Ready to try vinyl

I think you guys may be running the risk of crushing the inertia of the original poster, who simply ask if he should venture into the world of vinyl.

Personally I am slow to suggest that move to anyone who is not already into LP's, its a big commitment and some feel the reward is worth the effort and others do not.

I have multiple sources including CD, SACD, FM tuner, LP and open reel tape. All have merit, but without question my favorite is LP, as it represents the best balance of reproduced music quality and availability of software.

If ABSOLUTE quality were the only issue, master tape dubs played at 15 IPS and 30 IPS on an open reel Ampex 351 is the clear winner, beating ALL turntables regardless of make or design.

That being said, I have owned most of the big names in turntables, including the Lenco, the Gerrard and the Walker. In my opinion, this discussion should center around bang for the buck / best performance.

The Lenco is a killer little table for NO MONEY. I bought mine at EBAY for about $100.00, added a Decca arm and Shure cartridge and had amazing sound for very little investment.

I did eventually sell this rig, not because it was not good, but because I was getting better results from my Walker and my open reel.

Open reel would be a great alternative if you could assemble a decent sized library of music. I will be lucky if I wind up with 300 to 500 titles before I run out of options. That being said, I enjoy my open reel, it's an important part of my high end system and serves as a reference to keep everything in perspective.

On the other hand, a young guy might have trouble finding ANY open reel tapes that appeal, unless he's into Jazz or Classical.

Great LP's are still being pressed and my Walker is better than many of the original tapes of this same music. The master dubs I have are the ultimate quality and the best LP's (45 RPM) offer about 75% of the quality of my best master tape dubs.

The Lenco may not equal this ultimate ($32K) table, or the VERY limited master dubs, but amazing quality at NO MONEY. The investment factor in a new format for a young guy is a big factor. So when we Audiogoners recommend a product to a newbee, remember to keep his investment low and safe until he can decide if this is really the way to go.

He may listen for three months, get bored with what's available and go back to strictly CD.

If it's fun and he can find software that makes him happy, shows what the format can do and connects him to the magic the world of analog can offer, we may have a convert.

my humble take on this is that in fact speed accuracy IS INDISPUTABLY as important as it "seems," and the issue at hand is not the table/arm/cartridge combination, but the table ONLY, and it's one and only function, which is to maintain as stable a speed as is possible to reproduce the time domain of the LP. to compare this to specifications of amplifiers is comparing apples to horse apples IMHO. the key is IMPLEMENTATION (as in all things), and the walker had better be optimized in this respect to justify it's price. to hear a properly implemented/optimized technics, lenco or garrard with the same arm and cartridge would be preferred, and i guess that's where things are going. this is getting exciting!

i would add that jean's lenco thread did not require endorsement by anyone, it has stood on it's own merits and by his (significant and ongoing) efforts since day one. not trying to be overly contentious, but that needed to be said. credit where credit is due.

I think you missed the point. When I posted at the Lenco thread it was very early on with lots of speculation as to the accuracy of Jeans comments. I put my money up, ordered a Lenco off Ebay, ordered a Decca tonearm from Holland, a new EAR 834 phono and Shure cartridge, just from Jean's comments. I even went on to design my own plinth and post it in vertual systems here at Audiogon. I am a supporter of Jeans ideas.

My results were wonderful, the Lenco is an inexpensive turntable that makes great music for little money. My comments were supportive of Jean and I take no credit for his thread.

As with all things high end, the performance differences seldom justify the price. For me, LP is my main source of listening as my library is mostly vinyl and the Walker is so far beyond any other LP playback source it defies logic.

What got this thread off center were comments that appeared to support the idea that speed accuracy was so important that it surpassed the "whole package" approach. I'm not saying speed accuracy is not important, but not so important that it can overcome all the engineering that make up the turntable package.

Having owned two Basis Debut Gold (Model 4 and 5) with both AirTangent 10B and Graham 2.2 arms with exact same Koetsu RSP I'm using with the Walker, I can state without doubt, the Basis is speed accurate enough to provide state of the art sound.

