@sns , The Ediscreation FIBER BOX II is an optical isolation solution not unlike using fiber and two FMCs, but somewhat less clunky as it is contained in a single box. I suspect it would work well right in front of the ENO. They also make the SILENT SWITCH OCXO, a switch using an OCXO clock with internal LPS. Couldn't find a review but here are some nice pictures.
Streaming Sound Quality - Want the very best sound quality? Network Acoustics ENO...
Like many of you fellow Agoners I am striving to get the best sound quality out of my digital streaming front end. To that end I have invested in various high end switches, re-clockers, ethernet cables, various USB filters/re-clockers, high end servers and delved into fiber optic conversion configurations. All of these measures did improve sound quality at varying levels. I felt my system sounded as good as a decent CD transport on many streaming recordings in Qobuz. However, I still felt there was something missing. I felt my system was still being held back. You can see my system under virtual systems here.
Well, I stumbled across something that has finally enabled my digital system to be all it can be. I cannot fully express the level of sound quality improvement realized with the addition of the Network Acoustics ENO Ag filter and ENO Ag streaming ethernet cable. It has been 10 days now since I added these to my system and I can now confidently say my streaming and system are all they can be sonically.
Here is the set up that has caused me to sell off and move past many other powered filters, reclockers, fiber optic options, and other streaming tweaks and gadgets. Frankly, the ENO additions are miles ahead of these other options sonically in my system and experience. Miles. This is my personal experience and please understand this perspective.
Netgear NighHawk modem/router power by an LPS > Supra cat 8 ethernet cable > English Electric 8Switch > Network Acoustics ENO Ag streaming cable > ENO Ag ethernet filter > Innuos Zenith III > Mojo Audio Evo dac
The English Electric 8Switch is also wonderful. Will a lower cost, standard switch sound as good in this set-up? Not sure as I have not tried. I am so ecstatic with my sound system that I don’t want to touch it!
There is a certain rightness from top to bottom that’s intoxicating. The tone is so beautiful and natural with no hint of electronic glare or digital artificiality. Music flows with far greater ease and has an uncanny, unforced nature to it. The stage is far deeper with the music flowing from a plane that is layered and completely separate of the speakers. This aural sensation, at this level of nuance, is new to my system and experience. The ENO products made this possible.
Instruments are presented with a new realism that is arresting to my senses. There is a wholistic presentation that spreads out all around me and my space. Just a joy to experience. Yes, the speakers seem to float the music into my space without any attention or localization of the speaker box or physical presence.
No part of frequency spectrum is out of place or forced. I am sure this has to do with the absence of noise. My music is equally articulate and resolved at low or loud volumes. Music stays controlled and enticing no matter how complex or bombastic the recording.
The ENO filter is passive, not powered, so there is no need of any power supply or plug. This is a huge plus.
Hope you streaming audiophiles find this helpful.
Bill
Well, I stumbled across something that has finally enabled my digital system to be all it can be. I cannot fully express the level of sound quality improvement realized with the addition of the Network Acoustics ENO Ag filter and ENO Ag streaming ethernet cable. It has been 10 days now since I added these to my system and I can now confidently say my streaming and system are all they can be sonically.
Here is the set up that has caused me to sell off and move past many other powered filters, reclockers, fiber optic options, and other streaming tweaks and gadgets. Frankly, the ENO additions are miles ahead of these other options sonically in my system and experience. Miles. This is my personal experience and please understand this perspective.
Netgear NighHawk modem/router power by an LPS > Supra cat 8 ethernet cable > English Electric 8Switch > Network Acoustics ENO Ag streaming cable > ENO Ag ethernet filter > Innuos Zenith III > Mojo Audio Evo dac
The English Electric 8Switch is also wonderful. Will a lower cost, standard switch sound as good in this set-up? Not sure as I have not tried. I am so ecstatic with my sound system that I don’t want to touch it!
