primaluna gear, avalon eidolon speakers, cardas

Bo, before putting a product down get the story correct. If I'm not mistaken, Spectral suggests the use of MIT cabling with their electronics. Spectral electronics, MIT cabling and Avalon Acoustics speakers were used in conjunction and demonstrated at shows and dealers marketed as 2C3D (two channel three dimensional sound).

When set up properly this system could easily convey the effect of sound staging in higher end stereo audio. The upside of this demonstration, once heard, many hobbyist managed to gain a similar amount of staging from their own systems regardless of cable and speaker selection. It also showcased Avalons goals of time and phase accuracy and its affect on the overall coherence possible with their dynamic speaker systems.

As a multigenerational Avalon customer it's my experience that Cardas Cable is a far more popular cable choice among Avalon owners.

Once again what might seem superior to you Bo is simply subjectivity and may not be the goal of another user. It's most certainly not bullshit.

Chill the phuck out.

Keith Johnson and Richard Fryer have been in business for 38 years. Their list of amplification design innovations is legendary. They do not seek out product reviews or advertise full page and glossy back cover adds in the audio press. The fact is they have a monumental amount of audio experience respected by the audio and recording industries.

Spectral has a well know system approach to amplification and to what they consider neutrality is sound. Unlike your choice of generic cable theirs is a proprietary design in conjunction with a specific cable manufacture. In this case their results have been lauded by their piers, customers and even the audio press.

While I respect your conclusions they are still subjective and as such are only better to you and the customers your able to convince. I don't doubt that your hearing a difference in presentation using your choice of cabling but that difference is still subjective and a matter of your taste and has little to do with the accuracy of recording the live event which is what Spectral design is all about.

I'm a working musician. In my small in home studio I have a pair of Avalon Acoustics Monitors powered by Hypex nCore kit amplifiers. Like other recording (not post production) studios the presentation is ultra reveling and transparent. It's a playback system that I simply can't listen to for extended entertainment. Audio applications vary depending on their intended use. With that in mind the word best can take on many differences.

For those who may be interested I suggest reading the Spectral Bulletin 9501 regarding Spectral MI-500 interconnects and MH-750 Speaker Cable in detail.
at http://www.spectralaudio.com

And below.

"A System Approach
The most sacred principle of the Spectral design philosophy is our central concern with the integration of the music reproduction system. Each audio component, however exquisitely designed and crafted, is but one link in a chain. How each interacts with preceding and successive components in the chain is of the utmost significance for the final listening experience. Spectral was the first component manufacturer to collaborate with a High End cable company to achieve a totally optimized, integrated component system. Our path breaking work with MIT (Music Interface Technologies) in developing phase-compensated interconnects and speaker cables is a first in the audio field. The same overriding concern with fully integrated systems motivated Spectral to move quickly to the forefront of innovative, High End digital front-end design. And it is why our new preamplifier and amplifier designs like the DMC-30 and the DMA-150 are optimized to work together and to derive superior performance from the transducers our customers choose."

Woodworker, I'm driving my older Eidolons with a pair of Bob Carver VTA 180s.
Their actual output power is questionable but they do a very good job of driving the Eidolons. The Carvers have a 2 ohm tap (I use the 4 ohm) which is not common on tube amplifiers.

I did try driving them with a 70 watt Ultralinear MFA D70 Stereo amplifier. This combination worked well in a smaller room but seemed a bit strained in the larger room.

Refer to the Avalon speaker location instructions as a starting point. Take your time in finding the location that provides the best staging in your room. 1/4 inch movements can be dramatic so again, take your time and listen. My room is large, I don't toe them in at all.

Once you've found the best location it's important to get your Visions on the cones and off the floor. I used some double stick carpet tape cut to the size of a quarter to hold them in place. The bass definition will improve immediately once they're off the floor

I am also using a Cardas Golden Ref loom.

