SET Shootout China VS The USA

Does the 2A3 amp have 2 output tubes (2A3) per channel? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Yes two 2A3 tubes per channel, vs his single per channle UX50 tube (aka ux250) 2A3 3.5 watts x 2 = 7 watts per channel vs his UX50 at 6 watts per channel He has pure cobalt out trans, vs the chinese 2A3 outs which no doubt considering what I paid fo the amp are the low grade Z11 steel. But 2x’s the weight of his cobalt trans. the UX50 hasa 12AU7 + a 6BH7 (?) , lights up like a christmas tree, niceee. I prerfer AX. , So its going to be close. If I find the 2A3 has a bit too much roll off on bass/highs,, I might have to sell and eventually get the Muzishare R100 845, but that will be 2 yrs off. I have the speakers which detect nuances in amplifaction. My speakers register every miniscle going on in amplifaction. Even cd/DAC shootouts. Dual FR are revealing. Also keep in mind we will have stock 2A3’s running. So even if bass/highs are a bit rolledd, there’s always hope the Psvane ACME 2A3’s (like $600 + ship + louisiana Tax, ) might give up some better fq’s in the band width. If so, then we might have a keeper, a winner. I’m definetly a SET audiophile as of now. PP are wonderful amplifaction. Its just that SET’s have a certain magical spell. Its like you got a fix and now you are hooked like a dope junkie. I see SET’s as the future , as 1st choice. SETs get the Cuban Cigar, PP’s well, get the buds.

 

~~~In 20 yrs~~~~~~

~~~~it will be all SET’s.~~~

~PP will not be in production.

~~No buyers.

~Something like that.

Hey Larry, I'll run by, your ideas over with my tech, see whats going on.

OK Acresverde mentioned a  FR system w/o woofer may not appeal to other audiophiles whose music requires a  deeper bass response.

WEll with a  PP type  SET, maybe this will azllow adding a  woofer in the system. But not sure if the added ohm will  be too much on the 2A3's.

I was running dual 8 ohms FR + 8 ohm tweeter,,and 1 of the UX250's went dark, and  is new stock. 

Have to get  with my tech who built the amp, perhaps its not the ohm over load, maybe something other.

But this is what I have to consider here.

can a  2A3 tube handle dual FR + dual tweeters..is this asking too much.

Although the  center trans on the UX250 was not running hot with 3 8 ohm drivers,, maybe the tube was being over loaded.

So its possible  my dual FR speaker may not work with a  SET,,or perhaps this 2 tubes per channel, PP design allows for more ohm load.

hard to say at this point.

My tech even mentioned **yeah go ahead and put a  single W18 mid along with the system..**,, Saying it can handle the ohm load.

All this has to be  worked out. Good thing in this testing is that if a  stock tube goes dark, no big loss. 

I will run the stock tubes for 6 months witha  dual FR, dual tweter, thats 8 phms x4,, and see how the tubes hold up, /heat on center trans.

BEFORE I order Psvane ACME 2A3's which I would not wish to risk early burn out at 600/pair.

If there is trouble, we can try a  single FR/tweeter and use this  amp as for light chamber.

More complex big orchestra like Schnittke symphonies, we can run the Defy  which can easily handle a  bunch of drivers. 

Back to the idea that 2 tubes per channel offers a  better sound vs the Defy's 6. With 6 tubes, you have a  beefier  trans , opening up the path for dual FR + dual tweeters and a  woofer for techno , heavy metal, grunge and any other slam driver music you  care to hear.

So sems  there is a  place for PP power. 

All these things have to be tested and worked out.

Stay tuned.....

Side note the Defy has 2 ohms on top of trans, but somewhere I read , the amp needs to be adjusted to bring it to 2 ohms. 

My tech does not want to make any mods in this circuit.

Again, what may happen  with dual FR + dual tweeters is over load not so much on the center trans, but  may affect/shorten the life of the 12 KT88's, which is not a  good thing, 12 tubes runs me $600. 

Stay tuned.....

enjoying the PP tube amps.

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

OK yet have these enjoyers of PP amplification, heard a SET amp,,,with the *right* speaker?? This is the Q we must ask.. Let me say this , w/o dogamticism, w/o being pushy and over opinionated... IMHO, in my very limited exp, SETs give a more quieter sound field and a FR also gives a more quiter soundstage, Add these 2 together,,and what do you have?? This is what I am trying to express. Again, my opinion might change as further testing and experimentations continue. I know some of you have 2 systems just for the resaons I stated. But again , seems to my exp, a FR speaker will deliver nuances a xover low sens speaker fails at. My Thor cabinets just went out to the trash. This is the very same speaker that Joseph Audio lists at $12,000. Mine was superior, i had all high end Mundorf caps in the xover,, cost me $1100+ just the xovers. Gone and will never ever conisder a xover low sens speaker ever again in my life. Thus no need whatsoever for a PP amp. back to my original opinion, PP amps are not necessary. I’m stubborn in this belief.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but your new Chinese amp is a push-pull amp, not a single ended amp. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ You know I was wondering about this.. if it was actually a PP...?? Went and ordered in secret w/o telling my tech, ordered on binge late at night,,, hummm, I thought all SET type tubes were SET amplification. hummm, wait til my tech finds out... **I told you soooo*. His famous line. hummm, well, ,,, hummm. uploading new video on the UX250,, Sophie Milman, bass check, Highs check. No roll offs. Goes to show, what we’ve read about FR from decades of **dis-information** is simply just not true. I was wondering,, dual 2A3’s, and I read on descrip of other amps with dual 300B tubes mention of a PP type design. Lets hope we have the super linear midrange in this amp. Yes it is in fact the Yaquin. New upload soon, what you hear in the video is as close as to being in the room. Not sure why folks can’t hear fidelity in my latest FR speaker uploads, vs the older Seas Thor uploads, which indeed had distortion. The Sony cam picked up the distortions of the Seas Excel drivers. But clearly if you can’t hear pure linear, clean mids in the video,, well then I can’t help you

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Just cked

SINGLE ENDED. Not a  PP circuit.

 

WEll sure, I'm very curious about Jadis' new KT170 tube design. 

I mean stunning.

