Speaker distance

I see your Isotek CD and raise you two XLO Test CDs. Get the original. Get the one the pros use. It doesn’t cost an arm and a leg, either.

The Isotek CD does not (rpt not) contain a speaker placement track. Nice try.

Is there an echo in here? I already said what’s required is a comprehensive program of the XLO Test CD, room treatments and tweaks. Obviously things change for speaker placement as things progress. At any point in time the track on the XLO CD, all things being equal, can determine the ABSOLUTE BEST locations, whereas other even very good methods can only find local maximums.

alkaloid
Geoffkait, is the signal both in and out of phase pink noise?

No

Where can I buy this test disc?

ebay

The BIG advantage to the XLO Test CD OUT OF PHASE TRACK is that it’s specifically for locating the speaker positions and is explained as you go along by the guy on the track as well in the booklet. It’s not obvious how to use the OUT OF PHASE TRACK so I can’t recommend a generic out of phase track unless that particular CD also EXPLAINS how to use the track for setting up speakers. If it does, I’m down. On the other hand I just explained how to use an OUT OF PHASE TRACK so you might be good to go. The IN PHASE Track is used to determine if the system is actually in correct phase/polarity only. The OUT OF PHASE track is for speaker placement.

That’s a tough one. One reason why it might appear that speaker distance varies according to the recording is because the venues of the various recordings are all different. You are supposed to hear those differences, no? In terms of space, soundstage, ambience, etc. And the differences should actually be MORE APPARENT if the speakers are placed in the absolute best locations. And that can ONLY be done with a careful long term program of room treatment plus the fabled XLO Test CD speaker placement track IMHO.

Maybe so. Maybe not. I didn’t say all speakers should be close together. What I said was one needs to start off with speakers closer together and work outwards. Otherwise, you’ll miss the sweet spot. My point was people tend to assume farther apart is better so they place them as far apart as they can in their room. Besides it all depends. You obviously can’t have 11 feet between them in a small size room. It also depends on how far from room boundaries they should be. Capish?

@geoffkait

Can you describe (in writing here in this thread) how this track "works" in order that it is "fool-proof"?

Thanks.

>>>>>The XLO Test CD speaker location track is the OUT OF PHASE track. You have already determined that your system is in correct phase using the previous IN PHASE track. The objective of the OUT OF PHASE track is to allow incremental movement of the speakers until the sound of the voice on the track sounds like it’s coming at you from all around the room, I.e., completely diffuse. If the speakers are not (rpt not) in the absolute best locations, the voice will sound like it’s coming at you from a particular direction. The caveat here is that *completely diffuse sound* is very difficult or impossible to achieve without room treatment. Which is why I suggested a program of the XLO Test CD AND room treatment. Rome wasn’t built in a day. 😛

Thus, the reason I say this XLO Test CD method is fool-proof is because there is only ONE solution, only one set of speaker locations where you will get the sound coming at you from all around the room, instead of any particular direction, whereas the trial and error technique of moving a little, listening a little can only result in good locations but not the best locations. Without some room treatment it might be difficult or impossible to achieve this state of Nirvana. As room anomalies are discovered and addressed the sound will get better. And the sound will be perceived as more diffuse on the out of phase track.

There are details in the XLO Test CD instructions how to move each speaker incrementally according to the diffusion pattern you hear on the OUT OF PHASE TRACK.

WHEN THE SOUND IS THE MOST DIFFUSE ON THE OUT OF PHASE TRACK IT WILL BE THE MOST FOCUSED AND COHERENT WHEN PLAYING RECORDINGS THAT ARE IN THE CORRECT PHASE/POLARITY ON A SYSTEM THAT’S ALSO IN CORRECT PHASE.

I would be remiss if I didn’t say that there’s an infinite number of speaker locations for a given room, so obviously the ye olde trial and error method can only get you so far. You can NEVER find the absolute best locations that way.

What is needed is a long range plan that involves both finding the optimum locations for the speakers given a constant listener location and degree of room treatment. (It is not unusual to discover the listener position is located smack dab in a standing wave.) The XLO Test CD Speaker Placement track is a fool-proof method for determining OPTIMUM locations for ANY room and for ANY degree of room treatment, including no room treatment, for a constant listener position.

But as more and better room treatments are added, the optimum speaker locations will probably change, as the radiation patterns, reflections, echo locations, etc. are modified. So as things progress, the XLO Test CD should be used in conjunction with a program of room treatment, as well as the addition of other tweaks or upgrades that affect the overall sound. Trying to listen a little, move a little can only find local maximums, not the real absolute maximum. It’s like trying to solve 3 simultaneous equations in 5 unknowns. 😬

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again — almost all speakers are too far apart. The speaker placement track on the XLO Test CD points out that, all things being equal, one should start out about 4 feet apart and slowly work outward. You don’t want to miss the sweet spot. 😛 Folks often instinctively think wider apart means wider soundstage but that’s an Old Wive’s Tale. 😃 Ditto toe in. It all depends, it depends a lot on room treatments, for one.