Exlibris and Teajay, first-my Sextet Digital(AES/EBU) is on its way here... I will have it in two weeks time, more in one month... Second, very best non-upsampling digital gear is(or one of) ARC REF CD7(and CD3MkII is also non-upsampling). You both should try to audition it. I would even say that ARC REF CD7 is more enjoyable in some areas than my reference Weiss Medea/Jason combo. I currently have Accustic Arts DAC1Mk3(Balanced)/Drive1MkII combo on trail and I can say that Teajay's description of AA combo sonics was right on the spot. For the money it is excellent buy but, it is IMO not better then ARC CD REF7. And I have to say that Weiss combo is well, a lot better. But, since Weiss combo cost more than two times more it must be better! Anyway, in normal price range(read till $15K) Accustic Arts DAC1Mk3/Drive1MkII combo deserves highest respect. Other excellent contenders are ARC REF CD7,Esoteric X-01 and Audio Aero Prestige SACD.
Teajay, Accustic Arts combo is IMO worth extra price over also very good Accustic Arts Player1MkII! |
Guido, as Fsarc said D-03 is using new Analog Devices AD1955 dacs(D-01 is using multi-bit BB PCM1704). But, will it not convert DSD to PCM as stated on Soundstage CES report needs to be seen. I have PDF file about new D-03/P-03 combo and things there are not clear about it... Also look at the AD1955 diagram at Analog Devices web site...
P-03 is using same VRDS-NEO transport as P-01, only in single chassis. And as Fsarc pointed out changes in X-01Limited are small. According to my brother(who is still currently in LV) Esoteric system build around Aerial 20T speakers was very good sounding. One other thing all new Esoteric gear will be available in USA at least two months before Europe... CE approval is the case! Real shame! |
Teajay, I think you did very good job in sharing with us your opinion about Stealth. If this will help Stealth as the company-then be it!
Weiss vs. Accustic Arts: Weiss combo is more powerful in bass(as I said before in bass Weiss and Esoteric combos are in class of their own), little bit more upfront in midrange(very,very small differences) and more extended in highs without sounding bright. The biggest difference were in microdymanics(and level of microdymanics details), simply said you can here a lot more through Weiss combo.
Also my wife said that music sound faster through Weiss...
Accustic Arts is warmer(but, not to much!), little bit easier on ears and for me it has some kind of charm that I like a lot! To my suprise my friend(the one who owns Accustic Arts Player1MkII) also liked Weiss more-IHO Weiss has more analogue like qualities then Accustic Arts!
Regarding Drive1 it is normal version(my mistake, it is not MkII) but, I was very suprised how picky it was about power cords! Very best sound was with Siltech Signature G6 and Accustic Arts own Power Cord Ferrite II(DAC1Mk3 was not that picky about power cords...).
Unfortunately, because of new car delivery no CES for me this year but, my brother is there right now and I will have his first report this afternoon.
Teajay, do you have any(sonic or whatever) info about new Stealth Dream speaker cable and power cord? Thank you in advance! |
Thanks Teajay! Also regarding CES my brother just send me an info about new Krell EVO line-there is new Krell EVO505 universal music player($10K retail,available March 2006)-that one will land in my system ASAP! |
Some interesting new digital gear from CES:
Esoteric D-03/P-03 combo(CD/SACD) $25000
Esoteric X-01Limited $13500(old X-01 can be upgraded)
Esoteric UX-01Limited
Esoteric X-03SE
Esoteric UX-03SE
Esoteric SZ-1(CD/SACD)
Esoteric UZ-1(CD/SACD/DVD-A+V)
Mark Levinson No.51(CD/DVD-V,limited edition-150units)$18K
Bel Canto CD1 (CD) $5000
Very interesting thing is that my brother says in his email is stereo digital revival! At least dozen companies showed prototypes of new digital players for introduction later in 2006... It seems that High-end industry is live and well... |
Exlibris, congrats on CDSD! I think that you made a right decision. Without CDSD you can not get full DCC2 potential. Also, connect CDSD with little orange optical cables first and audition your combo that way for a least few weeks. Then add balanced Sextet for RBCDs only and see what differences will be. In AES/EBU mode DCC2 will not(I think) upsample PCM signal to DSD, some EmmLabs owners actually prefer to listen to RBCDs that way(they use optical connection-recommended by Meitner-only for SACD). Since I wont be able to audition Meitner gear very soon( I will get them late February...) I am looking forward in your small review...
Teajay, any new info on Stealth Dream speaker cable and power cord? Thanks! |
Henryhk, it will be very interesting too see what typ of connection will be best for RBCDs, at least in Exlibris opinion!
