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Don, I'm a coupler, too. These "devices" you're talking about are important. At least the composition of the alloys. I would call Audiopoints.com and ask to speak to Robert. He's the man over there. I know Tom (theaudiotweak) would disagree with me, but I couple right to the wood floor. I believe it facilitates a more effective resonance transference. I don't know if you'll be able to do those "devices" for the $ you want, but check out their website. As far as your "speaker stand coupling"--why don't you tell us a little 'bout what you've got there? peace, warren |
http://www.audiopoints.com/audiopoints.html
(coupling disks) work great, I've used them for several years. |
You could try doing it for twelve cents... |
Ahh Synchronicity! I just got some Atacama nexus 24" speaker stands and have the exact same problem. Those of you with experience and wisdom please enlighten us. |
Warrenh said: "... As far as your "speaker stand coupling"--why don't you tell us a little 'bout what you've got there?"
OK, not sure what you're looking for here, so I'll be complete.
I have an EAD UD 2000 CD player and a Plinius 8200 Mk II integrated sitting on a metal frame component rack with threaded spikes (not currently attached).
I have the Linn Sara speakers sitting on Linn stands. The Sara's are coupled directly to the top of the stands with the stands' "upward" spikes (so this is not the problem). The stands also have threaded spikes at the bottom (also not currently attached).
I would prefer not to spike the wood floor. So I was thinking maybe to use the spikes with these discs I've been hearing about (I know this is old hat to you guys). First I was wondering if this concept is even feasible. Secondly, if it is feasible, suggestions on specifically which discs to use and where to get them (at $5 apiece) would be welcomed. I am concerned about the coupling between the spikes and the discs. Are there many discs with soft metal centers? And thirdly, any other ideas would also be welcomed. I've had the coin idea suggested before, but it doesn't seem like this would provide very good coupling between the floor and the coin itself. Any more thoughts on that?
Thanks
Don |
Hi Don,
Your gear is nicer than mine, but I thought I'd share what I did with my Celestion S300's (floorstanders). My goal was to reduce "boominess", so I guess you could say I was after "decouplng". My speakers resonated too much when sitting on the floor.
First I cut a piece of plywood the size of the bottom of each speaker, and set the spikes on that. Didn't do anything for me.
Then I did the penny thing. I used a drill to make a little divot in the center of each penny to keep the spike centered. The coupling between the floor and the coin didn't seem to be a problem -- these speakers are heavy, and they come down hard on those sharp points! This gave me a noticeable improvement in sound.
What I have now is (don't laugh) 2 long pieces of stick-on felt on the bottom of each speaker. Sounds better than having the speakers on the floor, but not quite as good as the pennies. The big advantage is that I can slide the speakers around on the floor without scratching it. This is a big plus, when I really want to listen, I slide the speakers way out into the room. Also I get to tweak toe-in and separation. I could never leave them this way, too much traffic in the house. I gain more from the good speaker positioning than I lose.
Best of luck, I'm curious to hear what you find.
- Eric |
Soft chewey centers? What are you guys talking about? If it is lead or sand they are damping components. Lead and sand and rubber are storage devices. These materials do not transfer the resonant energy many of you are voicing, rightfully so, that you want to rid your system of. To rid your system of noise and accoustic glare you must transmit the nasties to ground! If you dampen it or absorb it, it will only come back to stab you in the ear later. This stored energy will come back to haunt you either by robbing your music of lost dynamics or by releasing the nasties at a different time and frequency. If you really want to hear your equipement for the first time and hence the music, you must couple, not isolate or dampen. I use Sistrum APCD coupling discs on top and under all wooden surfaces that I place Sistrum Platforms or Audiopoints. Don... these are devices that I feel are fundamentally correct, beyond any other, and therefore represent a great value. Because they work so well, you will keep them in your system all the while replacing speakers and electronics. Tom |
>What I have now is (don't laugh) 2 long pieces of stick-on felt on the bottom of each speaker...
