yes, i have heard that as well. Jonathan Valin actually specifically makes comparisons to earlier models...worth a read. look on line. www.avguide.com |
Hi Katamapah,
Actually, if i may respectfully say...the Extrema is probably the best of the SF speakers for trance, deep house. The Homage series are mellifluous...like cognac. The Extrema is more like a whisky or a bourbon. It has the extreme bass power and solidity to carry thru the pounding and the quick deep propulsive bass better than the Guarneri by far.
and yes, it needs and can take TONS of high-current power.
that is a very good option, and at today's s/hand prices...a great, great deal if you are happy with it. its' got my vote on your behalf! but only your vote counts! |
Hi katampah,
i have the opposite experience...never heard the older ones but have heard 988, 989, 2905 and the bigger 290-series as well. from what people in the room told me (who had heard the older ones and used them for years):
- the newer ones might lack a bit of the 'magic' that existed in the originals...but not everyone agreed with that
- what most people DID agree is that the build quality of 2905 is more solid, and the bass more powerful...and it does not shut off at nearly as soft a dynamic level as the older ones...so you can play much louder without fear of shut-down
- its faster and cleaner, more linear and more modern in its sound qualities
- otherwise, though very much a Quad speaker that has much of the electrostatic qualities that make them so unique |
Yes, i do. I heard all kinds of music...because i brought my own music which includes both jazz, classical, orchestral, as well as hip hop, rap, deep house. They are not optimal speakers for the hip hop, electronic stuff.
But compared to their older ancestors, i am told they hold up much better and you might find, with very high current amps that effortlessly deliver clean power to the speakers, you (might) get to a level that you are happy with. try...you never know. |
Hi. i did not buy them...but not because i was not tempted!!! ;) I think the MG is a very, very good option. they are excellent, clean and much, much better suited for power. Whether you think they have quite the natural tonality is up to you...some of the MGs are cleaner, more linear, more modern in their sound. i have not heard them all. But they are still definitely electrostatics. They have the special magic that makes electrostatics so alluring. i have heard only very, very good things abou the 3.7.
You may also wish to hear the CLX, depending on budget. It is stunning...it lacks super bass but add the Descent sub someday and you've got world class full-range, full dynamics. seriously.
as for 2 speakers, thats a personal choice. not one for me...i prefer to buy the 'one' i like and focus on optimizing room, system, etc to optimize. and i know not all music will sound as good on it as others...but as you suggest, 2 speakers takes space and requires time wiring, moving, etc...
i do like Guarneris and Amatis...very electrostatic-like. The Anniversario has good bass (the new Futura even better). Guarneris are very, very electrostatic in nature...but very sweet tonality. you can play them loud...providing you've got high current...which the Quads will also require. good luck!!! pls keep us posted. |
Given your desire for some serious volume, i would take Extrema over memento. Keep looking...you'll find one.
As for warm on Extrema with electronic...what electronics did you hear with the Extrema?
I suspect if you'd been using a good preamp and Krell FPB monoblocks, you'd have hard superbly powerful, clean natural but not overly warm sound with your deep electronic music... |
Hi...i have not heard mistral.
did you check the Sonus Faber for sale section here? there is a pair of Amati Homages for $9995. That is a superb price. The seller is an SF dealer, so hopefully you are buying safely. The bass is way better than esl63, and for the money hard to beat in the overall sound spectrum. at least email them and let them know you may be interested...give you some time to consider your next move! |
FWIW, when i heard the 2905s...i started out with an A/B to Guarneris...then to Amatis...then to Strads...so when i give you my thoughts, they really are direct comparisons on the same day in the same system with amplification that was supposedly set up well for the audition. |
Yes, I have heard them. They maintain the qualities of SF but are not as refined as the Homage series or the Extrema, Electa Amator2. However, they are are quite full range for the price. And with excellet amplication...they go well with Krell (imho, unlike the Homage series)...they are quite a smooth, powerful sound. Electa Amators are excellent speakers...their bass is the question...it is enough for you? Is there no way you can hear the Amati's in person someplace...and then negotiate for this pair on AGon? |
BTW, if you haven't already, check out the new review on The Absolute Sound (jonathan valin) regarding the Maggie 3.7. |
by coincidence, walked into the local dealer around the corner...playing unico tube amp with Quad 2905...beautiful air, space, 3-dimensionality and musicality. Not the last word in definition...but you only know this is if you have heard systems that are super resolving with the best in the world. And i know i came from the side of the fence that would take fuzzier more warm music over strident detail any day. I am fortunate to have come from that side of the fence, and been able to add some amazing detail into my system...so that is the only reason i heard the relative lack of precision in the 2905s...by most any other measure...a great speaker...and for the money, superb, unless you play super loud and/or lots of heavy bass intensive music. |
Hi Katamapah,
I have not heard Klipsch in a long time...i have heard good things about horns, but the sound is quite a different character from electrostatics. i prefer 'stats myself. The sense of enveloping you in sound is quite something. Your observations about the Zingali horn is probably about where i came out when i heard horns properly set up.
Vandersteens are very, very good and (like the Quad) good value for money...will also probably play louder and possibly lower depending on which one you consider. They do have some characteristics that are similar to Quads in the 'feel' of the music.
Zingalis i have not heard, but understand from the dealer that they consider themselves competitors with Sonus Faber, so perhaps that might tell you something. Since you have heard them, the choice is obviously yours.