There is a certain rightness from top to bottom that’s intoxicating. The tone is so beautiful and natural with no hint of electronic glare or digital artificiality. Music flows with far greater ease and has an uncanny, unforced nature to it. The stage is far deeper with the music flowing from a plane that is layered and completely separate of the speakers. This aural sensation, at this level of nuance, is new to my system and experience. The ENO products made this possible.
Instruments are presented with a new realism that is arresting to my senses. There is a wholistic presentation that spreads out all around me and my space. Just a joy to experience. Yes, the speakers seem to float the music into my space without any attention or localization of the speaker box or physical presence.
No part of frequency spectrum is out of place or forced. I am sure this has to do with the absence of noise. My music is equally articulate and resolved at low or loud volumes. Music stays controlled and enticing no matter how complex or bombastic the recording.
The ENO filter is passive, not powered, so there is no need of any power supply or plug. This is a huge plus.
Hope you streaming audiophiles find this helpful.
Bill
Showing 21 responses by mitch2
So the ENO is basically an RF reduction device that uses chokes to filter the input. In the post by @arafiq below, he reports that the ENO designer told him a fiber optic interface does basically "a similar job" of noise reduction as the ENO. That comment leads to my question of whether any ENO users have directly compared it to a fiber optic interface - and how did the two compare sonically? |
Thanks for the clear answer Rich, and for weighing in on this forum. I am actually using 15M of fibre optic for my main link between my router and my system. There is one converter at the system, which I power with a large (overkill) LPS and then a very short Ethernet/CAT8 cable from the converter to the streamer/server. When you say, All active devices emit noise, including optical to RJ45 converters.I assume you include switches too? Therefore, what I believe I hear is the optimal set-up is to have the ENO be the last device prior to the streamer - correct. I have gotten to know Bill over the years through these forums so I do have a level of trust in what he hears, which is why this thread interested me. Where would be a good place to purchase the ENO in the USA? |
Ok, so I bit the bullet and the Network Acoustics ENO Ag ethernet filter and streaming cable are now in the house. Thanks to whoever (lalitk?) posted that the ENO filter and cable were available on USAM since I was able to purchase those. The post from 1/22 seems to have been removed. I am still skeptical that this will provide an improvement but I will hook it up this weekend and give it a solid try for a while. The chain will be as follows:
|
You have mentioned this before but I guess I don't understand. My input choices between my server and DAC (both Mojo Audio) are USB, BNC, or AES/EBU, so I do not understand how I would use either FMC or Ethernet for that connection without some sort of converter. The USB output from the server and USB input into the DAC are both well-regarded, optimized for audio, JCAT boards so USB is the connection recommended by Mojo Audio - the server/DAC manufacturer. I do have the option to put another type of Roon endpoint (Metrum Ambre) that I own between the server and DAC. The connection would be from my server's Ethernet output into the Ambre. I used the Ambre between my Antipodes DX server and Metrum Pavane/Adagio DACs so the DX would not be required to function as both the Roon core and Roon endpoint, and also because the Ambre outputs I2S, which was compatible with the Metrum DACs. Is this the type of connection that you are talking about? If I insert the Ambre between my server and DAC, then I will need to use coax or AES/EBU to connect from the Ambre to the Mojo Deja Vu DAC (since the Deja Vu does not support an I2S input). For now, the FMC I use is for the 45-foot run from my router to the server. Although I haven't heard a significant difference between CAT8 and FMC for that 45 feet, the trade-offs are that FMC will not pick up RFI/EMI while using the CAT8 allows me to do away with two converters and their associated power supplies. I do not have a clear favorite but I will first get the ENO set up and then try that comparison between FMC and CAT8 again to try and hear a difference. |
