Snake oil, fraud, confirmation bias


It is becoming increasingly apparent that many threads about legitimate topics devolve into one or more of the contributors here making claims of snake oil, fraud, or confirmation bias thereby derailing the conversation beyond the valid and relevant thread topic and this is getting ridiculous. For anyone here who honestly holds the position that there is snake oil and fraud in the world of Music Reproduction Systems I challenge them to prove their claims in court it should be an easy task based on the claims they make here in Audiogon  AND they will make a fortune because in the US once proven they can file a class action suit and profit enormously from the efforts of others to deceive. These people regularly claim that "there is no evidence" that things such as cables or fuses make a difference when in actual fact Audiogon is filled with evidence that these things make very real differences in Music Reproduction Systems of course those who claim fraud reject that evidence as "confirmation bias" but in absence of any documentation from them they are only repeating the claim they have made so many times that has been refuted many times here by those who have demonstrated to there satisfaction that they make a difference.   I think in actual truth the real fraudsters here are those that repeatedly make these claims of snake oil and fraud and often they have no experience to back up there claims they simply say the claims are impossible!
clearthink

Showing 3 responses by shadorne

This is not necessarily my view but it presents an interesting point of view which adds to this discussion. The whole thing is about the authors view on snake oil - so quite relevant and on topic.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m7ERMu825m4
Measurements dont apply to the enjoyment of roses or a meal but the roses may be carefully grown in a measured and controlled way and the meal prepared with measured ingredients and use of heat as well as technique.

The subjectivists continually confound measurements used to rigorously engineer and test high fidelity equipment and sound reproduction to the feeling one gets from listening to Mahler or Mozart. These are two entirely different aspects and conflating them is just the consequence of a feeble mind.

Of note the Snake Oil purveyors constantly appeal to subjective elements that are associated with our perception of music rather than stating a performance specifcation for what their Snake Oil actually does in a measurable way. This is deliberate and it works well but only on feeble minds.
It is great to see folks challenging wild claims and marketing hype. This is very healthy. This should be encouraged. Those who hear something different in instances when they really shouldn't, have an awful lot to learn.

Here is an article about menus and how they affect people’s perception

.http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20171120-the-secret-tricks-hidden-inside-restaurant-menus

People who deny that this clever expectation setting marketing hype (even when not true at all) has any affect on them are just fooling themselves.