Seeking turntable upgrade advice

Hi Madfloyd,

If I were to make a decision on the Doshi based on limited exposure to it, I too would find that it is not to my taste, or more correctly, that I heard shortcomings in the systems where I had the opportunity to audition it. My respect for the Doshi is by inference - from people whose opinions I trust - people with whom I've shared observations and listening tastes in the past. In this sense, it should be on everyone's short list.

There are elements to fine components which are obvious once you learn what to listen for. For example, phono stages like the Doshi, the Essential, the Atma-Sphere MP-1, and the Einstein (to name a few), have a remarkable immunity to input overload. Raul has mentioned this in various threads on this forum. Many times, what sounds like cartridge mistracking or distortion is in fact a phono stage input section whose slew rate is too slow - one which can't gracefully respond to transients, and rings (resonates) in response to them.

Of course, there are numerous dimensions to a sonic evaluation. I point the above one out because it's one that you can analyze in any system context. Tonality on the other hand is difficult to determine unless you are familiar with the system context.

My main point relates to a system building approach - to encourage you to pick the low hanging fruit and work from there. From this perspective, the Doshi would serve you well - in spite of the fact that you currently don't find it to your liking (and might never, for that matter). From the dialog in this thread, it appears as if both ends of your system are candidates for change front end, and apm/speaker.

Now, in the end, you still might not like the Doshi, but I think it will (paradoxically) help you make better decisions about the rest of your system. I still think that you are most likely shooting the messenger. Have you considered sending it back to Nick for an inspection?

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier

Hi Madfloyd,

I think your comments touch on a very important point regarding venturing into made to order audio components, and are worth exploring. In the interest of full disclosure, I need to clarify a comment you made which might be subject to misinterpretation:

I did try to purchase a Galibier but finally gave up (I think Thom is just too busy).

It would appear that after our single exchange, you have self selected yourself out of Galibier ownership (and sadly, out of a Doshi as well). In no way would I try to discourage you, but I think some background on the acquisition process is in order.

The first few conversations with potential clients have very little to do with Galibier models and options. There's too much groundwork to be covered about past experiences and future goals, and skipping over this would be a critical mistake. People like myself, Chris Brady, and Neck Doshi approach our customers as if they have arrived at the end of a long journey.

The fellow who has played the game with mainstream components and who approaches us has more often than not reached a crossroad. Most likely, he is fed up with hi-fi, but at the same time is ambivalent about giving it up. His experiences with mainstream gear (at any price) have not met his expectations. The crossroad he reaches is one of either checking out of hi-fi completely, or branching into the realm of the esoteric - for one last try.

In early contacts with potential clients, we share our collective experiences (aka mistake$), in an attempt to come to an understanding about whether we have a shared vision. Having reached this point, the only remaining question in your mind is whether I can achieve this vision.

This information gathering is a difficult process. I cannot merely ask you what gear you own and what you're contemplating and leave it at that - any more than a doctor can ask a patient if they eat 5 servings of fruits and vegetables daily and expect an honest answer. It takes some careful probing to uncover the truth.

Fortunately, I have a very simple "filter" to help me arrive at the truth: waiting time. While 6 months is at the extreme (but yet very possible as a couple of my current customers will attest), it serves as a good benchmark for both setting of expectations as well as coming to an understanding that a made to order product of this level of precision requires time.

A willingness to wait (something I try my best to NOT exploit), is an expression of someone's entire approach - to both music as well as life. It tells me much about whether we share a common vision.

Examples of long waiting periods abound in other pursuits. Richard Sachs bicycles take on the order of 4 years (http://www.richardsachs.com/dvd.html), and Walker custom guitars run on the order of 7 years (http://www.walkerguitars.com/). Of course, a bit closer to home, there's the Schroeder tonearm.

Regarding your experiences with the Doshi, I have to defer to Doug, since the two of you have shared listening sessions. I need to make a few comments however.

In my experience, components in the Doshi class of gear are frequently blamed for problems elsewhere in the system - in a "shoot the messenger" sort of way. Since Nick designs as any broadcast engineer would, I'm confident that what you did not like had nothing to do with a component mismatch or interface problem.

I've commented in several threads about this, but I need to once more, state categorically, that tracking an XV-1s at 2.5 grams is putting a band aid on a problem, and likely, the high resolution of the Doshi was exposing this problem - this, in addition to others that you and Doug have been diagnosing.

While it's true that no single component can be all things to all people, at the same time, one needs to be very watchful about drawing an erroneous conclusion about a piece of gear. Ask me how I know ...

Good luck in your audio travels.

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier

Hi Ian,

In any case, I’m pretty happy with my harmonically challenged system. Having changed every component in the past 3 months (including cabling, power conditioning)

Wow! I don't know how you can reasonably make sense of what's going on. I surely couldn't assimilate this many system changes in such a short period.

I like your inquisitive approach, but if I were to give you one piece of advice, it would be to SLOW DOWN.

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier