room size question.

I am a midfi dummy, I don't know even know the proper difference between 3D and soundstage. I guess room has a lot to with it.

I only get a clear soundstage with the minority of my LPs. Hardly ever with CDs. Since I added a sub, I often get a more confusing sound (crossover chaos). 

But this is a great post, lot of comments to learn from for me. 

to me it sounds like you are expecting some magic soundstage that the recording may or may not have. Do you have a reference, what you are comparing it to, what you are missing? 

you can try toe-in, moving the speakers like New Record Day suggests, and a little play with the sweet spot. Worst case scenario is your speakers need more space, it’s the first time I hear about the brand (and I am just 15 miles from them). Probably great speakers.

I would unplug the subs first, and experiment with the monitors only. Seems like a lot of speakers for a small room

btw I have nothing against Jay but he seems to be a gear guy not a music first guy. I prefer NRD and Zero Fidelity, budget and solutions conscious dudes. I imagine Jay has a zillion dollar gear in every room in his house.  

I know all too well about lack of funds.... but you can do a Crutchfield or Amazon trial, for "free"

I don't want to assume what you are thinking, but so far:

you tried everything with speaker placement and seating position and volumes

room is treated

it's a decent size room

it should produce a soundstage

your layers are either not produced or something "eats" them.   

you think it's your room size. I think it's synergy and I assume it's the lack of, between the speakers and the room. (and I hope this will be the lamest, most useless comment you will get today)

@bshaw

I would try a different speaker, if that’s a possibility. Something a little smaller.

From my experience: when I added a sub, it reduced my soundstage. I tried 5 different subs then to find one that worked.

"i honestly think its the room "

Can you change the room?

@jond it's a square :)

" start with them all the way out to almost your listening position, and then start moving them toward the back wall, 8 inches or so at a time"

exactly what New Record Day showed

"i will try to move the speakers out more and see what happens....but kinda limited as the speaker cables are only 8 ft."

starting positioning yourself right between the two speakers and slowly moving back is an option too. Not the same and your problem seems to persist regardless what you are trying that I also think you may as well train your ears more to notice the soundstage (with this setup - I don't doubt you have awesome hearing). That’s the main difference between audiophiles and regular folks, we have the same ears but we allow our brain to notice the nuances. Soundstage, after all, is an illusion or a contract between the source and your perception that you can imagine the space around you with the music’s components spread out.
if I go to a concert, I don’t hear a soundstage, most of the time I just try not to go deaf with my sensitive ears,

@immatthewj

I agree with you, but when I go, once a year or so, it’s giant speakers in giant spaces. (my point being that soundstage is not a given, we are not recreating but creating it)

I have the same room size and today I sat closer to the speakers and lower. My ears were at the midbass driver level.

5' out instead of 6', sitting on the floor. Giant difference. a lot more "surrounding", spacious soundstage. 

I have a humble system and 0 room treatment, other than curtains and furniture 

@immatthewj 

rear wall: 3.5', side wall: 2' distance between speakers: 6.5'

my distance is about 7' from each speaker

I think I would benefit from moving them closer/out 0.5' in each direction