You are killing me here! 🤔 This sub-industry requiring constant upgrades is one of the reasons I don't like small black boxes...the need for something new seems never-ending. On one hand, I get that the digital world is constantly improving, and the sonic quality of the music coming from my system has certainly improved significantly over the past 5 years. However, most to all of the sonic improvements to my system's digital playback have resulted from upgrading my DACs and servers, as well as the improved quality of streaming services, while I would classify the changes resulting from small black boxes and digital cables as sometimes audible but mostly underwhelming - particularly when compared with the hype and the higher and higher prices being charged for these items. However, I hope I will be pleasantly surprised by the ENO Streaming System Ag. |
Hi all, The ENO Ag and cable are connected and music is playing. I have already tried it both ways (i.e., Ethernet cable vs. fiber cable) as recommended by @lalitk except that I am still running a very short Ethernet cable directly from the router to a Netgear switch prior to the 45-foot run to the area where my server and system are located. I do like the simplicity of not having the two additional converters and their power supplies in the chain but did not initially hear noticeable differences between the long run of Ethernet vs. the long run of fiber. The ENO clearly operates at 100 mbs as the lights on my Bonn N8 show amber instead of green as they do without the ENO in the chain. Also, in order to use the fiber, I needed to change out my converters from MC200CM (1000 mbs) to MC100CM (100 mbs) in order for the ENO to successfully handshake with my server. Regarding the ENO itself, I have not yet discerned what I would consider a noticeably significant difference in the sound of my system with or without the ENO in the chain. I will have fun listening this weekend and will report back. |
@hchilcoat - interesting that Benjamin recommended the ENO, maybe I am on the right track. I appreciate @lalitk posting about it being for sale and since it was the Network Acoustics ENO Streaming System Ag on offer, I received both the ENO Ag filter and their 1M cable, which allows me to run the NA cable from my Bonn N8 switch to the ENO and then their short connected cable from the ENO to my DejaVu server. The seller also included an ifi power supply to power a switch. I do admit what I am hearing now sounds pretty damn good. Neil Young at Carnegie Hall 1970 and Muscle Shoals: Small Town Big Sound both sound nuanced, spatial, and dynamic. Not fully sure whether it sounds better than before but I believe it may and I am certainly pleased with what I hear. I am running the set-up with router>short CAT8>switch>short CAT8>converter>45' of fiber>converter>short CAT8>Bonn N8 switch>NA cable>ENO>NA cable>streamer. I can do the same thing but replace the "converter>45' of fiber>converter" with CAT8 Ethernet cable that is already in-place just not connected. That removes the two converters and two power supplies. I suspect that may be splitting hairs but I will try it. I don't like small black boxes but in this case maybe I should have listened to @grannyring sooner since it sounds as if I am already one black box back from the latest and greatest. |
I spent more time with the ENO over the weekend, which I added between the final Bonn N8 switch and my server (router>switch>converter>45 ft. of fiber>converter> Bonn N8>NA cable>ENO>server). I like what I hear so far but the effect is subtle. Thanks to comments by @sns, I tried a different streaming configuration by connecting an Ethernet cable from my Mojo DejaVu server to a Metrum Ambre (Roon endpoint/player) that I previously used in my system to deliver I2S into a Metrum DAC. In this configuration, the DejaVu acts as the Roon server and the Ambre acts as the player and outputs AES/EBU to my Mojo EVO B4B DAC. The two configurations I am comparing are:
It is easy to A/B this set up since all I need to do is change the selected endpoint in Roon between the Ambre and the Mojo DejaVu, and then toggle between the USB (DejaVu) and AES/EBU (Ambre) inputs on the EVO B4B DAC. Initial impressions are that the Ambre is slightly more incisive and the DejaVu is slightly more fluid and maybe the slightest bit less dynamic. However, both sound great, just slightly different. |
When using my DejaVu server as the Roon core and the Metrum Ambre as the Roon player, I wonder what the effect would be to move the ENO between the DejaVu and the Ambre, instead of having the ENO on the upstream side of the DejaVu where it is now? I would be interested whether anyone else who is running separate devices for their Roon core and player is using two ENOs, one in front of the server/core and one between the core device and the player? Also, have any of you tried this network switch? Around $300 gets you a linear DC Power Supply and OCXO clock, which is said to be an improvement over the TCXO clock in the Bonn N8 and EE8 switches. For those who want to spend more, there are more expensive OCXO switches such as this one and this one. |
