Hmmmmmmmm........Zazen.........Hmmmmmmmmm. |
Just an opinion to be added at this point. I understand that it is frustrating to have to wait for your new gear. But, everyone here must understand that part of the allure of the product you have ordered, is that it is individually hand made by the designer and owner himself. This guy is not superman. He can only do so much, and still maintain his level of product quality. You all have placed orders, and so have many others. At some point, it becomes very hard for a small outfit like this to keep up with the growth. If you want the exclusivity of a hand made product like this one, then you have to give the guy some elbow room to handle the mammoth task at hand. When I talked with David Berning about making a prototype custom amp for my system, he told me that I could get on the list and when he is ready to start my project, I could send him a 50% down payment, and it would be ready in about 3 months from then. I don't even really know when he will start my project, but I hope that I may get it by the beginning of next year. In the meantime, I am just waiting for him to call and tell me when he plans on starting the project. So, you guys are not alone in your waiting game. I feel confident that David Berning will get around to making my dream amp someday, and I am also sure that Mick will fill all of your preamp orders as soon as he can. The wait will be worth it, if the product is anywhere near as good as the people in this thread say it is. |
I really like this thread, because everyone here seems to be really enjoying themselves, and their systems. I would love to see more of this on other threads around the forum. You guys are doing what it is all about, and I feel alot more comfortable over here than on the other pages. Hope you don't mind me sharing a little of the joy that you all are experiencing. I'd really love to hear one of these Syrah preamps, but listening to you owners is the next best thing. Maybe it will be for me, in 2003. |
HaHa! Oh, I'm having a good laugh, Bwhite! I have taken so much flack over the last few months from members, about promoting vinyl over digital. It's so good to hear someone else saying it for a change.
Regarding other's comments about "quiet" tubes, they will not be as quiet as SS preamps. Especially in the phono section. But, quiet is not what we're after, is it? You can get "quiet" by turning the unit off. A reasonably low noise floor is all that is needed if the music is coming out.
I use 1950's Sylvania 6SN7's in my Berning, and they are very musical sounding to me.
Quiet, is something deadly that has been done to us by the digital/SS world. Quiet background, at the expense of musical content. I'm happy to take the little tube noise, and the vinyl ticks, to get a truer musical experience, any day. YMMV, as they say.
IMHO.
Enjoy your preamps, guys. It sounds like a wonderful value to me, and I'm glad to hear so much reporting on it. I feel like I almost know what it is like to own one. One day, maybe I will. |
As you guys probably already know, I am currently going broke trying to pay for my custom prototype Berning amp. The preamp is next on the list, once I recover financially.
But listen to this, you guys. This amp(under construction now) is a hand point-to-point wired, no circuit board, 12vdc battery-powered, Single-Ended Triode, Zero-Hysteresis OTL(ZOTL), hand-wound choke-loaded, Type 45 tube amp with Emission Labs Mesh-Plate 45's, and Sylvania NOS 6SN7's, built by David Berning himself, with all his latest experimental tweaks, and layout dictated by shortest signal path without regard to convenience or style. It is one of a kind in the world.
You wanna talk about transparency? When was the last time you heard of a Single-ended Triode OTL? With Mesh-Plate 45's? The guy at Emission Labs where I got the $425 tubes, said that it sounded to him like the "Holy Grail" of amplifiers. Just imagine a Syrah in front of that!
What I would really like to do is to talk to Mick, and get him to build me up a custom battery-powered Phono preamp with ladder-stepped volume controls, dual mono, with no line stage considerations other than the minimum necessary to acheive the preamplification of the phono signal. I don't use anything else but phono in my system. No CD, no tuner, no tape, just phono. With a straight thru design, as much as possible. That would really be cool!
That way, I could go from the cartridge to the speakers with no transformers at all in the signal path, or in the power supplies. And no AC line grunge to contend with. Just pure clean battery DC power all the way through.
Yes, Asa, the Magus is tweaked well. All re-capped and re-wired, and re-jacked. It does real well, but I know that there is room for improvement. With this new amp, and a really well-designed phono pre, this system will be as clear as a plate glass window(with the window open!). It is not too far from that now. I can hear those Mesh-Plate 45's directly driving my Lowthers now, in my imagination. Straight from the tubes to the drivers, with no output transformers, and no crossovers, just straight wire from tube to driver, in Pure no-feedback Class A. Awesome!
Excuse me while I drool, but this is TOO much fun! I am anticipating this amp, just like you guys are anticipating the arrival of your Supratek units. This has got to be at least half the fun of getting it!
I am just loving this audio thing with all my heart and soul. I can't imagine having any more fun than this. I really hope that all of you are having as much fun as I am, with your own systems. |
Walter, thank you. I don't live too far from the Asheville NC area, so that may be a possibility. I would enjoy that. I doubt your turntable needs any tweaking, but I am flattered that you would consider me for that task. I really would like to hear that Syrah with your analog front end. Perhaps one day soon, when my car is out of the repair shop, I could contact you. |
Slowhand, I have seen the Hal-o tube dampers right here on the Audiogon Classified. I think that one of the main dealers puts an ad up regularly. They also have feet and other isolation materials of the same stuff.
