Springs under turntable

..I will look for some load more dense and compact than concrete..... :)

Bars of gold bullion perhaps?
😊😊

Lol@ Lewm.

As I said very unlikely but...
We have 6 cats and two of them are 20lb heavyweight contenders.
And at times they play rough....
I could see the 40lb combined weight at velocity hitting a speaker on springs and possibly dislodging said 75lb weight.

But as Mahgister stated, not a great idea for a common area setup which makes a lot more sense.

I would lose sleep imagining one or more of my cats splattered under a 75lb slab of concrete they knocked off the top of a speaker.......

Not likely I admit but who knows......

Tomic
He obviously became completely stumped when he reached Illinois.....

And Sh!te rolls downhill......

“Butte”, a nice town in Montana.

It is indeed!
I spent a very pleasant weeks vacation there as I figured it was the best location of a decent size town for exploring Yellowstone but it turned out to be very nice town in its own right!
Then onwards from there up and across to Washington state for a road trip

Tomic
I agree and have tried to direct it back to springs under turntable a few times, most recent was about 15 posts back last night.
But it keeps getting buried by unrelated topics.

Uberwaltz, if you could hear a proper system it would be the first thing you would be pursuing.

Mijo
That is right where you lose my attention.
The implications of that statement are that neither myself or anybody else here has a "proper system".
And to put it bluntly, I find that insulting and degrading.

Have a nice day.

Just to be fair to equalisation control here, our sadly departed Al was a proponent of the same and used some form of DBX control and he was very satisfied with it.
I do not remember the exact details of what he used but he did post about it numerous times.
So I would never say never and write it off entirely, just that at this time it is not something I will be pursuing.

To get back to the actual subject of this thread......

I experimented a little more with the pods under my 401 as it was still a little off balance to my eyes.

Now have 3 springs in left rear and 2 springs in the other 3 corners.
Had to go back to 4 pods as where the rear center needed to be was right where the motor cutout is.

Bass is still nice and tight and very detailed all round.

Mijo
I KNOW the windows are having a huge effect, hence the semi treatments to all of them.
Wood blinds on all of the side and back windows usually at 2/3 closed position.
Recent addition of heavy blackout curtains behind my gear and speakers on the large glass doors that open into the room, that had an even bigger impact than I expected.
But no I have no intention of getting any type of room control unit for this room atm.
I can live with ignorance is bliss because right now my listening experience is pure bliss!
Could it be better?
I am positive it can but small steps.

I think you just described my room Mijo, lol.

And which is why despite the too large amounts of glass it still works pretty well for me as my music room.

I would still think there maybe some slight differences but not sure how  you would start to prove it.

Mijo
To be fair we could be talking about two different types of concrete floor here.

You have the solid concrete floor like mine that is sitting on bedrock stones, dirt, whatever etc.
Then you have the concrete floor that is a platform so to speak and is suspended.
See link just as a FYI.

https://thermohouse.co.uk/blog/suspended-floors/

You will get two different results from the two different types of concrete floor.

I would have to agree that I am pretty impressed with how well they seem to have worked under my 401.
And the large SQ change that was easily audible with just a simple spring configuration change.
Hard to complain at $33........
So many thanks indeed to Noromance for bringing this thread to the forum.

@slaw 
Bass is probably one of the most personal details there is.
Everyone has their own idea of what is "right".

And that's all we can do, tune and tweak to our own satisfaction.

My meaning was that bass was reduced from previously where it was slightly overblown so it was a good thing.
Definitely a lot tighter all round in every aspect.
Pretty stoked for $33 so far!

Indran.
I had exactly the same when I put the pods underneath.
Fortunately the rack it is on has adjustment at bottom for leg height so was able to get the TT level again.
Just don't look at the rack.....lol.

Unbelievable......

Simple change by going  to one rear pod with three springs in sort of offset to left to take into account the motor weight.
Two pods at front with two springs mounted crosswise as MC suggested which is fairly stable.

High end details?
Now in spades!
Some reduction in bass but it's generally much tighter all round.

So obviously was not compressing the pods enough.

Most interesting and entertaining.

The big problem with just two springs is that it's now like a bike, only support on two 180 degree opposed points.
You really need three or four to be stable.
Try supporting your amp with two points.
You get the picture.
Now four pods means yes you can do it but it is very wobbly as I said even with them being compressed.

Two springs does not work as it just wobbles like jelly...lol.
So went to one spring in center.
That compressed the pods too much so back to three.
Interesting experience.

Nobsound springs arrived today ( day late).
Set up with just three springs in each pod and used four pods under the 401.
Checking compression and height of plinth it looks to be very even all round despite the fact that it has a pretty weighty motor at rearcenter left.

Immediate impression with an album I am familiar with is somewhat increased bass although possible it is a bit more muffled/ muddied.
But very early days yet.
Not sure as I would say I am noticing much more detail level increase but it’s certainly no worse.
Mids also feel a little fuller but again maybe not quite as "tight".
No other changes at this time like mats etc, just spring pods installed.

May set the other set of pods up with just two springs each and try that out.
My 401 is not as heavy as noromance and maybe need to compress these spring pods a bit more.

Mijo
I have looked at the Schroeder CB arm before.
However...$5k....
A wee bit more than I was thinking of spending.