 Some folks are raving about the KT150, now along comnes the KT170. But honestly, the EL34, KT88 , KT120 sounded near identical to my ears.

Its my guess the 150, 170 ain't gonna be **that** much different froma  El34 soundstage.

But when it comes to SET tube amplifaction, the nuance differences are more platable, more **nuanc-ED*

A 845 is going to  sound dif from a  2A3, ~~~whereas a  KT170, vs EL34, behind the cutain testing,,,can you guess which is which??

In certain recordings with  a very accurate, zero coloration speaker,, perhaps my tech can make the lucky guess.

I could not between his Allen Organ amp (fantastic amp!!) with KT120l s and his EL34 amp he designs.

Both very close,, with the Thor spaekers,, I had not heard both with my brand new Dual FR system...again,, these things need proper testing... 

 

Defy with new EH88's, vs UX250 vs 2A3,, all these thinsg will have to tested  with some general conclusions.

 

But it is  common acceptance, a  SET has some lenear magic in the midrange which not even Jadis' KT170 will be able to match.

Of course in dynamics, the KT170 might  surpass a  SET amp such as the big bad 845.

Power vs power. 

any-hoot, Here's my latest, I can tell you there is no roll off witha  good recording.

Plenty of bass, highs in this test. 

SIX lil old watts!!!!!

= are PP dated amplifiction?  now that we have new higher tech FR speakers avaliable. 

THe Coral beta 8 was good, but we have much better now.

Which makes the big power of a  PP amp, not really necessary. 

 

Just my opinion

 

 

 

btw just looked at another listing of the amp, says its both **SET and PP circuit..** , having my tech figure that one out.

can't be both SET and PP at the same time. ,,huh???

So Mozartfan where have you been the KT170 has been out for a while and the Audio Hungary Qualiton X200 has been shipping with them for a year. Quite the lovely tube in mu X200. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ WOW , just found out surfing Jadis;' site,., I had no idea other manufacturers were employing this incredible looking tube. Lucky you. But again, the tube looks to be something like a bigger KT150, which looks to be a larger KT120, and so on, so forth. vs a SET tube, each has quite different characteristics in build and performnace. IMHO there's less nunaces betwix each KT's vs SET tubes voicing. What I am saying if the speaker running a EL34 amp, and then we place the KT170 on the speaker,,, does the speaker pick up the nuances of each tube?? This is my point. The speaker has to be sensitive enough to voice the character dif of each KT type,,,in soundstage nuances. Xover style speakers sound the same no matter which KT tube is in the power slot.

Is this you in the video? How does one reach that turntable? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~haha Yes the Philips , can’t recall the model # , bought it from my tech’s stash,, have not used it as yet, Bought a whole bunch of INCREDIBLE super rare classical sym/chamber LPs. But have to get with tech , show me how to use the player,, Honestly it was back in the 70’s since last useage of a DUAL turn table.. The player was in fact higher up,, I just lowered it. So I was thinking,,, pondering PP vs SET + what speakers,, OK got it. Here is how i see/hear thihgs. As we know most Audiogon members have ss and PP amplifaction, Very few SET. owners here

 

 

What I want to emphasize is a SET amp, absoluet must have a FR speaker. a SET amp will not work with a xover /low sens style speaker. So if anyone is interested going/trying SET amplifaction, ,,I strongly suggest, figure the FR speaker FIRST, but the speaker 1st, THEN and ONLY then buy the SET. Do not put the horse before the cart. man I am hoping for the best with the 2A3 amp, ,,but have no idea how it will perform. Glad you agree with my tech, that a pair of KT’s in each channel is best design for a PP. WOW consider Jadis’ JA200 monos, like 12 tubes per channel!! What would be funnyk, if the Electro harmonix KT88 s perform up to some of the reviews I’ve been reading about that manufacturer.

 

The Gold Lion KT88’s I found a bit dull in mids. I bought the Svetlana as thtas what jadis initially had in the amp, I sold the NOS off as new for like $350 all 12 tubes.

Lets see if this PP amp has some something to offer with new tubes,,late July on that testing. Have lots of new Mundorf high end caps/F&T’s and Takman Rey resistors. maybe new tubes wll unlock some magic hidden in this amp. that would be unreal. If there is sparkles in the highs and gorgeous lows,, well then maybe i will have to reconsider my opinions on SET’s vs PP. All these things need testing.