I think that if you play reasonably loud, the dampers are a good idea for the Syrah. The Syrah has the tubes standing up right in the open. This allows alot of airborne vibration to get to them. Vibrating tubes in a preamp is not a good thing, because any vibrational effects that happen in them is going to be re-amplified many times as the signal proceeds down the amplifiction route. The situation would be the worst in the phono section tubes, where the amplification factor may be on the order of 100,000 times before it gets to the speaker. The Hal-O tube dampers seem to be a good design, and don't melt, from what I've heard. It is also important to get non-microphonic tubes for a preamp application, for the same reasons stated above. You see, the plates in the tubes also vibrate internally, causing anomalies. When you buy your tubes, make sure that they have been checked for microphonics, and accurately represented by the seller. Andy, at Vintage Tube Services, is very good for this.
The tube dampers sometimes make the sound less "airy" because in some cases, the "airy" sound is produced by some small level microphonic effects in the tubes.
Some people also put tube dampers on the tube bakelite bases to reduce vibration there, and sometimes even use a damping treatment to the tube sockets.
If you like some of the "airy" microphonic effect, you don't have to do all of the tubes, or use only one damper per tube, depending on your particular needs. |
Nathan, it is kind of a moot point as to whether to get the preamp or the amp first, if you don't have the other also. If you wanted to use digital source, the Berning has the volume control for direct input. That could get you by, while you are waiting for your Syrah to be completed, which takes a few months. But for your phono system, you'll have to have the preamp. The Berning would be a real nice match with the Syrah, due to it's transparency and speed. You wouldn't want to let the nice signal that comes out of the Syrah to get "bogged down" in a lesser quality amp. If you do get the Berning, get speakers that stay around 8 ohms, and don't dip too low. I know from experience that the Berning starts to "harden up" at the lower impedances, and loses that liquid midrange. It is not noticeable as long as you are above 6 ohms. |
I hope that nobody here thinks that I would miss a fine wine discussion on the same thread with a fine preamp!
I have enjoyed the Penfold's and I have also found that there are several nice Shiraz made by Grant Burge in the Barossa Valley region of Australia. Even just his basic Shiraz at about $22/bottle is a very nice wine. He has a premium Shiraz at about $100/bottle called Meshach which is a real treat.
Asa, you are in a good place to be stuck! The '00 Bordeaux is quickly gaining the reputation as the wine of the Millenium. Get 'em while you can. |
Yes, Bryan, Albert runs Soundlabs, so the "woofers" weren't pumping, but he had a feedback like sound coming out. It was frustrating, but he eventually found that there was something causing the IO to vibrate and cause this problem. In his case it wasn't subsonic, and maybe the excitation in your case is at a different frequency, but it might be solved in a similar way. With the amount of gain at micro signal levels in that IO, it doesn't take much to make something happen.
As far as your woofer pumping goes, it must be a signal or resonance of some kind. I'm sure the IO must have a relatively low output impedance of around 1k Ohm or maybe less. That should be just fine with the Lamms. Did you try running it with the tonearm leads unplugged? That would isolate the problem to either the IO or the turntable. I just have this gut feeling that it's not an impedance thing when going direct from the IO.
Glad I'm not butting in. :^) |
Bryan, the Aesthetix IO is possibly the best phono stage ever made. It will be pretty hard for anything to compare favorably with that unit. And when you get to the dual power supply IO Signature model, and equip it with all NOS tubes, then it is simply unbelieveable.
BTW, the IO is available with built-in volume controls(and a remote), at a fairly large price increase, but you could run it that way, straight into your amp. However, Albert Porter has already tried that, and found that by having his Aesthetix Callisto Signature linestage in the mix, that combination sounded better than the IO straight thru. Albert also found that having Purist power cords on the IO made a nice improvement too.
All this talk about killer phono stages is making me drool. I need to upgrade my phono stage, but lack the funds right now. But soon, I'll be in a position to do something about it.
Regarding the Placette, it is very likely that there were impedance mismatch problems. This is common with resistive passive volume controls. The 41K ohm input impedance of the Lamms didn't like the high output impedance of the Placette. When this happens, everything chokes out and sounds dead. |
Bryan, Albert Porter was experiencing a similar problem with his IO. It turned out that by placing a small weighted bag of shot on the lid, the problem went away. The frequency of his problem was different than yours, so this may or may not work in your application. I'm sure you are aware that woofer pumping is subsonic, and could be generated from the turntable or even the record.
It's an interesting idea, just setting the gain on the IO to be compatible at a single volume for your listening preference. If you can feel comfortable with a single volume level for everything, then that would be the ultimate transparency as far as volume control goes. No volume control is about as clear as it gets. That would really be "pushing the envelope" regarding short signal path philosophy, wouldn't it!?
I think your system is cool, and I like to watch what you are doing with it. Hope you don't think I'm "butting in". |
Actually my comments were meant to convey that I am interested in hearing more about the Zazen phono preamp that Bwhite mentioned. Getting my motor running.
They had nothing to do with thoughts of hum or vibration. |