@anzaanimalclinic, you seem to have a lot of experience with these digital delivery enhancers, so what is the level of improvement you perceive from the additions and changes you described? I struggle to justify the amount of improvement for the price with most of these types of enhancers. As an example, I changed DACs recently, which resulted in a pretty big difference in the sound of my system....not so much the "quality" since both DACs are good, but more in how the musical sounds are presented with differences in smoothness, frequency emphasis, sense of power, clarity, and dimensionality, moving things in the direction of my individual sonic priorities. OTOH, with respect to small boxes, digital cables, optical connections, and other digital enhancers - I have tried many and in most cases the differences have been.....meh...whatever. In my experience, small boxes and digital cables have not made huge differences in my enjoyment of the music. Slightly different sound, sure, but "gotta have it"....not so much. I would love to try the ENO and associated NA cables, as well as a bunch of other stuff like the Sonore Signature Rendu SE, the Intona USB Isolator, and different digital cables, but at the end of the day I struggle to justify spending a bunch of money on more small boxes or cables that will likely wind up on the shelf next to my other small boxes and extra cables. I know many here with good systems and ears have promoted the ENO and the NA cables, as well as other digital stuff, but I have seen too many other products over the past 20 years here that go through the flavor of the day cycle of huge admiration/praise/promotion only to be surpassed by something else within 6 months to a year....particularly in the digital arena. I guess I am a skeptic, based on my experiences - guilty. |
Great point on the 30-day trial lalitk. I have returned a couple of manufacturer's complementary trial pieces, but I cannot remember ever returning an item under a 30-day trial period. I hate to be "that guy" but in this case it may make some sense to give it a try and be ready to return. I am supposed to receive my new Mojo DAC (trading up from Mystique v3 to EVO B4B 21) any day so then would be a good time to try the ENO, instead of with the
Mystique v3
DAC I have now. I will strongly consider trying it but I need to check on when the EVO is getting here - they were delayed by a part that was hard to get. |
I have emailed with Richard a couple of times and he has been very helpful. One question I had that I would be interested in hearing more about from this group of users is, whether any of you have tried the copper version of ENO and what you thought about it. I noticed the copper and silver versions cost the same and when I asked about it Richard told me they use a special copper and because of the costs they need to charge the same amount for the copper and silver versions. He basically said the silver version would be more versatile and better for me to order. I have not heard of anyone who has ordered the copper version and have not seen any feedback on how it differs in sound from the silver version. |
Been listening and comparing the sound through Roon with:
In both cases, the ENO was connected after a Bonn N8 switch and in front of the DejaVu server. My initial impressions remain unchanged in that both connections sound very good with the direct DejaVu>EVO connection resulting in a slightly fuller, more rounded presentation and the DejaVu>Ambre>EVO connection being slightly more incisive and dynamic. Some may describe it as musicality vs. clarity. The differences are slight but seem repeatable. However, there are other variables not least of which being the USB vs. AES/EBU connection at the DAC. If I had to select one option now, I would probably choose the direct DejaVu>EVO connection, without using the Ambre, as it seems the direct connection is slightly more musical and enjoyable on a wide range of material - but I could live with either. |
In working through my network connections, I have recently done some reading on switches. The more I read, the more skeptical I become about what is being marketed and sold as an "audiophile" switch, and the high prices of these switches. The thread on Audiophile Style titled "Uptone Ether Regen - English Electric 8 Switch Comparison" is interesting. I am left wondering whether any of these have value beyond that of a basic Netgear or TP-Link switch.