 

~~~~~~~~~~The only thing holding my testing experiements  right now is the ^^^cash^^^ factor.

All the best, Nonoise ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Perfect imagery for how a PP amp channels the music,, PUSH -pull-push-pull, fast on starightaways, slowER on the turns vs a SET's straight musical pathway,,, easy going, pure linearity. As someone imagined the sound field, like angels singing. SETs offera more pure sound field/ PP accents the musical energy = dynamics. But the dynamics can **tend to be** noisey and pollute the quite background. SET sound reminds me of the dark outer space in a desert night sky.

My tech is havinga hard time figuring out the yaquin ’s design, is ita SET of PP... , he’s saying stuff I dont understand,,and honestly i don’t think he understands what Yaquin is up to with this circuit.

He says **now you have 2 PP amps***

I don’t believe him, The 2A3 tube is NOT a KT tube.

I bought the amp for

1) not over 60 lbs, my back lift limit

2) in my budget

3) has my 2 fav pre tubes, AX and AU.

we will see.

EDIT>>>

Just cked the tube data, 

If indeed this is a  PP type circuit,, then I win.. 

Its likea  WIN/WIN amp .

Has best of both circuits, Not a  pure SET , low wattage, neither big power KT PP circuit.

wow, my lucky day

AB1PP says, 

Self Bias , wopping 10 watts per tube x 2 = 20 watts per cahnnel..My tech was say ing before he found out it is PP, last week, *ohh thats a  very low watt tube at 3.5 watts, you may find it lacking dynamic punch..*

 

haha

My lucky day.

 

jerryg123’s avatar jerryg123742 posts 12-14-2021 7:05pm So Mozartfan where have you been the KT170 has been out for a while and the Audio Hungary Qualiton X200 has been shipping with them for a year

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Hey Jerry did you note Qualiton’s 833 tube SET and their new 813 SET amps?? wowo, off the charts unreal. wow https://www.atelier13-usa.com/tube-amps-by-power-tube

 

 

 

Hi, well,, I must say,,, actually I need a cold bucket dump,,haha. OK, got ya

WEll, in my limited audio world, thats bass in the Sophie Milman tracks.

 

 

 

Tell ya what, Stevie Wonder has a track on Inner Visions,, where the moog makes the woofers move 2-3 inches of solid slam sub- bass...maybe I will upload a quickie after this post,...I did upload a Elliott Carter score for FOUR!!! Timpini,, but this was with the Seas Thor demo.

Did not come off accurate,, the Sony cam had the timpini all distorted.

I’ll try again with the dual FR.

well, OK, so in my book, 40hz, is rock bottom. I am not least bit interested below 40hz.

So I give up the **real** bass(as you say..)) but I gain super midrange, why?

NO xovers,,WINNER

Higher sensitivity = Winner again

Double win.

PLUS its point source vs a tower like Sonus Faber, Dali, Rockport, Wilson, 3-6 drivers..

FR has decent bass/mids, nice highs all comming froma SINGLE driver.

Niceee sweetttt.

It beats me why FR has not been given their day in the sunshine.

I see Fr as the ultimate musical exp for light jazz, blues, classical.

The genres you mention, perhaps not such as 1st choice.

This is how I hear things.

Rolled off? In a 10x15 room, 60 SPL, near field, all sounds pretty good to my ears.

vs xover designs which I have issues with,, as you guys know. I am xover/low sens speakers most fierce critic

So i expect the same criticisms to come from yoyr camp against FR types.

I get that.

 

EDIT,,, was off to upload the intro to Stevie Wonders track off InnerVisions,, and realized that 1 UX250 tube went dark.

Trust me if a record has bass , these dual FR’s will deliver the goods.

8 + 6 inch cones, rockin N rollin with bass, as long as its in the actual record.

+ if I really want bass I’ll hook up the Defy with 12 Mundorf SESGO .47 caps, = will shred to confetti the wood cones in both FR speakers.

@ 12 oclock on the vol pot.

If we pushed the Defy hard, it would destroy Wilson’s biggest 8 speaker tower.

The towers would start to walk,, you

’d have to replace all woofers.

 

 

Mozart FYI there is such a thing as a parallel SET amp using two, or more, tubes per channel perhaps that's what your amp is? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Yes my tech is trying to explain what to expect. He mentions that my Jadis DPL linestage is SET, and the pre section of the Defy is SET, then out [ut stage on the Defy is PP. so then, there is no such thing as pure SET circuit, neither pure PP circuit. That a PP does have linearity midrange and a SET also can emply dual tubes to become a PP circuit... huh?? well we learn something new every day in this hobby. Tech was saying the other day, I might not like the 2A3 as its only 3.5 watts. Now if we see this amp is a PP circuit this bumps up the wattage to 10 watts per tube on a self bias AB1 circuit. Auto bias says 15 watts, self bias 10 watts..??why?? Got to go over with tech on that one. Or maybe not,,,,,we are going into rocket science now,, haha

I have paneling come out basement of lake house if you look for more cabinet material. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Thanks for the kind offer,, I'm sure its veery nice old grained wood. But this Tennessee cedar is my fav. Cuts are very rough, 1 cab is 1 inch higher than than the other,, 1 has sides that are IN the front panel/rear panels, and the other sides are OUTside front/rear panels. = each cabinet is different measurmemnets, but close to 50 liters. I'm no cabinet builder,, just a visonary for speaker designs. No one in the world, AFAIK has a dual Fr design system + tweeter,,just ordered another tweeter today, will run dual tweeters. ight,,in fact will build a mini Cedar cabinet to house both tweeters. The Davidlouis seller says no one in china has dual FR in a system. The DIY Association told me it will not work, it will sound just aweful. I don't listen. I really think my speaker offers some of the best midrange sound. You can't do this with AER, Voxativ, nor Cube, all have too high a sensitivity and many other reasons,'can't do this with any speaker brands. Only davidlouis VX8 + VX6 can you combine ia dual system. Nice day

All of the (your) Youtube videos you have linked here sound awful to me,

 

I can;’t help that.

Thats your problem, not my speakers problem

The 6C33C-B tube, when someone includes an amp using this bottle, THEN you will have my undivided attention, hah. Sorry all, I’m just a parrot! :) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Well this tube ain't too shabby either. 

 

 

unscrew the bottom let’s see what’s inside , I have had upgrades to tube gear many times ,most use cheap parts unless spending well over $5 k ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My tech here, and many other techs as well, believe a cap is a cap is a cap, I’ve proven this to be true in certain uses, and not true at all in other, Take my Jadis Defy 7, each KT88 has a .47 cap attached.. I took out Jadis’s small yellow stock .47 cap and instaalled Mundorf .47 SESGO, bass response registered in a very nice nuance gain. The bass is punchy and solid. Mids also made a small gain. Takman Rey resistors made a minisclue up gain. All the mods/upgardes I’ve made, all togther made for a nice upgrade,~~~