You may wish to consider SFs, btw. The Homage series have much of the mellifluous character of a 2905...but are slightly more precise in some cases.
good luck and pls keep posting! |
Ah!!!! Nice day of listening today and tomorrow! Enjoy! Talk to Myles Astor (who is a reviewer and posts here)...he owns the Summits as his references and is very helpful.
My suggestions: SF GRands sound amazing with really powerful Krells...i would not say Homages Series SF sounds particularly great with big Krell...but i was stunned to hear how well the SF Grands sounded with krell. Not the only amp...just in case you have the options at the audition. Plus your tastes may well vary.
I think given your focus on esl, the Magnepan and ML auditions will be interesting. they are panels...a good thing...but they are also different. Will be very interesting to hear your views...please post!!! Enjoy. |
Hi Katamapah,
You've done your homework. Quads really are special. As you already know, they just dont play super loud and their bass could be stronger.
The new 2805s/2905s will play louder and lower from what i am told. will be interesting to hear what you think of them. |
Hi happy to share thoughts offline in more detail. i would say SF Grands can sound special but only when set up right...Krell Evo402 was the only time i heard this and was quite shocked. The Homage series are closer to the sound you seek...but more expensive.
Agree on magnepan, not quite the transparency when i've heard them, of a quad. ML with the built-in cone drivers have sometimes struggled to get the overall balance right.
BTW, check out hifitradingstation.com. i know the owner extremely well...Apogee Minigrands demo pair. last time i heard apogees, i was pretty blown away at how good they are.
I woul |
I have heard 2905 and 2805...i prefer 2905 for its fuller sound and bass...perhaps not as seamless as 2805, but very good. I actually preferred Guarneri Homage to both...in a direct several hour session. Some old hands in audio were there and supported the conclusion given my taste in music.
As for subs...buy a really, really good one...if you are buying a quad...whose incredible alacrity is one of its key attractions...make sure the sub can be adjusted as well as possible and keep up.
I have only ever used Velodyne...the DD series is good and very easy to adjust in many, many ways. I have heard JL Audios are even better. Good luck and pls keep us posted.
As for Apogees...the Apogee mini-grands stand out as one of the all-time greats in my book going back 25 years. |
the guarneri is a pretty impressive speaker and with great amps and proper setup in the room...can produce good bass. the older SF speakers like Extrema have more bass..perhaps not as refined (not heard myself)...though i have heard electa amators and a few others...all excellent and with the right electronics are really beautiful to listen to.
older SF more like a great whisky...while homage more of a cognac. |
look forward to hearing how homework goes! |
Hi K,
Sorry cannot help here, other than to say, i have heard older JBL stuff was actually quite good...then they went for night clubs, PA systems, auditoriums and the Everest was the return to high-end home. let us know what you think. good luck. |
If you are looking for Apogee Stages (which are amazing speakers in my opinion),let me know. Dealer i am very good friends with has a pair.
Good luck with SF G. All 3 generations are a little different but all good. |
Hi Katamapah,
Break-in could have been an issue. Quad amps tend to be a little soft...and i am not sure they would have driven them as well as other more high-current amps.
However, i would not be surprised if your initial impressions held...even after a proper break-in. Those who heard the 2905s when i was there said the el63 also was special...though they did say the newer model was far more linear. Hence the trade-off you mentioned.
In my own experience...i started out with Celesions SL6si...and continuing to focus on tubes and other equipment that delivered a very warm sound...but i knew it was a sacrifice of linearity, sharp upper bass punch...in order to keep that mellifluous sound.
Now that i have been fortunate to get some superior electronics that are very linear but also very musical (to my ears)...i actually find myself looking for linear products to join my system. Because the voicing is exactly where i want it...and the more mellifluous products which are also perhaps less linear (like your el63) really do not have a place in my system any longer.
You may find with different electronics (which allow the newer model to shine where it is great)...that you find a different way to msuicality. just a thought.
Despite the paragraph above...none of these electrostats will play rock super-hard. tho the newer ones will be better at it.
good luck and let us know what you decide. |
Hi Katamapah,
This is what i mean...building a great system is as much about the right blend of equipment as it is about buying good individual components.
In the case of the 2905s, they have certain strengths...played with the right equipment, those strengths will come to the fore. With the wrong equipment, the strengths may not come forward...or worse, their weaknesses may be further exposed.
Even when you have optimized your system...you may find you tend to play certain kinds of music more often than others. Some systems will play guitar quartets well, female jazz vocals...but not be able to deliver the full weight, majesty of a complex symphony...so you might end up listening to Ella Fitzgerald and Eric Clapton more than Mahler or Beethoven's 7th.
On a related but separate note, i have found many of my buddies (and I) who started out enjoying 'warm and fuzzy' have found that along the path to ever-improving audio...we tend to find that the right balance of higher and higher quality audio components (typically more linear) seems to result greater overall satisfaction. I think we all try to maintain that ear to warm...but linearity helps in detail, echo, decay, etc...which is also an important part of the musical experience.
"just a thought..." :) |
Hi...have not heard Hyperions. As for speakers, i usually evaluate 2 ways. First, using electronics similar to what i have at home (or the same if possible)...that way i can "calibrate" what i am hearing from the speaker (since i have a good idea of what the rest of the system sound like with my speakers at home). (Room itself aside of course!)
Second, i will listen to speakers with electronics that might optimize the sound to understand what it is capable of. Nothing replaces home audition, but we cannot always take everything home to listen! good luck. |