I didn't laugh, but I sure smiled. I have done the same thing to the bottom of my furniture. The normal room set up is not condusive to listening. The listening set-up is not at all appealing for daily living. I am constantly sliding the couch around on the living room floor. 8-)
>Soft chewey centers?...
Now here I laughed! And thanks for your insights. From your post, it's clear that you are a proponant of coupling and I'm with you on that principle. But it was not clear to me whether you agree that the "spikes on discs on wood floors" approach achieves coupling. Please remember, this type of stuff is new to me. At this point, it would just be nice to get affirmation that my "spikes on discs" approach for speakers isn't out in left field in the first place.
I was assuming that the lead was a part of the particular discs I saw to keep cones from sliding off a harder, flat surface. I suppose it's possible that various disc designs have a centered divots to allow pointy things to rest on them safely? I am not at all familiar with the various discs available themselves (I'm tracking these suggestions, but haven't researched them yet).
Thanks
Don |
I second the audiopoints advice - the coupling discs are 6.99 per unit but worth it. But be warned, if you slide the discs on a hardwood floor, they can scratch the finish as well, as I learned... |
Don, granted, spiked speakers, even on discs, are a bit of a pain in the ass to move around. It'll be worth the pain, though. Remember, if you decide you want to couple, as Tom said, don't place anything in the path of the resonances. Nothing!--not even blue tak, felt, or the like. Audiopoints.com has plenty of white paper on their website explaining the principles of resonance transference. It's worth the trip; and a phone call. peace, warren |
Don, I have found it best to use the Audiopoint APCD discs from Starsound under the points of speakers rather than having the point go directly into the wood. Beause of the shape of the disc, more resonance is captured off the point and transfered over a wider contact area and onto the wood suface. I use these discs on all soft surfaces. This method is the best way to capture and transfer resonance to ground. Tom |
Try solid granite, 2 inches thick, cut to the size of your speakers. They did wonders for my Thiel 1.6, and they look good. |
Hi Don:
I have a pair of Kef Q5 floorstanders that stand on threaded spikes. Our living room, which is where the stereo is located, has a laminate floor, essentially HDF with a layer of vinyl/laminate made to look fake hardwood.
Anyway, I had also been wondering about how best to resolve the spikes issue, since they had sunk a bit into the laminate. I purchased "IXOS 304 layer discs" and, while not dramatic, I did detect an improvement in the overall quality of the sound coming from the speakers, a little more focus, detail and clarity. Also, no more damage to the floor.
IXOS is a British manufacturer of audio cables and accessories (including discs and spikes). I bought the discs from an on-line shop with a warehouse in England: www.hificables.co.uk. The price for a set of 8 discs came out to about $30 US. They were shipped quickly and were well packed.
Something that is not obvious from the pictures on the web site is that the discs have a thin layer of polyfoam on the bottom that has a coat of adhesive that can be exposed by removing the covering layer of wax paper. I did not do this since I like to be able to slide the speakers around a little.
Good luck.
Max |
Don, I posted a similar question recently. Warren and several others gave me the same advice -- try Audiopoints' coupling discs. I ordered a set and they arrived this week. I put them in place and noticed a definite improvement. I asked my wife to listen and she noticed the same thing -- clearer highs and mids, less muddiness in the sound. They're worth a try. Thanks to the "couplers" out there for the good advice. |
I would call Audiopoints.com and ask to speak to Robert. He's the man over there... I don't know if you'll be able to do those "devices" for the $ you want, but check out their website... I can't access their website - I don't have shockwave installed (yes I know I'm behind the times). Can I have the phone number please. Thanks Don |
Star Sound Tech.
Robert
877-668-4332 |
For now, I just decided to go ahead and place the spikes directly into the floor. I'm working on upgrading so many other pieces in my system (wire, cable, cords, power conditioning) that I've decided that this kind of thing needs to be experimented with last - and in the mean time, the stock spikes are the best, quick improvement. I might add some weight to the speaker stands too and see what that does. In any case, I just wanted to say thanks to all who have replied with advice in this thread.
Don |