. Upgrade to my xovers in my speakers was a total waste of money.

FR speakers offer a superior soundstage. So again , upgrades, mods have to be carefully considered.

My once beloved Seas Thor speakers (same drivers as Joseph Audio’s $12000 speakers) are now dis-manteled...

, midwoofers sold,

tweeters gave away,

xovers up for sale,

cabinets went out today for the trash.

Adios xover style speakers forever,,,

YOU, too should make the switch.

Mozart fan what kind of a crap system is that. LOL hahaha well I imagine if the speakers had the name like Wilson Dali Sonus Faber attacjed to the front ,, maybe you and others would buy it hey thats what i am going to do, start up my own speaker retail shop. Lets see what shall I call it oh I know The Frankenstein's. Look if Tekton's are selling their loaded cabinets,, like hot cakes in a alaskan mining town...I think mine are better,,. A bunch of tweeters will not match dual FR;'s in these sma e band width. Trsut me my Frankenstein's are ONLY limited by the amp connected. Whatever sound is in the amp will be channled through the speakers. UNlike xover /low sens speakers which block/distort/pollute the nunances of a Jadis KT170's glorious sound. My dual FR have NO XOVER, just pure muisc from the source + amplifier. I live minutes from the airport, stop by one day. Then make a critique, or insulting comment. Not til you actually heard them live.

Hearing something live has never stopped you from critiquing other speakers such as Vandersteen, Wilson, Dali, Zu, Tekton

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dont need to hear Teks, Zu’s. I can look at the design, cone materials. Not for me, There are resonances and spikes in both designs, I can easily spot it. The YT vids only confirm what I suspect. My DL’s are pure neutral like the Seas Excel. Zu’s have no xovers, a good tghing, but the cones are some sort of paper composite, I avoid anything paper.

has to be wood fibers, or banana/Kanuf leaf fibers in my FR cones.

seems rather bright. If you don’t mind answering, what’s on your back wall? Tracy Chapman - New Beginning, is a spectacular recorded & well written album btw ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Was thinking this same thing last night late. Some sort of wall treatment would not hurt. back wall awkward has a closet door and door and 2 book cases along side wall rear. How about this I get attic insultaion, and ghang 2 strips from ceiling to fllor, just in front of 2 bookcases, this will prevent some waves from bouncing along back corners and such. Will do this treatment today,, I think it will dampen some echos and such. Thanks for the tip. And yes will order Tracy Chapman today. Thanks

Gee, I wonder why🙄

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Because the DIY FR Committee has banned such a design. After I showed THE FR Club my design was a stunning success, ( I told them I really believe I have the best midrange sound in the world..,, they promptly booted me off the DIY forum,,no big deal, I did not learn even 1 thing over there about FR systems)) , Ever heard of Thinking OUTSIDE the box. Creativity is something that can make NEW things happen. I never ever follow the crowd in things audio. In 10 yrs you will see my idea take off. Just BECAUSE no one has tried a dual FR system, why equate this with *not doable*. I follow my own ideas.

Like Frankie sings, 

**and I did IT my wayyyyy**

Being happy on here is an uphill battle, be strong!

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ AS you know, and we all know.

This is a **Cancel Culture Epoch*** Translate,, **If you are sasying, believing something that does not agree with what I believe,, you are offically canceled, deleted, voided..** The DIY FR discussion forum, has canceled me , banned me from THEIR chat forum, I can not post on DIY any longer,, Why?? I did something against their rules, regulations, their beliefs. Its a longgg story how I got banned. But trust me, Cancel Culture is all over this earth right now. I aplogize if I am stepping on some audiophiles toes around here. My speaker has beena life long pursuit and I found it just after my last confrontal with death,

Seems I did not pass away in the emergency room operation, not just yet, until I found what I was always looking for Near perfect midrange.

 

This  is part of my desire to remain alive,,, to complete my task of findinf, discovering if need be via a  DIY design, a  near perfect midrange speaker.

Death almost cheated me of my dreams.

 

Sorry if I am offending folks opinions here. But I am what I am. Nice day everyone. I will be back with more news on the 2A3 + FR system performance. Ice bucket me all you want, the mods here know I have not once snided nor offended any member in my 20+ years stink here in Audiogon. I practice civility as modus operandi.

I know what you guys are thinking,,, how is it even remotely possible a  DIY speaker, dual FR has a  midrange that can  match,, no wait, SURPASS the mids of  a  Wilson, Dali, Sonus Faber, or Rockport,, all in the mega $$$  price tag???

Impossible!!!

WEll believe what you wish to believe.

I know what I hear. 

There is no xover/low sens speaker gonna match a  higher end FR in the complete midrange band width. 

I've gone over this more than a  dozens x's here on audiogon and I aint gonna repeat myself.

tubes) can sound superb. I heard a Jadis amplifier using the very common el 34 and it was exceedingly good sounding.

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I wished the Defy had

1) individual Bias pots for each tube

2) accepted EL34’s

3) 4 tubes per channel, not the 6. ,

Back to reality, I really did not note much dif between my techs EL34 (something like the Dynaco design), his Allen Organ KT120 mono blocks, and the Kt88;s. ’Blind testing, you’d be lucky which is which. Readinga DIYers offerings on Aliexpress, His dual 300B amp and dual 2A3, your choice, he went on to say, **both the pure SET and this dual tube per channel PP design, one can not say, either is superior to the other...** Paraphrase mine. After reading his comments on his amps, I’ve altered my opinion about PP in both SET tube designs and KT designs. . The initial emotions of experiencing the super linear, magical midrange on certain recordings, , has to be considered as just 1 option for high fidelity. Should be monday when I have the 2A3 PP amp, up N running/biased properly. I*f I find its a keeper, I’ll order the TJ Full Music *mesh*,, Although my tech is not buying the tube is a true mesh. At least not like the mesh plates made back in the early days of tube manufacturing.

Of course you will mozartfan, you always do. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Boiled down, I despise xoverlowsens box speakers, Lets just all get along here, eh? Nothing wrong with strong opinions. So long as we keep civil. If you hate FR, go ahead and explain.

