Preference for separate phono stages?

I find it depends on the phono cartridge. In many cases a separate phono stage w. the obvious benefits will lead to some sonic advantages. In my case, this includes a purity of signal that readibly apparent. I think some from the Doshi crowd could chime in, having owned both full function preamps and them having the separates.

Raul,

I am a big believer in phono stage/ cartridge compatibility. For a simple example, the Ortofon SPU is designed to have a SUT in line. It sounds better this way. Also, your condemnation of the PC-1 earlier... could very well be reversed using a lean, solid state type phono. But the lean solid state phono would not sound best with Dynavector XV-1s or Lyra Titan I. It is all about system synergy. YOu just want everyone to believe that there are absolute bests, when in fact some items that are less than the best, may very well be the best in the correct system and perform adimarably above what you heard in your system. Now..this does not mean that in your system they might be poor, or that in someone elses system you might not like them. It is what it is. I have realized while some like sound A others like sound B. My bias are pretty simple. No hissy tizzy highs or thinness allowed. But too thick is no good either. In that regard certain speakers will throw me out of the room. And so will certain phono stage/cartridge combinations.

Now - changing subject but relevant; isn't it amazing how VdH can tune a cartridge with a few adjustments to bring it into a different league of sound. Even more so, this tells you that even cartridges don't always sound alike due to slight difference in production etc. and thus there is no absolutes.

Hence, my strong push for system synergies. Anyone saying otherwise is just trying to push an agenda.

Raul,

The VTL amps are in fact synergistic w. the Maxx IIs which have a fairly benign impedance curve. I have had big SS amps that can go to to below 1 ohm and the performance was similar w. the VTL having a more life like sense of harmonics. I also know there are different sounds that I might like better w. different music but for most listening I love my current setup w. in the constraints. Now back to topic, I truly believe a phono preamp must be looked at w. the cartridge in mind. Also having a full function phono preamp in my system to compare to my separate allowed me to understand the synergies. The differences are subtle to most people but for me are the difference between magic and just good music. I have had 6 different phono stages in my system. Some world class and I can easily state that in certain situations each one excelled. I would state that the Raven Phono is the most neutral I have owned w. its sole limitation being gain for extremely low output cartridges. But... for some cartridges which are less than neutral or a system that is less than neutral there exist wonderful synergies at lower price points. The benefit of a separate phono allows certain obvious advantages in terms of system building and upgrades. Those who can find a full function preamp that meets all their needs with the right cartridge should be happy. There is no absolute in this hobby.

In that regard, I do find some cartridges benefit from a SUT, some from SS and others from tubes. That should say a lot. Now in terms of convenience factor, tubes can be a hassle if there are too many and SUTs need to be matched to the cartridge and finally, SS phono stages are more sensetive to load matching than the tube ones I have tried. But this is my experience.