Teajay, Thanks! I am very interested to audition whole Stealth system(Dream,Indra and Sextet) against my Siltech Signature G6 and Acrolink wires. If new Steath cables will be at Sextet level, then Stealth really did find out something new... |
Teajay, Yes, I was very busy! But, that's good... Sextet is excellent cable! I need to listen to it even more but, already I can say that it lighten up some things that I didn't hear before... Thing that I like the most about Sextet is organic/smooth presentation with excellent PRAT! I know that this sound odd but, this is what I heard! It is little bit better overall then my reference Siltech G6 Signature AES/EBU cable. I will put more comments regarding Sextet in few days...
Also, there were some changes in my office system-I currently audition Krell Resolution 3 speaker(with original stand). It is a lot better IMO then both Dynaudio Special 25 and Sonus Faber Concerto Domus that were previously in my office system. I just received Burmester 980 DAC and 033 dvd/transport for auditioning-more info in few weeks. Little hint-it is very good! Much better then my Esoteric DV50s with RBCDs... More comparison against ARC REF CD7 and Weiss Medea/Jason combo will follow soon. |
Teajay, Sextet(two AES/EBU cables!) should be here till end of this week... New Krell EVO505(CD/SACD) player will be in my home in March(just after production begin). I have extremly high expectations about Krell since it is using CAST connection-it will perfectly fit in my system No.1, but, till sommer Krell is planning to introduce even more advanced Evolution Three(3 chassis) player. There were many different and interesting new digital gear at CES. I will try to audition new dCS DAC8e/T8e combo very soon-these two are more advanced version of P8i player. MBL introduced 1622 CD/SACD transport and their 1611E DAC is now having a SACD playback upgrade-another potential candidate for auditioning. Reference Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo will revisit my systems in few weeks-I am very interested in this combo, I will put it against my reference Weiss Medea/Jason combo and winner will stay in my home. In late February I will have EmmLabs DCC2/CDSD combo for auditioning-only thing that is not very moving about Meitner gear is their build quality, it is a huge step belove(specially CDSD) Esoteric or Weiss. In April Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s combo will be ready for Europe and, of course, I will try to get my hands on them...
All in all, this will be interesting late winter time...
For the end little bit of my current thinking-it seems to me that new digital players around $10K(ARC REF CD7,Krell EVO505, etc.) are closing the gap between them and digital combos around $20-25K. Performance between them should be night and day if we look at the price but, in reality they are IMO not that huge(and in some cases they are even not present or are very small)...
Teajay, this weekend I again had Accustic Arts combo in my home and I was again impressed with thier performance. In that price range this is a combo to beat! |
Henry, only thing I can say-Wish you were here!
I forget something from my brother's CES report-Esoteric introduced pre-production version of DV-60. Yes, Esoteric will soon(read-May 2006) replace DV-50s... |
George, there is no Medea II, it is just a version with phase inversion button. Stereophile made little error...
There is no difference between two version of Medea(just phase inversion button). Only thing that this(phase inversion) version is almost $1500 more expensive!
Otherwise, they are identical. |
Welcome back, David! It will be very interesting to hear about your findings in few weeks... Regarding Esoteric X-01, this player really benefites from after market power cords-so try to match some very good power cord with it. In my experience with Esoteric gear Acrolink, Siltech and Shunyata power cords work excellent with their digital stuff. Specially Shunyata Anaconda Helix Vx in a nice match with Esoteric X-01... Also do not be suprised if EMMLabs combo turns to be a winner, real competition IMO for it is new Esoteric D-03/P-03 combo(specially with G-0s external clock).
Teajay, just a little hint-Sextet is working more or less as you said in your review... That is very,very good thing.
More in few weeks...
George, Weiss Medea/Jason is allready world class digital combo(IMO one of the best currently on the market) and that phase inversion button version is truly without extra juice as you said. But, honestly I didn't expect something radicaly different and Medea(Phase inversion button version) was introduced with pro-market in mind( in a first place). |
Exlibris, good to hear that CDSD arrived! It will be very interesting to hear your impression about Weiss combo... Only one hint-you will need TWO AES/EBU cables(identical ones) for best possible sound. Without them you will not hear complete Weiss potential.
In two weeks time I will receive Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo and of course-report here is mandatory! Krell EVO 505 will arrive in my systems in early April... EMMLabs gear-hope to have them in March... |
Exlibris, I am glad that my advice regarding CDSD was right. My guess was that EMMLabs DCC2 would sound very best with CDSD-very good that is the case(for your pocket!).
Regarding Weiss combo, it is an imperative to use absolutely identical two AES/EBU cables between Medea and Jason. Otherwise things will sound very strange indeed...
So, is digital search over for you or are you entering "eazy" search mode...? |
Teajay, I agree with you! There is no "THE BEST" digital gear in the world! EMMLabs gear is ONE of the leaders currently on the market but, there are many others that are at least in the same class... Best offers from Esoteric,dCS and Weiss are more or less in the same class as Meitner gear... System synergy(I am getting little bit boring here, I am affraid...) and personal preferences are and will be the final judge in our choice. Meitner gear is excellent but, whole class better then anything else??