OK Yaquin 2A3 is in

Gotta say, I prefer this  2A3 tube PP over the

El34,KT88,120, 150 series.

Over all superior sound.

Have not heard Jadis' KT170 which I am sure will give this 2A3 a  run for its money.

I think this 2A3 under $1500 is best bang in any amp.

I was sold on the single tube SET, but along coes this 2A3 PP amp.

The stock ax,au's were garbage.

Pluged in Teles, Nice gains.

Just waiting on cash so I can  swap out the Psvane stock 2A3's for

TJ Full Music Mesh plates.

+ will swap out resistors for Takman  Rey metal and also look to swap  out some caps for Mundorf SESGO.

Will take 6 months to complete these upgrades.

 

Again its my opinion 

the 

2A3 PP is superior to

the EL, KT series PP amp.

 

 

I thought I was buying a  SET, when in fact turned out to be a  PP ,,hahaha, toss of the dice, as no one had any youtube or online review of the amp,,, hahaha, 

1st

I plan to make about 10-20 YT vids over the comming year.

Best bang under $1500

Got lucky on this gamble.

Proclamations are difficult to back up. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ True 'I've nor heard every EL34,88,120,150 tube amp ever made. based on a few models,, these tubes **pretty much** all sounded the same.At least to me ears. hardlya nuance difference. THe pre tubes in each design responded much more to preference. I'm a Tele fan. So like yeah,,here I am thinking 2A3 wow doube tubes,, read the descript,, now that i think about it, it might have added the one word PP, but also thought it did say, SET...The Inet only mentioned the 2A3 in a SET design,, so I'm thinking its a SET tube. Someone here on Audiogon, noted it may be a PP,, My tech confirmed and brought the ad up on his computer,,anyway, he said, **you might like this chinese budget amp,,then again...**. Yaquin has always been in my mind like Ming Da, Dared, the low budget end of chinese gear.. WEll turns out I much prefer this 2A3 in a PP vs all KT varieties, (exception is Jadis' new KT170, which looks promising but at 10x's the price of this lil Yaquin..). Anyway, listening to a classical cd recorded poorly from Russian Archives, sounded fantastic on the 2A3. Faith Hill never sounded as good. There is no doubt, this 2A3 out performa s , all KT designs. I've yet to hear Full Music Mesh plates (my tech mentioned its nota true mesh, more like perforated metal..), still from what I've read the Mesh offer nice resolutions. The Jadis Defy7 will be great in more comples symphonic orch,,but for all other music, this 2A3 will beat out the Defy.

^^^+1 Totally agree! I also prefer the 2A3 over a 300B in a pure SET amp.^^^

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yet how often do I see 300B and 2A3  mentioned as options offered in a design. AS though they were closely matched in terms of performance.

My tech urges me to avoid the 300B in any part of a design, (845 w 300B as driver). He has no issues with the 2A3.

Then again there are fans of the 300B that love their pure linear SET soundstage. My tech mentioned the 300B original intent for the tube was telecom usage. Meaning fq cut off in both ends of the band width spectrum. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

^^^^Your tech is correct, perforated metal plate rather than a true mesh design. EML makes a genuine mesh tube, they are costly. You could still really appreciate the sound of the Full Music perforated plate tube once acquired.^^^^

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yes I’ve seen the EML’s , out my budget. The TJ FM *mesh* is definetly a different material, and will offer a different soundstage vs his NOS RCA’s 1940’s he is offering me. great price at $100 each. But is the TJ FM pseudo mesh plates that interest me most. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I should also mention, last time I heard the KT88 was in the Thors and also a single FR speaker. Which makes the testing imbalanced/skewed. Adding a 2nd 6 inch FR with the 2A3 alters the testing. IOW the only way to properly test a KT88 PP to a @a# PP, is with same exact speakers. This may be 6 months before I retube the KT88 amplifier. Preliminary guess is that the 88 will perform better in a Dual FR /double tweeter system vs the previous Single FR/and Thor system. Yet I strongly suspect the 2A3 to come out nuances superior vs the KT88. How each perform in complex symphonic, is anyones guess. Stay tuned.,,,plenty more to come....

to hear a good quality 300b amplifier and decide for yourself. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ WEll I've learned to take what he says with some ~~conisderations~~~. He has his opinions, but certainly with more experience, He has desined a 300B SET. Again, with so many big designs out there in the 300B, the tube must have some magic, otherwise no one would buy them. I'm glad this amp turned out to be a PP vs my misunderstanding it was going to be a SET,,Actually soem of the SET linear magic has worn a bit thin,,now that the initial **WOW** exp has passed. I perfer this more dynamics of a PP sound. There is a bit of harshness to the 2A3 vs the KT88. Hoping a higher quality *mesh* plate resolves a bit of the resonsnces, But what i am hearing is well worth the minus ofa bit of resonaces, aka distortion,, (5% for this tube). My tech thinks the so call *mesh* plate , might be a bit of snskeoil,,hes skeptcal I'll get any gains vs my current Psvane. However reading a 6 Moons review on the Sophia Electric 300B Mesh, if even half of what the review say s is true, I'll bea happy camper. The Full Music looks identical to the Sophia. I will bea unhappy camper if the gains are miniscule nuance, not for $600/quad.

these “shouty” type sensitive speakers can often be too bright and harsh ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I can easily understand what you are saying about a SET witha FR/horn speaker that might have some **issues** = such as Fostex with their characteristic *shout**.

This Yaquin 2A3, is not forgiving.

That is to say if there is any **weakness* in the FR speaker,, this 2A3 will **accentuate** that **flaw**

This tiny bit of resonances (how much due to the tube typical character of a 2A3, and how much is due to this lower priced Psvane,,can’t say) ``` is  definitely there in the sound...

But I gain in resolution, instrument separation, female vocals with passion. 

The dual DavidLouis pick it up.

 

So a FR/horn that might have some resonances, spikes in certain fq’s,. whatever,,, might find this 2A3 amp not to their taste. One really needs a neutral speaker to make this amp work. So far I;’m happy with any **weakness* of this combination. Its all acceptable, nothing grating on my nerves, Nothing at all fatiguing.

 

~~Is it a sound comparable to a

Kronzilla 4 tube mono block, with AER’s top driver,

 

,,not

It is a budget system, nothing more, but certainly nothing less. How it compares to new EHKT88’s, 6 months we will find out. Afterwards in say 8 months from now, Mesh 2A3 vs EHKT88’s. More to come.....

What does your tech say?

 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Just ran by what I said here,, &&a 2A3 has superior mids than the KT series tube..** well tech wants to know **exactly which KT are you refering to...** hummm, tell ya what,,, humm, lets say this 2A3 took me by surprised, Better? well hard to say now , as its been 4 months since I heard the KT88’s, and those had 4k+ hours and ran the KT88’s via a Thor speaker and a single FR speaker and or a 8 FR + a W4 FR, THe W8+ W6 is a whole nother ball game. So all is not even .

 

You mentioned, **KT88’s as smoother vs a PP 2A3,,** Might have to agree, **Might** as in 1st off have to hear the new EHKT88’s, mid summer 2) have to0 hear a 2A3 mesh. Late summer So **The Jury is still out..** ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

What I will say is this Bottom line *IF** The 2A3 mesh plates do perform as 6 Moons says the Sophia 300B mesh perform,, well then we have a solid vote for 2A3 PP vs a KT88 PP. There does not exist a meshed KT88, only solid plates. This may give the advantage to the 2A3, Follow?? As you know these discussiions around tubes can get slippery. Not justa few weeks ago,,**SET, yeah #1..**

Now, cant say that. I actually by mistake or by lucky chance,,hit on this 2A3 PP circuit. Will the mesh elimiante some of the ever so slight harshness/in some mids fq’s??? Late summer we will know..

Give me some jazz! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Wanted to fulfill your wish with Diana Krall, a perfect track which displays fq spikes on piano, where other xover speakers are going to have issues. vs these FR dual speakers,,no spikes whatsoever. But can’t. Had a good rain last night, its FINALLY cool outside and humidity is at 100%. = the chips in the DAC are not happy, soaking in 100% humidity. Tiny pops. have to wait a good hour before the DAC heats up and dries out the chips. I’ve never heard it this bad before, although this is the 1st winter I had the DAC, so Now i know cooler temps + 100% humidity = DAC needs 2 hours warm up time to dry out, Dont want to run heater as we are enjoying the cooler temps inside the house, finally,... what a hot winter we are having. What I can say is the Diana Krall cd is recorded with a traditional jazz warmth. Too warm. But with this speaker, this amp, its all nice and mellow, clean, voice stunning accurate and te warm coloration toned down. There are so many wonderful KT88 amplifiers now avaliable. Cayin, Jadis, Line Magnetic, Willenston, Doge, Prima Luna, Muzishare. plenty others I did not mention. These will work with all speakers. But ideally, a SET or PP with SET type tubes is best for a FR speaker.

 

EDIT~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So I steped away to go listen to music,,and the thought occured, Although this amp is not a  pure SET circuit, the 2A3 still adds some linear midrange which a  KT88 does not posess to ~~the same degree~~~, How s that fora  compromise.

= a KT88 will not be as effective, that is misses the linear midrange of a  2A3 whether the 2A3 is a  SET circuit of a  PP design.

So theres no doubt at this point. Witha  FR system a  SET or a  low watt tube is not only ideal, buta  must have  to effectively bringa  FR to its true midrange magic.

No I will not discuss this with my tech, as he's going to argue the other POV.

Then again for full Orchestra, a  KT88 is the superior voice for a complex band width in a  FR speaker,, which is why I do not like a  FR to go over the Golden Sens mark, at 95db sens. 

96 db is too high for my preferences. 

91db is a  bit too low. 

@jond 

 

Yeah well my tech really does not wish to get into any **mods**, 

He figures let the amp **do its thing**.

He last words were (in spite knowing well the trans were Z11), *who knows you might like it..** 

And I do,

I actually give the edge to a  2A3 PP vs  the much more common PP the KT in all its variatiosn, EL34, 88,120,150.

IMHO this 2A3 wins out over the KT series.

I try to explain in the video below.

The Diana Krall cd is the ultimate test cd for any and all speakers. 

If your speaker can make it all they way through Diana 's cd, then you have a  winning speaker.

 

As I try to explain in this video.

should be uploaded by now.....

 

@mozartfan sometimes the crowd is actually right ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My mantra is Never ever follow the crowd. If I go the wrong road, I tack it up to exp. Otherwise I follow my own course after my Thor upgrade disaster and listening to my tech saysing **Yes seems 1 of the 15 year old Millenniums are 1/2 ohm off from the other,,,better spend $700 on a new pair..** so I did,

For absoluetly nothing.

Both pairs sound identical. Tweeters last FOREVER if not abused, only swap out diaphram every 30+++ years, Thats it, $50 bucks. Remember what old Frankie sings **And I did it my OWN wayyyyy** I never ever follow the crowd.

to make judgements hastily. But in the end you have to be you. BTW, DHT push pull amplifiers are nothing new, have been around for some time ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I bought the amp, behind my tech’s back, had he foreknown I’d buy the amp, he would have pulled out his 1929 RCA tube data book and pointed out 1st data ~~~5% distortion on self bias** wopping,,

and I may have dismissed his 5% as no big deal.

I would have thought,,well thats 90 yrs ago, perhaps Psvane has developed a new tube that avoids most of this 5% distort,,,, He again pointed it out as he biased the tubes. Auto bias 2.5 %. much better, but this yaquin is self bias 5%. and pointed out other issues in data witha AB1 PP 2A3 design in the tubes plate dispication, voltage and such. But he did go on to say **who knows you might like it in spite of these inherent issues..**

And now I know about 5% distortion,, its there in the ~~luckily ~~~ upper mids, not   upper bass/low mids,, which would grate on my nerves...

,, Its only in certain fq’s, not the entire range. My DL’s can deal with it, as both speakers are near distortion free. They can absor the 5% with ease. The Philips tweeter kicks in at 5khz, so it does not have to deal with the midrange distortion. The only way this fantastic amp will work ina system is IF 1) FR speakers ONLY 2) FR with very low distortion peaks , that is neutral throughout this 5% distortion from the tube. Trade offs as usual. I accept the 5%, but in return the tube rewards with very nice midrange, vocals, soundstage.

The KT88 has , not sure like 2% distortion,, but you do not get the superior ```hard to say exactly~~~ but superior something or other.

Now will the Full Music  Mesh Plates

soften up some of this distortion, mellow out the ever so slight harshness... remains to be heard. Stay tuned.

I prefer Faith Hill, Diana Krall via the 5% distort 2A3PP vs a KT88PP. All day long. My suggestion is if you are going into a FR system as a 2nd system, this is the amp to buy.. @ Charles No very few of these 2A3 PP amps in the market place, Plenty of SET 2A3, this Yaquin and maybe 1 or 2 others in the PP design. This amplifier will not work with xover low sens speakers.

 