I was on the audio merry go round for years constantly listening to the system and not the music. Once I stepped up to the Eidolon / Cardas combination and back to tube amplification I haven't had the desire to change a thing. IMO your there, have fun.

Bol, I find it odd that the original poster was questioning the use of a pair of tube mono blocks with his speakers and your first comment was to put down MIT cables. Why?

As I said, I respect your conclusions even though, as in the past, the bulk of your experiences with products you do not market seem to be very brief, anecdotal, and/or second hand in nature. Along with home entertainment and recording you're now including live sound reinforcement which is so far out of the context of two channel home audio I have to ask. Why?

In the specific context of Spectral connectivity between their components and transducers I would defer to the designers unquestionable experience and their sonic goal which includes custom design cabling. Since neither you nor I have any extensive experience with Spectral products and since the original poster has no interest in either, I'll defer and continue to respect your choice of colorfully jacketed cable to be as you have described.

The manufacture of my speaker system uses Cardas hook up wire throughout as well as Cardas termination which makes cable selection a no brainer and a brand the original poster is currently using.

Bo, I find your assessment of Eidolons unusual. Could you describe your rooms length and width, speaker distance from front wall (the wall behind the speakers), and the amount of toe in?

Your priority of wire material over actual cable design is, well…whatever, it's an interesting opinion.

I don't see how the physics of a speakers signal arrive time at the listening position due to improper speaker placement and poorly timed room reflections (old stereo rules) can be overcome without using digital room correction.

I experimented with my Eidolons out of position and a technician using the professional version of Audyssey room correction. The room correction clearly improved the out of position performance. It was equally clear that proper speaker positioning out preformed room correction, at least in my room. Lucky me.

The Professional Audyssey calibration did have an advantage over the Pioneer Elite MCA room correction in my Home Theater room. Fortunately, a simple adjustment of the MCA calibration program brought my HT system indistinguishably close to the Audyssey calibration. This was well worth the cost of the Professional Audyssey technical assistance as was the experiment in the two channel room.

I apologize for the Eidolon toe in question. It was a childish attempt at questioning your knowledge of the basic Avalon design principle. I'm satisfied to agree to disagree with your use of room correction in the two channel application.

Other than a brief audition in an unfamiliar environment of the then impressive Spectral/MIT/Avalon 2C3D demonstration years ago I have no practical knowledge with the MIT/Avalon relationship. I'm not one to second guess Avalons use of Cardas internal wire not to use Cardas Golden Reference speaker cable and interconnect throughout my system.

Before making a cable vs sub decision be certain that your Ascendents are well out in the room, in proper reflective placement, and spiked. At this point I'd suggest auditioning a more powerful amplifier.

If your looking for low frequency there is no substitute for a well integrated subwoofer/s especially if you like what your current amplifier is offering you in the mids and highs.

I would preface that every room has different reactions to extra low frequency an individuals goals and taste are very subjective.

That said, I auditioned a Studio III and found it to be very limited by its preferred high level (speaker} connectivity. The supplied cable is so short it limits room placement which is usually critical with a sub without onboard EQ. Compared to Velodyne DD+ system integration was marginal at best.

I'd suggest partnering the 528 with DSpeaker EQ or similar.

I'm using Audyssey Pro to pick the Kentucky Derby. It likes California Chrome!

Sold my 1972 Reynolds 853 Raleigh Professional cream puff last year. I do miss the ride but now I'm down to two bikes, a Santa Cruz Heckler with XTR rapid rise shifting and my trusty Calfee (Record) Tetra. Both manufactured just minutes from home.

Reyn, yes, my Raleigh was 531 butted tubing with a longish wheelbase, very comfy. It was a great relief and a good training tool during the two aluminium road bike ass hatchets which were very short lived.

The Calfee is tube and joint carbon and incredibly lively unlike many of todays wooden feeling laid up carbon race bikes. I'm getting older and my tires seem to be getting wider.