At least try to keep an open mind... I will have a Meitner duo in one month time and if it will better my Weiss Medea/Jason combo I will say that and write that here! |
In two weeks time I will have Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo for audition. If this combo will be better then my Weiss combo it will stay in my system.
Interesting thing-Esoteric just introduced P-03Universal transport in Japan(USA & Europe late summer 2006). It plays CD/DVD-A/DVD-V and SACD, also it has HDMI. So, now you have a choice to choose with Esoteric D-03 dac, either P-03(CD/SACD) or P-03Universal transports... |
Teajay, some of us have to work...
I have in my system No.1 Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo for few days. It is little bit too early for final judgment but, my feeling is that it is better in few very important areas of sound then my Weiss combo. Since Esoteric combo is very expensive I need more time for final opinion...
Krell Evolution 505 player will be in my systems in early April( I hope!).
Regarding Esoteric I will try to get my hands on D-03/P-03 combo as well as P-03Universal transport as well. I am currently listening to Esoteric UX-3 player and it is a lot better with RBCDs then my DV50s. Since Esoteric will replace DV50s till end of 2006 with DV60(no details yet!) my advice to all potential costumers of DV50s is too either go for UX-3 or wait for DV60...
Any news at your side? |
Muratc,
Both Boulder 1012 or 2020 are excellent units. Even today these designs sounds very good indeed. Metronome Kalista Reference is probably one of the most expensive(and from design point if view one of the most interesting) cd transports currently on the market. It will work with Boulder but, keep in mind that Boulders(1012 and 2020) are fully balanced desinges and they work very best via AES/EBU connection. I will also suggest that you try dCS Purcell between Kalista and 1012(or 2020)... Purcell may be found here on Agon as used unit for not too much money. This way you will also benefite from upsampling(via Purcell) and Boulder will work at 768k upsampling. If you will be able to try this combo please report your findings here. I am very interested in results... |
Muratc, may I also suggest that you try new Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s combo. This combo will cost more or less the same money as Boulder 2020 dac... This is just a thought of mine. Esoteric new units(D-01/P-01/G-0s or D-03/P-03/G-0s combos or X-01 and X-01Limited players) are excellent.
And in the build quality they are in the league of your Boulder combo. Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s combo may sound even better then Boulder 2020 with Kalista. Esoteric gear also sound better via its balanced connection and is fully compatible with your excellent Boulder 2050/2010 combo. As I matter of fact Jeff Fritz of http://www.ultraaudio.com/ is using Boulder 1060/1010 combo and Esoteric UX-3 in his reference system... |
George, not heard X-01Limited yet but, both X-01 and UX-3 sounds very best via balanced connection.
Here is some quote from Marc Michelson review at Soundstage:"One note about using the X-01 Limited to its utmost capabilities: While every sonic point I've made in this review applies to the player balanced or single ended, the X-01 Limited's audio circuit is heavily weighted toward balanced use because of its four-chip-per-channel configuration, and this is how the player sounds its very best. The greater clarity and smoothness along with improved delineation of instruments are obvious. By no means does the X-01 Limited sound bad single ended, but it is unquestionably at its best through its balanced outputs."
Complete review is here: http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/esoteric_x01_limited_followup.htm
So, yes all Esoteric digital gear is designed to sound better via its balanced connection and they will sound very best when used with gear that also preferes balanced connection(Audio Research,Boulder,Krell,Pass etc.). But, you may use it also with normal RCAs... Of course, you will not get the best possible sound. |
Teajay, good to hear from you!
Here is a small Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo review...
First, little bit about build quality-it is absolutely the best made digital gear that ever had a chance to put my fingers on! All the rest(except Weiss) looks really rubbish after these things...
Sound? Well, first issue was break-in period. It is simply toooo long! Over 800hours at least. After that period combo was able to show its intended sound. And what sound it was! It is the simply stunning way of NOT showing to the listener that some part of sonic spectrum are more important then other! English is not my first language so I am sorry if some thinks do not make sense to some of you.
It is very organized sound but, in a good way. My Weiss Medea/Jason combo is much more forward sounding then this Esoteric combo and this was a big suprise for me! Esoteric is more organic in midrange and as powerful in bass(and maybe little bit too tigh for some people). Its treble resolution is stunning but, not bright at all(break-in issue here!). What this combo you here much more detalis then on any other digital gear that I heard before. Whole setup(5 pieces) is little bit pain in the a... You will also need excellent digital cables as well(think Acrolink, Siltech or Stealth). In absolute term it beat my Weiss combo in listner involvment, midrange purity and presentation of details. And it gives you nice mid hall soundstage experience(of course, sound is big if recording is big!). It is excellent on classical, jazz but, also on rock music. It was the best Pink Floyd sound ever in my home! Will I go for it? Maybe... Who am I fooling around! I will! It is expensive but, what a sound... All I need to hear is EMMLabs gear now...
Teajay, what about new Mk4 version of Accustic Arts DAC?? I heard some rumor about it... |
Teajay, I will try to audition EMMLabs combo and Krell Evolution 505 CD/SACD player will be in my system in few weeks. Regarding Krell Evolution Three(3 pieces reference digital player) I will also put my hands on it as soon as it become available. Is Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo my current reference? Yes but, I need to audition Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s combo as well(and maybe even Esoteric P-03Universal transport)...
I forget to say that G-0s external clock is reason for extra 20% better sound. D-01/P-01 combo is excellent without external clock but, simply amazing with it!
BTW, Teajay, give us a small review about Pass XA100, specially how will they sound against your X350.5! |
Guidocorona-P-03/D-03 combo(specially with G-0s) is a lot better then X-01 or X-01Limited. Next month there will be a review on Soundstage web site by M.Michelson-very positive one! Esoteric P-03/D-03/G-0s combo is almost as good as P-01/D-01/G-0s combo...
Kops-Regarding Theta GenVIII I auditionit few months ago with Theta Compli universal transport(with so called Theta link connection between them) and was not that impressed...
Theta GenVII/Comli combo was warmer in upper midrange them my Weiss Medea/Jason combo but, whole sound quality was a lot better with Weiss. Weiss combo was more detailed, with more low level details and better upper level resolution. Biggest difference was bass, Theta combo was not that powerful or defined in bass(specially lower bass as organ pedal notes). Also build quality of Theta combo was well, not at the best level... |
Guido, I did not listen personally so this info is only second hand...
My friend compared X-01 against P-03/D-03/G-0s combo. His findings:
1. P-03/D-03/G-0s combo is better then X-01 in low level resolution, bass power and definition, midrage presence.
Highs are allmost the same as on X-01 but, more organic sounding.
2. Is P-03/D-03/G-0s combo worth the extra price over X-01(or X-01LTD)? In his words answer is yes.
I did comparison between my P-01/D-01/G-0s and Weiss Medea/Jason combos against X-01 and difference were allmost the same. Big Esoteric combo was a lot better then its small borther... On the other hand Weiss combo was not so much better then X-01, specially on some specific music...
I will have P-03/D-03 combo in few weeks time and I will then post here small review and comparison against P-01/D-01/G-0s and Weiss Medea/Jason combo's. |
Teajay, I am glad that you liked sound of Esoteric X-01LTD.
Precentage of differences? I would say that X-01 achives about 75% of P-01/D-01/G-0s combo. X-01LTD is little bit better then X-01 but, difference here is within 5%, IMO.
As Alex very nicely pointed out P-03/D-03/G-0s combo is different sounding then P-03/D-03/G-0s combo since it is using AD1955 dacs(D-01 or X-01/X-01LTD are using BB1704) which are warmer sounding devices by design. So, you can even say that D-03 is #2 sound flavor but, not IMO. It is very closr to #2 flavor but, still #1 flavor for me. All Esoteric gear is #1 flavor with D-03 sounding warmer then others.
Let put it this way:
P-01/D-01/G-0s combo 100%
P-03/D-03/G-0s combo 90%(in some systems up to 95%)
X-01LTD 80%
X-01 75%
UX-1/X-03 65%(or 70% for X-03)
UX-3 60%
DV-50S 50%
As a comparison(IMO):
Weiss Medea/Jason combo 85%(in some systems up to 90%)
Krell Evolution 505 80%(XLRs, with Krell CAST up to 90%!!)
Audio Research REF CD7 75%(but, emotional champ!)
All comparison are made in my system No.1
Teajay, are you starting to consider some of Esoteric gear for your system? |
Ok, here we go...
Jordan, difference between X-03 and UX-3 is indeed very small. I will correct myself-both are around 65-70%, depending on the system. But, to my ears X-03 sounded little bit better in bass(RBCDs) then UX-3.
Since I own DV-50s,UX-3 and P-01/D-01/G-0s combo I think that I have enough Esoteric experience...
One other thing-all these ratings are with balanced(XLRs) connection. All Esoteric gear sounds better that way and most of them use differential dacs configuration.
If you do not need DVD-V/DVD-A playback then simply go for X-03 and save some money(more CDs or maybe new G-25U clock that I will try in two weeks time with UX-3).
Arnie, I agree with you 100% that X-01LTD is the best buy currently form Esoteric(Although, both X-03 and UX-3 are very good players for money also, IMO) and maybe the best buy in that price range on the market!
We shouldn't forget that build quality of all Esoteric gear is way better then most of the competition.
Teajay, difference between X-01(I did not yet audition X-01LTD in my system) and Accustic Arts Drive1/DAC1Mk3 combo?
X-01 is better in bass definition and tightness, midrange is little beat leaner then Accustic Arts(but, this is really small difference) and highs are more open on X-01 with a lot more details. All in all X-01 is excellent #1 flavor player and Accustic Arts is excellent #2 flavor combo. They are different sounding so, final choice will more depend on system synergy(Here I go again!!) and/or your personal music taste.
If any of you want little bit warmer sound from Esoteric then P-03/D-03/G-0s combo is the answer. But, I do not know why yet, this combo is sounding warmer without G-0s then with it! And to my ears sound of this combo with G-0s is definitely better and more "Esoteric like" in flavor... |
Jordan, price for G25U is $3K in USA.
Teajay,Guido and all other guys-here is a link to 6moons Srajan Ebaen Esoteric G25U review:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/esoteric2/g25u.html
Although I personally do not like Mr. Ebaen writing style or his system I think this is his best review yet. It is not positive or negative, you will see... Technically, it features several topics that may be interested for you. Please, comment this review here after reading it! |
Guido, Jordan and rest-glad you like the article!
Guido, effect of G-0s is truly as you said more apparent on combo's like P-01/D-01 or P-03/D-03...
I first listen P-01/D-01 combo without G-0s for one week time and then I add G-0s. At first I was puzzled with effect of G-0s but, after a while its effect was clear to me! Example: on "Misa Criolla" by Ariel Ramirez(Philips Classics 420 955-2) voice of Jose Carreras is more natural with G-0s then without it! And chorus on the same recording is more powerfull with G-0s! But, these differences are within 5% margin... So, if P-01/D-01/G-0s combo is 100% then P-01/D-01 is 95%! Yes, final 5% of performance for $13K! But, IMO G-0s is a must for any buyer of P-01/D-01, P-03/D-03 or P-03Universal/D-03 combos.
Now, when I know effect(those 5%!!) of G-0s I can not live without it. Call me crazy but,that's the fact.
Guido, I absolutely agree with you that G-0s is actually not important with X-01/X-01LTD at all. This is the reson that I will test cheaper G-25U with UX-3 player to see if there is any effect at all. |
Teajay,
Esoteric gear looses around 10% of its performance if you use single-ended connection. Same is with my Audio Research Reference CD7!
Accustic Arts Player1Mk2 or Audio Research REF CD7? In absolute terms REF CD7 is better player but, there are few issues... First, Accustic Arts Player1Mk2 sound the same in balanced as in single-ended mode. That is advantage if your friend can not use balanced connection. Second, REF CD7 runs very warm(7 tubes inside!) and user will have to change its tubes someday... Third, price difference is around $2K and while REF CD7 is better player how many CDs can you buy for $2k?? So, if money is no object(in $10K range) and your friend wants the best #2 flavor sound and he can run it balanced then Audio Research Reference CD7 is the answer. But, if he needs to use single-ended connection only and wants to save some money(more CDs!!) then, although not that good, Accustic Arts Player1Mk2 is a good solution. |
Teajay, as far as I know Accustic Arts DAC-1 Mk4 is allready available here in Europe. I will be in Munich this week at High end show so I will see many new digital pieces... Of course, I will arrange audition of new Accustic Arts DAC and Drive 1 transport. Only thing-I need balanced version because both of my systems sound better in that mode(Krell gear sound very best in CAST mode IMO, BTW)... If you need more info just email me.
One other thing-IMO Accustic Arts should change name to something else rather then DAC-1 Mk4 because new DAC is pretty different internally then Mk3 version. Also Mk3 version is NOT possible to upgrade to Mk4 status... |
George, Krell Evolution 505 is wonderfull player. Its performance, specially in CAST mode in truly amazing. This player has powerfull sound with warm treble and excellent midrange articulation. It is at the same level as Weiss combo! And this was a very big suprise for me! Its price/performance ratio is excellent and truly hard to beat in all Krell(CAST) system. Still, Evolution 505 is closer in sound signature to ARC REF CD7 then to Weiss or Esoteric combo... This means that its sound is warmer then average #1 flavor digital source. But, with XLRs you can get up to 90% of performance-comparing to CAST mode and you will loose another 10% with RCAs. Build quality is very good(same level of quality as ARC REF CD7) but, not at Esoteric level.
End conclusion-excellent new player from Krell, very hard to beat in Krell all CAST system. In non-Krell system results will vary. Performance level of Krell Evolution 505 is the same as Audio Research Reference CD7. Indeed very nice machine and in bass reproduction at the true reference level. Hope this will help-more next month... |
Teajay, unfortunately you will have to wait till at least late June 2006 for my report about Accustic Arts DAC-1Mk4/Drive-1 combo. I will receive this combo late June/early July but, my plan was to go to my beach house with my family from 08th July till 05th August...
Any way I am looking forward to audition new DAC-1Mk4! Your findings are extremly positive and honestly I think we need something at reference level(performance wise) but, at almost normal(for high end!) price range... I hope you agree with me since all other gear is very expensive.