Dont even try.

@larryi Funny you mention hyper realistic with the 2a3. When I was running 2a3 monoblocks with Omegas I often thought about this particular characteristic of internal luminescence. Mids had the sense of being lit up from within, very unusual, never heard this prior or since. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

WOW now thats a amplifier. 2A3 monos. Unreal.

 

Agree, the KT series ain’t no slouch , as i’m listening to sym via the 2A3, the KT88’s deliver a similiar result.

We are only talking slight shades of nuances here. But over all, for my preference in soundstage, I prefer the 2A3 PP with a FR speaker. Low watt amp always works superior with FR vs a KT PP. Its my personal preference , maybe not yours. But as you guys know ,

I’m done with xover low sens speakers.

And I know darn well none of you are about to follow my lead.

FR are superior. For so so many reasons. call me Philistine all you want.

I am The Iconoclast.

 

and yes I did correct Yaqin  sp in the YT uploads. 

credibility. For instance, I have an el34 based amplifier in my closet which would likely change your opinion about absolute tube type superiority.

 

 

EL34=KT88=KT120=KT150 hardly even a nuance difference. One has more power vs the other is all I noted. now 2A3 is different vs KT series. Just my 2 cent opinion, Take it or leave it.

Last of my ideas on this matter,,,,, Jadis’ KT170, now here might be something special. Still I ’ll take a 2A3 PP (not SET) vs jadis KT170. Just my opinion, take ir or leave it.

@ charles 1 

if I follow the crowd,, what will I learn?

Thats not already common knowledge??

Who would have ever suggested a  SET type PP design??

Never heard sucha  thing as a  low watt PP circuit.

Now my FR hasa   good match.

I was  always thinking,, KT PP is too much power. Yet SET's not enough dynamics for big full orchestra...

Dilemma.

 

However I did have at one time a  Cayin El34  smallest Cayin model , had ultra linear and triode switch..

I sold it off a  few months later,  thinking not enough drive for the Thors.

Yet perhaps a perfect match fora  FR system..

This  lil 2A3 PP is the answer to my quest for the ideal amplification for a  FR system. 

Hopefully the tubes can  hold up under a  four driver  load speaker system. 

If the tubes begin shorting out too early,, I may have to drop  some drivers and make ita  single FR + a  single tweeter.

Time will tell....

If so, then the Defy will have to carry the dual FR + dual tweeters/big orchestra. 

The 2A3 only for light chamber, solo piano., single FR + single tweeter. 

 

 

@ Atmasphere

 

Yes my tech Richard, just wrote  to say 5% as vol gain goes up more distortion,, that 5% goes down as vol gain goes down.

I listen at ridiculously low SPL levels, so for me this 5% is no big deal.

well yes at full blast evena KT88 will show distortion.

My tech and Charles among others wish  that I retarct some of my strong opinions, as if to say 

**the 2A3 PP  is just 1 of many options, 1 circuit is not superior to any other..**

BALONEY. Just a simple one  size fits all platitude.

The 2A3 PP is superior to any and all KT circuits.

I would bet outshoots Jadis' new super KT170  Crown Jewel.

 

Yes I understand as a  FR sens goes up, better response froma  low powered SET or low powered PP *SET type tube* 300B/2A3.

But as you know the higher in sens you go up ina  FR, lower the bass response, = too forward a  midrange.

 

95db sens ina FR is my very limit.

I would not buy a  96db sesn driver, as there is no way I can intergrate a  W6 FR.

Just 1 db makes all the difference. I got very lucky on the davidLouis

VX8 95db

VX6 93db sens

made it by 1 db on both

If the VX6 was 94db, it  might cause trouble.

Finally everything is falling into place. 

Hundreds of hours research.

Lots of  cash, mistakes, errors.

Luck has finally tured in my favor.

About to upload yet another Yaqin vid/

Might stir up the honets nest, so let me put my protective gear on....

 

 

Each of these changes can make a dramatic influence on sound! ~~~~~~~~~~

 

I  know some audiophiles are not won over on swaping parts. = A cap is a cap is a cap...

I am a believer.

I prefer Takman Rey metal vs any and all carbon **smoothhhh* resistors. Caps, Mundorf SESGO or Silvergold EVO, whatever I can afford.

Tubes also make a gain, Teles in the pre, and have yet to roll these stock Psvane. My tech thinks there is not much to gain swaping out power tubes...we will see, that experiement waits til mid summer.

really hesitant to make a blanket statement such as yours in the quote above- in a nutshell, its blatantly false. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ OK grant it, I have not heard a KT type linear SET, nor a EL34 Triode. Perhaps they offer same , even superior sonics vs this 2A3. Quite possible true, But as you say, there are so few Ultra Linera KT88 and Triode EL34 avaliable. I had the Cayin EL34 Triode/Ultra, but sold it off, bessides the trans were a bit too small for my preferences. I am speaking of a PP KT series amplifier, such as the Jadis Defy7 one of the finest sounding PP amplifiers ever made. Can not match what i am hearing in the 2A3. In some passages, both very close, in other cds, the 2A3 is more evoloving, **REVEALING***

I also think, using two fullrange drivers in parallel and tweeter (without properly designed filter) works against basic idea of fullrange (a point source of sound.) It makes sound congested and messy and destroys soundstage and focus ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This is exactly the same argument raised by ~~THe Association of Full Range Speakers** aka THE Club of FR Enthusiasts,,over atn the DIY forum, Full range section,.,, **We tried this dual thingy,, did not work, wont work,,dont even consider attempting such a scheme..** WEll I broke THEIR rules and disobeyed THEIR authority,,,**I did it my wayyy** as old Frankie Sings They asked to see measurements, graphs, testing lab results etc. I had none. gave me the boot PERMANTLY banned. hahahaha Did not learn EVEN one thing from those **scientists** haha I like to break the rules, or lets say go against common opinions/beliefs. As I posted elsewhere,,this Dual thing will only work under with certain drivers. You nor anyone else in the world might say **and you actually like THAT sound???** Yep , dont touch my Dual system, I love it. 2nd tweeter arriving next wek, Dual FR + Dual T's. If all the big guns can get away with multiple driver systems,, I figure why not I.

Now I agree dual FR makes no sense whatsoever, Its a  completely ridiculous idea,,a  single is really all you need. Duals can make confusion in the sound waves,, 2 VC's bouncing off each other all muddy, convoluted, distorted, just a  blob of ,,poop..

But for some reason I like the sound of this poop system. 

..

