really? .89c ground lifters?


if i understand correctly (and I'm guessing that I don't), only one component in a given system should be grounded.

so does that mean that all you guys with your GNP-level systems, plumbed with bazillion dollar power cords, are using a bucketful of home depot-style ground lifters? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around that. Is there some source for solid-gold cryo'd ground lifters I have not found?

How is this problem addressed? My searching skills are failing this morning...there was a lot of chilean and argentinean wine involved last night. thanks.
soundgasm

Showing 5 responses by minorl

Absolutely never lift grounds. You are taking out of action the method used to protect you. If you have hum or noise, then you should investigate each unit individually until you isolate which piece of equipment is causing the ground loop or hum and fix it. Lifting the ground may mask the ground loop or hum problem, but you have now introduced a potential for serious injury or death. No joke! This is the same logic as taking a radio or hair dryer into the bath tub. Everything is fine until is slips out of your hand and falls into the water, then it is too late. You are asking for trouble lifting grounds. Find the problem and fix it. Lifting grounds does not fix the problem. There are many posts here that explain the method for isolating which component is causing the problem.

Enjoy, but do so safely and use common sense.
I again want to reiterrate that removing grounds is not only unsafe, it is irresponsible and the potential is not for electric shock, but for death. People are minimizing what could happen here. As an Electrical/Electronics Engineer, I am telling you that lifting the ground and you become a better ground than the house ground and electricity will take the easiest path to ground and that becomes you. There are many ways posted to find the faulty equipment. Please do so and fix the problem, do not lift grounds. Remember, "Accidents" happen when you do not expect them to. Lifting a ground in my opinion and getting severely shocked or causing a death is not an "Accident" you were asking for it by lifing the ground. Also, the load in your home should be balanced on each phase. Having all of your high power equipment on one phase will overload the wiring, cause it to heat up (IxIxR) losses and cause the insulation to fail causing a major electrical fire. Imagine having one outlet or several outlets in series back to the panel on one phase. You now have a 10, 12 or 16 gauge wire w/neutral caring all that current. Is that wire rated for the maximum amount of your equipment? If not, no electrician worth their salt would allow this. Having your equipmen balanced on each phase is the proper way and having several independent outlets run to each phase with their own neutrals is the proper way. Example would be if you have mono amps for your speakers. One proper way is to have separate outlets for each amp run back to the panel and another outlet run to the panel for the lower powered equipment (pre-amp, turn table, tuner, cd player, etc., which should be combined via a conditioner, or multiple outlet device.

Enjoy and stay safe
the human body is an impedance. resistance, inductance and capacitance. You have an impedance. If there is a system fault or a lightning strike, or some such, very high voltages can pass through the equipment through you to ground. Since you lifted the ground, you become the easiest path to ground. We are not talking about audio equipment. We are taking about electricity, voltages, sometimes very high voltages, current and impedances. a blown transformer and you have very high voltage spikes, a shorted device or a failed tubed device and very high voltages hit you passing very high currents through your body. Since you are an impedance, small but there, you will draw very high currents.

Simply electronics/electricity rules.

enjoy.
I understand what you are saying. However, in terms of electrical design and safety and codes, you never, never, never lift grounds. If there is a problem, hum, ground loops, etc. isolate the faulty piece of equipment or cable and fix or replace it. Like I implied earlier, all you need is for it to happen once for you to realize what a bad mistake you made by lifting the ground and compromising the electrical safety. That is, if you are still alive to talk about it. It may not be you. It may be a child or guest. I have experienced ground loops and hum before. I took the time to isolate the faulty equipment and fix or replace it. I'm very much into great music and accurate, detailed reproduction of the signals, but not at the cost of safety. Life is short enough as it is. I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade but, cutting corners and shortcuts are not the proper way. One should never advocate compromising safety.

Enjoy
Based on what you have been reading, you have two lines of thought and advice. 1). Audiophiles that really no nothing about electricity and grounding that advise doing the quick and dirty fix by lifting grounds and 2) people that understand electricity and the rules of house wiring, by telling you quite simply, to never lift grounds. find the problem equipment and fix or replace it. Balanced loads and yes, any electrician worth their salt will balance AC and other appliances on each side of the phases. it is not randomly attached. It is the ultimate wrong thing to do to advise anyone to compromise the electrical system and rules. If you are touching your equipment or sometimes another piece of equipment or metal in your home and a fault occurs, either in your home, piece of equipment or outside (lightning strike, etc.) that ground that you just lifted offers the safe path to ground for current, but you just lifted it. So, electricity will try to find the shortest path to ground. it could be through another piece of equipment with a ground, you if you are touching something at the time, or a family member. Find a licensed electrician and ask. This is not a good idea. I know, I'm not telling you what you want to hear, (maybe I am), but, shortcuts never are good. In equipment design and construction or otherwise. Do the hard work early and life is easier later on. no shortcuts.

enjoy.