Currently I have Audio Research Reference CD7 player and Weiss Medea/Jason combo in my system No.2 and Krell Evolution 505 player and Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s combo in my system No.1 and let me tell you honestly that performance of both Audio Research and Krell players are at almost the same level as Weiss combo... Progress I guess... Also I am currently auditioning some new speaker. Just to say this it is better then my Amati Anniversario but, not as good as Krell LAT-1000. More on this speaker in August... Sorry to go little bit off topic!
Teajay, in your opinion how much better over all is new DAC-1Mk4 then Mk3 version(in % if possible)? Thanks for your answer and for your introduction to this wonderfull brand! |
There is a new contender from Swiss-Orpheus Labs
Heritage Signature DAC-this DAC is really something speciall... I will have it next month together with Orpheus Zero D cd transport. More is on 6moons article:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/orpheus/heritage.html |
Soundstage review of Esoteric D-03/P-03 combo in on line:
http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/esoteric_p03_d03.htm
Read it! It is excellent review and post your comments here. |
Esoteric just introduced replacment for DV50s in Japan-two models! SA-60 and DV-60, SA-60 is SACD/CD player only while DV-60 is universal player. More details soon!
Both are expected to hit stores in USA and Europe early autumn 2006. |
Teajay,
This is excellent thread and it contain a lot of very usefull info about various DAC sound. I agree from the start with your #1 and #2 flavor groups and it seems to me like a good idea. But, some recent auditions of new gear showed me that some of DACs(or combos) are around #1.5 or even #1.8 sound. What does that mean? Simly they have all #1 sound quality but, add natural presentation without edge or britt in sound as well. Little bit of warmth also!
I also find out that system synergy(here I go again!) is the key word!
BTW, I am in the process of changing most of the gear in my system No.2... If few months more info.
Current favs:
Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s(#1 champ,in some systems too clinical)
Metronome C-2A Sig/Kallista Reference(#1.8 sound, best tube dac that I ever audition, amazing combo)
Orpheus Lab Heritage/Zero D(#1.1 sound, still break-in period but, already something special...)
Accustic Arts DAC-1Mk4/Drive1Mk2(#1.3 sound, best value for the money but, still not in the class of three combos mentioned above)
Audio Research Reference CD7(#1.9 sound, best tube cd player on the market IMHO)
Krell Evolution 505(#1.3 sound, a must in all Krell CAST system, betters all player below $10K IMHO)
More info in few week time... |
Music... Coltrane, Monk, M.Davis-usual Jazz. Mozart, Beethoven and Mahler-classic. Pink Floyd, RHCP-rock.
Particia Barber, Diana Krall and Sara K.-female jazz.
Sound-very big and powerfull sound. Best bass from tube dac so far, creamy midrange and very open but, not edgy highs. Sampling rate is depending more on recording. On RR recordings highest sample rate is the best but, on some non-audiophile recordings it was not.
In-review in few weeks... |
Teajay,
I will try to answer your questions:
1)Yes. Esoteric combo offer level of detail that is simply not present on Accustic Arts combo. Metronome is sounding bigger, fuller and excell on Jazz music. Orpheus Labs is better in bass depth and definition, also on overall soundstage size. In short all three top combos are class above Accustic Arts combo.
2)Yes again. Its sonic signature is like a small unity between Esoteric and Metronome. Orpheus Lab is different sounding but, it may be actually winner here for 90% of audiophiles...
3)Musicality... IMHO, this is truly subjective thing but, I will try to gave you % factor. For this thing I will use "Soultrane" from J.Coltrane:
100% Orpheus Lab
99% Metronome
99% Accustic Arts
98% Esoteric
You see, with Jazz standard this is the ranking but, with different music different results!
It will also depend very much on rest of the system. Im my experience speakers are the most important part of any high-end system. My new speakers(they are on the same level as Krell LAT-1000s!) are simply awsome and they are drawing me into the music more then any speaker before.
I also found(for me!) perfect amps and preamps. Digital front end is the key element of my current search.
Last comment about Accustic Arts combo. IMHO it is current class leader for digital gear up to $16K. Better sound is possible, but for a lot more money...
BTW, two new speakers that I currently audition besides my Krell LAT-1000s are also USA made stuff. More on them soon, but just a little hint-they are both leaders, first one in true world class, second in $15K class. |
Nilthepill,
Metronome combo is always sounding big and full, with all kinds of music. This feature is not always a welcome thing, with rock music for example(some rock recordings are pump up anyway!). IMHO this Metronome's sonic signature is also its biggest problem because not all recording are welcoming such a presentation.
Esoteric, Orpheus and AA are little bit more neutral IMHO overall.
More on Orpheus Labs Heritage dac is here:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/orpheus/heritage.html
It is long and pretty messy review, but I urge you to read it anyway.