The opinion in this video reflects my own subjective reaction to the 2A3.

KT type tube  offers wonderful colors, imagery, low distortion, no coloration, no fatigue.

I know this fora  fact hearing the DEfy7.

But if It came down to chosing one or the other,,I'd have to chose the 2A3 as my premier system. 

Bass are near equal, highs a tad superior in the 2A3, buts its in the midrange where the 2A3 opens up recordings that a  KT series tube just does not make happen.

 

2A3 beats out the KT series tube, EL34,88,120, 150

If you feel offrended by any of the comments in my video, just disregard and move on.

Its only my opinion and 2$'s ,,,which ...will get you a  only just a   Starbucks $2 cofee.

 

And no I ain't budging on my opinion.

 

 

 

sound comes out. But if you want to hear proper imaging out of them, your head needs to be in a vise so as to be held always in the right position... The box in the image above this post looks as if its ported. Did you do anything to prevent slap echos inside the box? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Thats correct, Just get any old speaker box, say 50 liter give a take 10 liters,,,slap a pice of ply over the front with a W8 + W6 hole cut,,and your-good-to-go. a bit of attaic insulation, actually i need to add some more along the walls, Cut ya a port, any size you wish. Shes goodtogo. The head in one exact spot deal you are refering to pertains to the Tang band 2145 and the smaller brothers in this same design. Its beams. Bass is near identical to the DL wood cone, ,,well I should say close,,,mids are close,l highs are a bit better in the TB2145. But it has a baeming issue,,which I could never accept. These DL's have zero beaming. Nada These DL's are basically the Legendary Coral Beta 8's reborn. Like the old Phoenix in the Fire resurrection. The DIYers will never accept my dual things. While others might hate my speakers, I love them. Truly a Frankenstein. \ Carlson(the famous YT tech master) in his lab, might test and find they are loaded with breakups, distortions, colorations, all fatigue-ing, no fidelity.

It's about the tubes ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ When you say about the tubes,,,d o you mean rolling might add a nuance or...take away from the sound?? My tech here Richard, mentioned the Mesh plates I;m interested in, might not make, in fact **most likely will not..* make much gains. Have you tried other 2A3's.? He has a perfect set of NOS RCA's, But i'm opting for the FUll Music Mesh as my next tube. I;ve seen some very pricey Carbon plates, Titanium plates many others. Pricey, so I want to make my 1st roll of the dice, count. IF the resistors are in fact carbon, right off swapping to Takman Rey metal will make a nice gain. Carbon are great for jazz fans that love their music real smoothhhh. carbons do just that. Clip off the peaks in fq's. Flatens out the sound. Its intreguing,,for about a few days....

Had hoped to upload YET another video.

Miles Davis Kind of Blue.

DAC has mositure issues, we live 10 ft below sealevel. When the conditions are **right** cool./cold, moisture pouring in from the Gulf, DAC gets cranky, the chips are damp.

I now have a paper bad over the vent holes at top, this will keep heat in the unit and keep chips nice N dry.

So no upload tonight.

Let me say, the 88s did not present Miles Davis like this Yaqin.

 

For me the KT series does not even exist.

So this year, I’ve dumped 2 component models,, xover/low sens speakers and KT series tubes. (yes will retube the Defy with EHKT88's, museum  piece)

heee hawwww

Not interested any longer in the 845 design.

Curious as to why Mr Jadis did not come up with a  300B PP and also a  2A3 PP design???
*IFFF* thats  a big IF, FR  interest ever does get steam going in its train engine,,, you might also see interest begin flowing into lower power PP designs like the 300B and 2A3.

But as we know

1) general interest in all things audiophile are not as strong as they were 10, 20 years ago.

The new commers have all this digital  gadgets and head phones.

2) you can find so many offerings on the used market, which cuts into new sales, thus new designs can't get the funding. 

 

3) xover speakers just seem to  facinate and dazzle both old and  young audiophiles.

Guess this has to do with the typical american ego trippin on power. 

 

I'm doing all I can to push the lower power amp agenda ,  as the superior musical soundstage when paired with the right speaker.

Hopefully Mr Jadis is reading my post and  will at least ponder is the company should slow down on  big power amp offerings. And start designing amplifiers that offer finesse and fidelity, such as the 2A3 PP design.

I think china's manufacturers  have the leading edge over EU and USA companies and this trend will continue.

And you know it. 

My amp, and speakers ,  Made In China.

can you believe it. China beat out the worlds best amplifier, Jadis. (Both techs here  , just loved to trash the Defy all the time...) 

A tube made all the difference. 

 

Dac chips until this thread. So thank you for that if nothing else. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

. I’ve had the DAC now 9 months.

Yesterday was a very wet 100% humidity and cool. I’ve noticed during a rain , next day, DAC needed **drying out time**, Yesterday was the worst...So what i am doing to help prevent this longgg dry out time,, is 1) placea paper bag over top of unit where there are vent holes placed along top, 2) turn DAC on early in the AM< WITH bag left in place, this way heat builds up and drys out any excess moisture. Beats using a blow dryer, which did not help all that much... , Also I could put back in the window my 5k btu window AC and run it at night, like a dehumidifier. If I have to I will. I note the pops are more frequent while in play, with all my jazz /pop cs which have some marks on the surface,, my classical cds are near mint have less pops. So the entire Shamling drive + DAC together are being sensitive to excess moisture + cds in avg condition. This issue only happens on certain super high moisture days. 100% humidity + rain + cool front which makes air highly energized wind = static energy. This Jadis DAC is loaded with chips + the Class A JFET opamps, loaded with tiny cjips. All make for highly sensitivite DAC setup to moisture.

Why are you supporting China's economy? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Look I am completely with you on this one. Chinese intellectual theft is real and affects us all here in the USA, in one way o more. I don't like what the chinese do, robbing our technology and then branding it and we buy it. Its theft. But in this case, I can't afford the other high end manufacturers ofg FR speakers nor the higher end amplifiers made in the EU and USA. Also are there any USA manufacturers designing a 2A3 PP amplifier at the moment? At a price I can afford. In this case, hats off to china for bringing me wonderful components which fulfill my long quest for a beautiful musical soundstage.