frequencies is pretty large.  The subs help drive that volume, and they add some speed.

@lalitk 
Nice! I've never heard any darTZeel gear.  I'm not even sure how to pronounce it!

Very well thought out, man.  Did you design them, or did the maker?  Do you mind if I ask what they cost to have made?

Congrats, @sandthemall !  Sounds like great kit, though I'm not familiar with the preamp.  Will have to look that one up.

Aside from a quick check that everything's working, I never actually listen to new speakers (if I can help it).  I just let them play in another room for a few days.  Once they're run in a bit, that's when I sit down and start figuring out what's what.  Even then, I kinda ease into it.

Hope you enjoy those Turnberrys (Turnberries?)!

@grinccaffe , you’re dealing with the very problem I mentioned last year and still haven’t bothered getting a good solution to. That’s the low tweeter axis. My "solution" to this point has been a thick book under the front of each speaker, giving them a considerable rake. I’ll be interested to hear how your solution turns out. It’s what I’m planning to do at some point.

I'm still not reliably getting notified of new posts in this thread for some reason, btw.  I got no notice of grinccaffe's post, but did for bobelton's.  No idea why.

@bobelton , I didn't get a chance to compare the two models with my own ears, but that's exactly where I ended up: in my smallish room, the Stirlings would be perfectly sufficient.

And I'm also [still] using a pair of REL T9's with them.  I already had those, so that was another reason I didn't need the Turnberrys.  I find the Stirlings and REL's match extremely well.  REL's are supposed excel at that in general, so I guess I'm not saying anything new there.

Question: Are any of you using the 3rd binding post?  If so, did you find 3-wire speaker cables, or are you using a separate wire?  Do you find it actually gives your Tannoys a quieter background?

@grinccaffe 

 

Very cool. They even have nameplates!  Are they internally braced/damped etc.?

@dalims4 

From what I'm seeing, those VDH's are more than I'm prepared to pay for cables.

@grinccaffe 

Not cheap, but sounds pretty reasonable, considering everything that went into them.  Thanks.

Nice! Glad you're still enjoying them.

So, that whole thing about finding some stands to get these speakers up to more of an on-axis position, I never found anything that would work.  So I'm having Sound Anchor build a set for me.

They'll be 4-posters, 9.5" high.  The platform will be 14.5 x 13.25, which is the dimensions of the built-in base of the Stirlings, plus a half-inch in both dimensions.  They're going to weld a half-inch thick bar across the back to create a 1" high lip.  This will keep them from sliding off if/when I experiment with adding some rake angle in addition to the lift.

The base of the stands will be 18.5" deep, and 16.5" wide.  That adds a bit to the footprint of the speakers, which I was hoping to avoid, but it's not too terribly much.  I have more space in the depth dimension, so it should be manageable.

Build will take about 8 weeks.

Thanks!  It seems a bit weird to look forward to . . . speaker stands?  But I think they're going to make a considerable difference.

Okay, finally got the Stirlings up on their new, custom Sound Anchors. They arrived a few weeks ago, but the packing was more complicated than I expected (bolted to sheets of 3/4 plywood). I just haven't had any time to do anything with them till now.

They're a perfect fit. Heavy as all heck, though. The estimate before they were built said 45 lbs., each. I call shennanigans. These things are much heavier than the speakers themselves.

Anyway, I've still got some dialing in to do, but they have perfectly accomplished what I wanted from them: I no longer feel like I'm looking over the balcony DOWN into the soundstage. It's up at eye/ear level, and it's wonderful.

I'll post pics when I can. Right now, the listening area is a bit of a wreck, as I'm moving a lot of stuff around in the process of replacing my equipment rack, etc.

Hi, Bob. Unfortunately, I've had rather a busy time of it since I posted that. On Christmas Eve, a burst pipe in the apartment above mine flooded my place. Mine was one of about 50. When I was able to get back into my place after the holidays and get a look at things, the bottom sections of the Sound Anchors had rusted. Since I got into my new place, I've tried a couple of things to clean them up, but it seems there's nothing for it but to take a sander to them and then hope some black paint will more or less match the powdercoat.

The good news is that by keeping them up off the wet carpet, they saved the Stirlings. I guess I got them just in time. That's about the whole of the good news, though. It was a god-awful mess.

Thanks, guys. So far, so good in the new place. Still figuring out my listening room. I'm in a house, though, so it's certainly quieter.

I'm a pretty even-keeled guy, so not much emotional damage, other than being pissed off at the property manager. The financial damage, though . . . oof.

 

I really thought I had posted this update already, but scrolling back through the thread I don't see it. Back in late autumn 2022 I ordered a Schiit Audio Freya S+ (the balanced circuit). Feeding that to the McIntosh SS amp, I began to understand what people mean by "holographic" when it comes to tubes and Tannoys. It's only just a glimpse, I think, but I know what they're talking about. I dig it.