Metronome is maybe most "musicall" of all this combos, specially with Jazz and Classical music. Overall neutral champs it is not...
Analogue front end... I have one ten years ago(SME30), but since I gave it up I do not plane to return!
BTW, my best friend owns very good analogue front end(Brinkmann) and in his opinion some of digital gear that he audition in my house betters his Brinkmann by some margin. In all honesty I must say that the rest of his system is not in the same league as my systems... |
Jim,
ARC Reference CD7 is wonderfull player. It is only short in overall detail level and soundstage size comparing to three reference combos from Esoteric, Metronome and Orpheus Lab. Differences, specially is soundstage size are not that dramatic, but it is not as wide as Metronomes for example or its depth is not hall like as Orpheus Lab. For tube cd player CD7 has excellent bass power and definition and is also pretty big sounding. As a matter of fact it is IMHO overall value champ.
Just a warning-it is very warm running player. Placement on top shelf of rack is a MUST! Also do not use it with too warm sounding cables-you will get too much of "warmth". |
New digital gear:
Accuphase DC-801 DAC
Accuphase DP-800 SACD/CD transport
Accuphase DP-500 CD player
Esoteric X-01 D2 SACD/CD player(it seems to use AD1955)
and
Wadia 971(rumor reference SACD/CD transport as companion for 921/931)
New version of X-01 is a big suprise and will make a lot of X-01/X-01LTD owners not too happy... |
Al,
New Esoteric X-01 D2 could be revolutionary player! Big difference is that it is using DUAL(!!) DACs for PCM and DSD. PCM1704 is used for CD playback and AD1955 is used for DSD(both in balaced configuration). But, you can also upsample PCM to DSD or DSD to PCM as well. There are 3 types of DSD modes also. New X-01 D2 is using further updated VRDS-NEO transport and is pretty much very complex machine. Release in Japan in December, USA Januar 2007 and EU March 2007.
BTW, also new is EMMLabs CDSA CD/SACD player without preamp function. |
First about Krell Evolution 505... It is IMHO one of the best players on the market in this price class. In all Krell CAST connected system it betters even more expensive combo like Weiss in most areas(but, this is my subjective opinion!).
Teajay, I did not audition Audiomat gear, but I recently had a chance to audition Zanden combo and did not like it at all! To euphonic and old fashioned for my taste. Midrange is good, but its presentation is not my cup of tea.
EAR Acute is interesting machine! But it is not in the same league as ARC REF CD7 or Krell Evolution 505. And EAR build quality is not very best. For people that are seeking good tube cd player EAR could be a nice choice. Only one thing-home audition here is a must! |
No slouch,
I did not audition Bluenote. If you need RBCD sound very close to #2 flavor(or #2 flavor) then you can decide between ARC REF CD7 or Lindemann 820. Both are very good, ARC is little bit more organic in midrange to my ears. Both players are sounding very best via its balanced outputs. Lindemann is also little bit more user friendly(front loader, no tubes inside) for most people.
Try to audition both for yourself if possible. |
Hi Teajay, Your findings regarding difference between Accustic Arts combo and Esoteric X-01LTD almost mirrors my own resluts. For some people Esoteric player may even be little bit too lean in midrange but, not to my ears(well, almost). Esoteric big(D-01/P-01/G-0s) combo is better in that area then X-01LTD but, basic sonic signature is the same. New Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s combo is warmer sounding(AD1955), with fuller presentation. Is it better then big D-01/P-01/G-0s combo? Well, no. Big combo is better at details, soundstage size(more natural IMHO) and PRAT. Accustic Arts combo is real world champ for its price IMHO.
BTW, for all Krell systems new Evolution 505 player is absolutely amazing choice. In CAST connection it is able to give performance at Accustic Arts combo level in RBCD playback. And you receive SACD playback for free. Just a warning-you can loose up to 10% of its performaance if you use balanced or single-ended connection in non-Krell system.
Now, back to new Esoteric X-01 D2. Since it is using two differenent dacs(BB1704 and AD1955) it will feature pretty different sound singatures from single machine. Just a guess-it will be auditioning and reviewing nightmare! I am kidding but, we all will need a lot of time before we reach any good conclusion about X-01 D2(of course, when we all audition it!)... |
Osgorth,
If you already decided for all MBL setup then it most logical step to go for 1622 and 1611E. In all MBL system they will be very hard to beat IMHO.
But, to my ears MBL 1621/1611E combo is not better then Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s or Metronome C2-A Sig/Kallista Reference combos...
So, for your all MBL system 1621(or even better new 1622) and 1611E are good choice IMHO.
Just as a comparison Metronome combo is more powerfull sounding then MBL IMO. And it is my current #2 sound favorite.
One other thing-your MBL dealer should provide you with 1621/1611E combo to audition it in your future system. You are buying complete MBL system at his place!! |
Rene,
First let me tell you that some of your findings are similar to mine.