The Walker package is superior to the Basis and although the Walker is more speed accurate, it is only part of the picture.

An "equal" test is not possible between a Walker and a Lenco or Technics as the Walker arm is integrated into the foundation and design of the table. Any comparisons would be between the Walker package and whatever package was chosen for the other table.

Testing is fine and I will support it, but having heard the Technics tens of dozens of times, I know exactly what it sounds like. If anyone want's to challenge the Walker in a "dollar for dollar" match against the Technics, I concede defeat before the test begins. Just the same as Rockport must concede defeat against the Walker as it costs three times the price.

Here the idler/DD TT's beats any belt drive design ( including the Walker ). I own four belt drive TTs, three SP 10MK2, two DP80s and one DP75 Denon's. In the past I was owner of: SP10MK3 and a Denon DP 100 ( please don't ask why I don't own today these two TTs. I don't want to remember it ).

Raul, although I frequently agree with your writings, we are very far apart on this topic.

Having owned multiple direct drive and idler wheel drive design turntables, I am aware of their strengths. No question their speed accuracy is uncanny, but there are a few exquisitely engineered belt drive turntables that overcome this technical obstacle.

The Walker represents the pinnacle of this engineering, maintaining flawless speed accuracy and control that equals the idler wheel models while maintaining such virtues as adjustable air suspension system, air bearing non-resonant platter and integrated linear tracking arm with adjustable pressure air bearing.

Understand, I was one of the first to compliment Johnnantais and throw my support behind him when his Lenco thread was begun. In spite of my admiration of the Lenco and Garrard idler wheel designs, there is no contest between these and the Walker.

We can banter back and forth on this all day, so I will just say that you're entitled to your opinion and that I don't share your view. This, based on my own experimentation over the years with hundreds of turntables.

OK then, your comments are based on specification posted by Technics, builder of the SP10 MK3.

If that number is correct, perhaps speed accuracy is not as important as it seems.

Or perhaps the whole turntable and arm package is more important than just speed accuracy, assuming Technics has stated speed accuracy properly.

Many pieces of equipment that are excellent on paper do not necessarily sound excellent . For instance, Technics also builds some integrated amplifiers that have amazingly low distortion specification but sound pretty dismal against tube based amps from Atma-Sphere, VTL or Audio Research, all of which have higher distortion numbers.

I have owned several direct drive tables and auditioned the Technics hundreds of times when I sold them. I was never impressed enough with their performance to consider them for state of the art playback. Of course I was going by sound, not the specification sheet.

Certainly I'm up for it, I like tests.

Your welcome to fly here and bring whatever equipment you wish. I have a nice high end system to do the audition and a support group of audiophiles to help us physically move things.

If you don't like my equipment, one of my members must have a speaker you approve of, including Vandy 5's, Kharma Exquisite 1D-E, Wilson Maxx, Wilson Watt 6, Sound lab A-1, Sound Lab A-3, Magneplanar 20's, Magneplanar 3.6, Aerial 10B, and from the "do it yourself" crowd, multiple horn systems powered with SET amps.

How far away are you?

Before we can go-on there is one subject that is really important for to do a critical evaluation on TTs and that critical subject is the TONEARM/CARTRIDGE combination: is has to be the same. Albert we have to find how we can run the Walker with a different tonearm. If we can solve this issue, I can give/put two samples of the same tonearm.

Sorry Raul, that is not possible. The Walker tonearm is integrated with the turntable and there is no room to add another arm or anything to mount an arm to. The base of the Walker is stone and I have no interest in drilling into it to mount another tonearm for a test.

I never post that idea, I post : +++++ " A Walker DD system beats a Walker belt drive system .. " +++++

Not according to Lloyd Walker. His opinion of direct drive is the cogging (search for speed) is worse than errors of his air bearing and silk belt drive. Guess that will never be resolved as Walker has no intention of building a direct drive so, we are back to one mans opinion against another mans opinion.

You are secure with your decision and I with mine.