|
This recent exploration of my streaming set-up all started because I purchased the ENO Ag and a Network Acoustics network cable. A member here alerted me to this unit being for sale and I was fortunate to jump on it quickly. I have a Mojo Audio server/streamer (DejaVu) and their DAC (EVO B4B). I have a 45 foot long network cable from my router into the server and then USB into the DAC. I added the ENO ahead of the server, by first bringing the network cable into a Bonn N8 switch, then the Network Acoustics cable from the switch to the ENO, then the short network cable attached to the ENO into the server. The server runs Roon and serves as both the core and player. I stream both Tidal and Qobuz but the addition of Qobuz is recent. Even before trying the different set-ups, I thought the system sounded very nice, organic, full-bodied tone, and powerful, with good extension and staging. My initial opinion was that the ENO added something that made the music sound just a little more real somehow, but I haven't yet been able to point to one particular thing that causes that. My plan is to stick with it for some time and then take it out and decide whether I am missing anything. Leaving new stuff in for a while and then taking it out to assess differences has been a good method over the years for me to evaluate what I like the sound of. Right now I would say the ENO filter was a positive addition but I really don't know why yet until I listen more. The Mojo Audio stuff is built great, with outstanding power supplies, and both pieces use high quality I/O boards by JCAT such as this XE USB board. I suspect the already high quality pathway of my server/streamer and DAC have a lower need for corrections brought on by small add-on boxes. Even the ENO and their cables are certainly less than a revelation, but may be one of the few add-ons to make a positive difference. |
My experience too. I had switched back to 45 feet of Ethernet over the weekend and just switched back to fiber. Even with the two additional converter boxes (both with LPS) the slight effect was a very slight smoothing or taking an edge off but more to the positive than the negative and without losing detail or sparkle. Both sound good but I like the fiber just a touch better. |
Just added another small box. I have a DJM Electronics GigaFOILv4-INLINE Ethernet Filter on the way. I will probably position it immediately after my Bonn N8 switch and just before the Network Acoustics ENO, which is right before my server. The GigaFOILv4-INLINE uses Fiber Optic Isolation Link (“FOIL”) technology to prevent EMI from passing through the filter. I suspect my use of fiber in place of Ethernet cable is already effective at blocking EMI but I like the idea of having the GigaFOIL just in front of the ENO so I will give it a try and assess the results. I may also try going back to Ethernet in place of the fiber to assess whether the fiber is redundant with the GigaFOIL in place. |
Reevaluating my general philosophy that less is usually better, at least when it comes to digital stuff. The Gigafoil arrived so my digital chain is now,
With the exact same configuration, except without the Gigafoil, my system was sounding really good. The sound changed when I added the Gigafoil. An interesting change, maybe a bit more incisive. It still sounds very good but I need to listen more before making any better/worse judgements. I will probably move some power supplies around in order to have the best PS (HD Plex) just before the ENO. I may also move the Gigafoil and was wondering if just before the first converter on the upstream side may be a good spot. I sure have enough stuff now, so just a matter of moving it around to achieve the best sound. |
I am currently using a Triode Wire Labs Split Power & Data USB Cable that I found to match my tastes better than what I was getting from either the Curious or the Totaldac USB cables. It seems to provide a good balance of tone, body, detail, and dynamics. However, since I keep reading how much you guys like the USB III and since I have seen a couple of them for sale used lately, I am considering giving it a try. I still cannot bring myself to try the ENO filter since none of the small boxes I have tried made even a small improvement. Also, I wouldn't expect much from the ENO filter since I am running 45 feet of fiber and only about 1 foot of Ethernet cable into my streamer. |
I have the same Deja Vu server with the same JCAT NET CARD XE. I own both the eno and the muon (non PRO model) and both of those filters work fine with my server, coming out of a Silent Angel Bonn N8 Ethernet Switch. However, my internet service is only 200 mbs. Is your 1Gb/s Ethernet cable coming out of a switch that does not accommodate 100 mbs? I did have the same issue as you when I was running fiber through 1,000 mbs convertors and per Rich Truss at Network Acoustics, I had to purchase convertors that maxed out at 100 mbs. I did that and it then worked fine. I now run Ethernet directly from my router into the Bonn N8 switch and then into the muon. Based on the amber color of the light on the switch, it is only operating at 100 mbs into the muon, but it works and sounds just fine. I wish they would just stop coming out with new stuff for us to purchase. |