"Met the requirements". Nuff said! Why not find another hobby?
Well I have never heard your speakers so I cant comment but I know the design philosophy as well as the target audience and it aint me.
|
djones,
Has your side of the aisle ever asked you to stop helping them? In your entire life have you ever produced an applicable analogy? |
edgewound is a musician. Explains a ton based on my experience with musicians especially those who play through amplification.
To some a little knowledge is a wonderful thing and to others a curse. Those who dont know what they dont know are a bane.
So typical to call for the removal of comments you dont like, especially when these offensive comments are no worse that others that jumped from your keyboard moments earlier.
Stay as long as you like edgewound, but perhaps you should quit while you are behind.
|
Since when does success in any educational system equate to intelligence or overall ability?
Was a time when the U.S. was good at teaching kids how to think. Now instead of facts we have opinion and social indoctrination. Public schools of course, cant speak to private. |
What is hearing but perception?
One side cant prove its point because there is no consensus on the validity of measurement. In fact there is no consensus on what you should measure.
The other side, which I support, cant prove anything either due to the significance of the individual experience. Difference is that we are not telling you to stop measuring and to migrate to our camp. Fact is we dont care which puts us in a much more enviable position.
Just dont tell us what we hear and attribute it to soft science. Also dont tell us that there is no variability in the ability to hear. |
The ability to measure only tells a very small amount about the complexity of this process. Mahgister brings up a good point about djones in that he does seem like one of the people in the pod on The Matrix. |
But djones is ready to pass this audible phenomenon over to bias. Perhaps also imagination. How would you like to live in that type of world? Tidy but dismal.
So according to his last post, he allows for a variation in how individuals hear? Could he also be allowing for a variation in the process of hearing? Is it physical/mechanical or is it chemical or both? If he allows for variation he has dug himself a very deep hole.
|
I love the term "science sound". So funny how words like science, engineers, measurements, test equipment, etc simply appeal to certain people. Comforting like an old soft blanket. Perhaps reassuring in that it encourages them often to spend less. I have been listening seriously for over 3 decades and I just dont see the point in questioning what I hear. I still am working on differentiating different from better which is an exercise which is fun but taxing.
The thing that I find so interesting is the notion that certain people hear better than others seems anathema to some. Some on this site seem completely unable to accept the fact that their hearing may be inferior. Certainly one of the first things I would consider if someone claimed to hear something that I didnt. As if differences in the acuity of senses went against some evolutionary absolute.
|
Question is what is the actual name of the person with all the different monikers? I can only think of one industry person who is such a cable denier. |
yesiamjohn,
Why do you think it is a good thing that cable enthusiasts spend their money on cables and not the things that really matter? How would this make things better for you? How exactly is what you buy going to be cheaper and more abundant as a result of our buying decisions? Did your group ever consider that you might be wrong and keeping others from enjoying the benefits of things that have been identified incorrectly as snake oil? An incredibly stupid thing to say.
others,
I can just see those in your group mentoring a new enthusiast who just bought a more expensive cable. This new person thinks he has discovered something great which made his system sound better and is excited. Along come the snake oiler crowd and to follow is a verbal beratement which instills in this new person: buyers remorse, a unnecessary questioning of ability and the experience, frustration, anger and resentment. And many of you guys are angry feeling that somehow you have avoided the cable grifters and the numerous other pitfalls of high-end audio.
The objectivists are nothing more than a tribe, but the difference is you guys are a tribe of people whose focus is to tell people how and why they are wrong. Further you are telling others to doubt their senses when audio is a sensory experience. Guys I am perfectly happy to waste my money on the things that I think make a difference. I dont care that I may be enriching some snake oil salesman if in the process it brings me more enjoyment. I cant believe you dont see the difference in maturity of our 2 camps.
|
Well I knew this would be the response. The directionality of wire is not really what is important in this discussion. I really dont care, but the idea that someone who diminishes the personal experience as paramount in this hobby and is talking about a universal reality is very concerning. Because you are so quick to dismiss indicates to me that you are in no position to mentor anyone. The fact that you close your mind to other possibilities automatically disqualifies you as an objective source of information. You would portray your opinions as facts and quote some propeller head and to add credence.
Again lets compare experience and systems. Or do you believe that all systems are equally resolving? The fact that you are digital only is very telling as is my preference for vinyl. |
djones,
You mentioned "facing reality"! Which reality? To which objective and universal realities do you subscribe?
You mention learning from experience. I think this is especially funny coming from you. I would bet the farm on the fact that you have significantly less experience comparing and listening to the things you discuss on this forum than most of the subjectivists. What else can I expect from anyone that would buy a speaker on measurements alone.
Again discuss how long you have been listening and give me a peek at your system.
You just dont understand and absent this understanding I dont think you will allow yourself any more joy than you have already experienced because you are convinced you cant trust YOUR senses. Problem is that you are telling us that we cant trust ours either. I know misery loves company but give us a break! |
I agree, edgewound is either completely clueless or he is simply stirring the pot. It indicates to me a complete lack of understanding regarding the fundamentals of sound and the more sublime aspects of reproduction. Pearls before swine.
I think it will be hard for djones to come back from "met the requirements". So telling of a particular thought process that apparently is hard to shake.
|
Read up on the Genelec stuff and it is all active powered by Class D. I have found the only use for Class D, from listening, is as a woofer amp. I also notice a metal dome tweeter also something that traditionally I dont like. But, you never know. I actually like the idea of active speakers provided they use very good amplification. Certainly not much cheaper than the high end audio stuff even with internal amplification.
|
Years ago at CES I hear an active German speaker 4 way with early class D probably ICE modules that sounded much better than it should have and so much better I would guess than it would have if this design was passive. I also always favored the active ATC speakers and never liked their passive designs. These experiences have stayed with me many years later and have served as a model of the viability of active speakers. |
edgewound,
Why should anyone explain anything to you? You havent earned the right. What good would it do!
carlsbad,
I always heard that the directionality of a passive cable is due to the direction it comes off the spool. Not saying I agree with this, but just saying. |
My brother knows a guy who has a PhD. in Physics. |
I like: Silversmith, Inakustik, Black Cat and for value Analysis Plus. What I have heard from Purist was also extremely good. The best small company cable I have heard is Bionics Cable which may have to be made to order. |
Yeah but he used Audioquest once and didnt hear any improvement. It isnt his opinion it is his attitude. |