Rick
Not wishing to hijack this spring thread but I am a rank amateur on vinyl compared to some of our more long term esteemed members here.
I have picked up a lot of information from those guys on these hallowed pages!
One word of warning, it is a very deep dark rabbit hole.....lol.

But quite simply the MA505LS( long series) is an 11" arm whereas the RB303 is a 9" arm so would need a different armboard to even think of trying that on the Avid.
But I probably never would as the 401 and MA505LS are both nice vintage pieces and belong together.

Now back to springs, mine are out for delivery today!

Hey Rick
Thank you for the kind words.
Three TT is definitely overkill but you only live once...lol

The clear acrylic platter on the Rega is an aftermarket one by Deep Groove, metal sub platter and Zaphire bearing. The original Rega plinth was sandwiched between two  slabs of MDF and then Walnut veneer over the top. Different motor and an IEC receptacle in back to take any PC, tonearm rewired with Cardas and terminated with a din plug underneath.
Yep its been hot rodded. and now it is set up as a mono TT with 2M Mono cart.

The 401 is in a substantial plinth with curly maple top ala the best guitars, lol. I modded the platter to add extra weight with stick on car wheel weights underneath it, added 2lb total. Micro Seiki MA505LS arm in immaculate fully functioning form.

The Avid is a very nice belt drive deck with outboard speed controller but stock with Rega RB303 arm and I honestly think it deserves a better one.

Favourite?

Very close call between the 401 and the Avid which is more likely choice of carts than anything else.

The 401 being idler drive always gives me the impression of more drive and dynamics and feel of life to the music, certain less charitable members here just say thats the rumble from the drive.
Whatever, they may be right but I do not care.

The Avid does indeed have very detailed highs and mids but seems to lose that certain something in "soul" of the music. It is possible a better arm would change the pecking order, oh well its only money!

For those who showed interest in the porcelain cones.
Ebay seller here.....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/INSULATOR-CONE-Porcelain-Ceramic-HAM-RADIO/264781306811?var=564605940024&hash=item3da6321bbb:g:jrQAAOSwzqtb8iCv

pretty sure all the 1" ones are gone as I think I bought all the stock they had left.......

If you look at the third or fourth pic on my system you can see the type of cones I am using under the GoldNote phonostage.

https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/6466

I may experiment with a couple springs under my phono or DAC but they will have their work cut out to beat the current porcelain ex ham radio 1" inverted cones under them right now.
These cost about 50 cents a pop from eBay and gave an astounding change in the level of detail and drop in noise floor.
This was documented in a thread by myself quite some time ago now.

Noromance.
How do you have the springs arranged under the plinth?
I know from picking up my 401 that the weight is also uneven in its distribution.

Try balancing a slab on top of a Spatial OB speaker.....😂😂
About a 3" wide piece of frame that holds the drivers in place is it.
But the outrigger legs do allow for 4 springs under each one so that is a possibility.

If the Nobsound springs do not work out under my 401 I will try them under my Spatial OB speakers.
One reason I ordered two sets... Options.

In addition to stiffness, I believe the issue may also include a component of compression/travel, which is related to the number of winds.

Correct Mitch.
When I bought mine I spent some time going through various spring calculators including coils per inch and wire thickness and wire material (which ALL affect compression ratio!), who knew there was so much involved in the humble spring!

Mijo
I have been looking at the MinusK but a lot of $$$
The Nobsound are a cheap experiment and as I said if I still cannot make them work to my taste under the 401 I have plenty of other pieces of gear to experiment with...lol
It will not be $65 wasted for sure.

Noromance 401 is pretty similar ( heavier as he has an aftermarket heavy platter, mine is a standard platter modded for extra weight) and I am sure comparing notes I can get close to what he has achieved so far

@noromance
I did keep the old springs I had under the 401 for weeks just to see if any change but it really never did, the return to solidity for want of a better word once they were removed was palpable.
Some members have rightly said I do not give changes enough of a chance, so this one got a more than adequate trial at the time.
Now I do agree with Mahgister that they were likely not compressed enough.
With the Nobsound I will be able to adjust that compression rate and should give a better idea of what might work.

Rix.
If you had asked when I bought them I would have had all of those answers as I researched it a fair bit.
Tbh now after 9 months or so since purchase I do not have that information to hand or memory... getting old ya know!

Yes I guess I could have mass loaded with something, not that I had or have anything that would likely fit the bill for that purpose lying around.
But worth some pondering for sure.

This is a sign the springs were probably under not enough compression.

I think you could well be right.
When sitting on them they only compressed maybe 1/3 possible not even that.
Hopefully with the adjustment available on the Nobsound springs I can tune it to my liking.
If not I can try them under other items.

Most interesting thread, read it all and it stayed 99.9% civil. Excellent considering the subject matter.

So about 6 months ago I experimented with springs under my 401 which is similar to noromance at about 55lb total weight.

There may have been a little more air at the top but to my ears it lost mid and bass impact. Not huge but enough to be noticeable.
Now to be fair these were springs I had bought on eBay after spending a lot of time with a spring calculator trying to make sure I got the best set-up.
Quite possibly I missed the mark.
Those springs are now under a sub.
Just ordered 2 sets of the Nobsound sets off Amazon at $32.99 a set.
These I can tune so now have options.
Many thanks guys!