I know about difficulty to get your hands on D-01/P-01/G-0s in EU... I was in similar process...
Regarding sound differences between two combos IMHO big(D-01/P-01/G-0s) is better in RBCD playback IMO. It is faster, more detailed and with to my ears little bit different bass. It is not that forcefull ar first as smaller(D-03/P-03/G-0s) combo but, longer you listen you see that big combo is actually more realistic in bass then small one. I think that we are talking here about difference between PCM1704(D-01) and AD1955(D-03). Big combo is not that warm(in fact not warm at all) as small one is. Smaller is fatter sounding and this sonic signature can be very pleasing IMO to some people. BTW, if D-01/P-01/G-0s combo is #1.1 sound, then D-03/P-03/G-0s is #1.6! Yes, it is warmer to my ears then big one...
What is better? I do not know-it will pretty much depend on rest of your system(Ha! Here I go again-system synergy...)
You are also right regarding MC setup. I was looking in D-01/P-01 manuals and it is little mess to connect six of them... And I am not talking here about potential cost of such MC combo...
New versions(D2??) of 01 and 03 combos with separate(PCM 1704-RBCD/AD1955-SACD) DACs? IMHO Esoteric will probably wait for first reviews of X-01 D2 and also for first costumers feedback before releasing updated versions of 01 and 03 combos. So, it seems that X-01 D2 is pretty crucial for them IMHO. But, it will be reviewers(and potential costumers as well) nightmare! Why? Too much upsampling and so options! Example: RBCD with PCM1704, then SACD with AD1955, how about RBCD upsampled to SACD via AD1955? Do you know what I mean here?
And I fully agree with you about ES-link vs i-Link. AES/EBU connection works way better IMHO.
D-03/P-03/G-0s is fine match with your system. You may also think about P-03Universal(when it become available in EU) as another interesting candidate(DVD-A and DVD-V!!).
Jorma Prime? Excellent cables IMHO but, they are as well as Acrolink stuff pretty much as unforgiving as cables can be in describing that something is wrong in your system IMO. Do not get me wrong, both are excellent but, you need to match them pretty carefully with the rest of the system.
And I agree with you regarding cable brand synergy. Same brand ICs and speaker cables are the best match IMHO. |
Rene,
regarding difference between 01 and 03 combos my idea is that gain in performance is not that big if you go for MC 01 setup. But, price difference is huge...
For two channel playback(RBCD/SACD) 01 combo is better IMHO.
For your setup little bit warmer sounding 03 combo is actually better choice IMO. Specially if you decide to try(or even buy) Jorma Prime ICs and speaker cables. This cables, although excellent IMHO are not the warmest cables in business...
In my system N0.1 I like 01 combo more then 03... But, honestly difference is not that big...
I also heard from reliable source that there is NO difference in RBCD and SACD playback between P-03 and P-03Universal. Great thing that you confirmed this results!
And when we are talking about favorites, here are mine:
#1 flavor
-Accustic Arts DAC1Mk4/Drive1Mk2(#1.2)
-Esoteric D-01/P-01/G-0s(#1.2)
-Esoteric D-03/P-03/G-0s(#1.5)
-Esoteric X-01LTD(#1.1)
-Krell Evolution 505(#1.6)
-Orpheus Lab Heritage/Zero D(#1.5)
-Weiss Medea/Jason(#1.4)
#2 flavor
-Audio Research Reference CD7(#2.1)
-Metronome C-2A Sig/Kallista Reference(#2.1)
Also reccommended are Accustic Arts Player1Mk2, Ayre C-5xe and all Metronome players...
I am not(sorry!) big fan of either EMMLabs or Zanden... |
New EMMLabs one box player as Henry already said.
Wadia 581 as alternative...
BTW, I will try to audition new Wadia 521 DAC as soon as Wadia introduce matching 771 CD Transport(RBCD only!)... |
Here are some news for this excellent thread:
I auditioned Esoteric X-01 D2 pretty extensively in last few months. My end conclusion is that it sound very best in my system in BB mode... Build quality is excellent and I can recomment this unit to most of you since it is really chameleon like in its presentation(BB, AD etc. modes)...
Accustic Arts just released new TUBE DAC! Here is a short description:"Handmade in Germany, Accustic Art's new $10,500 DAC sports dual 32-bit mono converters for left and right channels, a class A power supply with 84,000uF of capacitance, dual encapsulated toroidal transformers and a heavy gauge solid aluminum chassis. The hand-selected tubes are 2 x 12AX7WA/ECC83. These tubes are lab tested by Accustic Arts and burned in for 100 hours prior to shipping. Both balanced and single ended outputs are provided, and a full compliment of digital inputs including XLR, RCA & BNC." Sound very promissing indeed...
BTW, new Esoteric D-05/P-05 combo is also using 32bit dacs... |
