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Phono Preamp Tube Rush

Is there such a thing as a tube phono stage that doesn't have tube rush? Is it just an inherent weakness of that type of pre or is it some combination of cartridge gain and preamp gain? I went from a silent solid state ASR Basis Exclusive to a Herron VTPH-2A (new home with space limitations) and now I'm using a Hagerman Trumpet with my Decca London Super Gold. Both the Herron and Hagerman have tube rush. The Hagerman beats the Herron in my setup and it really sounds incredible but in quiet passages and between songs, there's that hiss at high-medium and high volume. It's just there. No combination of new tubes, new cables, etc changes this fact. Same with the Herron. Anyone having a different experience with a tube phono preamp?
dhcod

Showing 9 responses by dhcod

dhcod OP
710 posts
 
Thanks for the helpful responses!  Thanks mulvely and daveyf especially because I think our experiences are similar. I do listen to my Harbeth M30.1s in the near field which I'm now realizing is another factor. 
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
FYI, When I had my VTPH-2a I noticed no difference in noise between the lowest noise new stock tubes and NOS telefunen 12ax7s and Mazda 12 AT7s. I had the version with the 2 12ax7s and 3 12AT7s. I loved this unit and compared it to a few others that were more expensive and it always won out. When I went with the Decca cartridge though, the Trumpet was doing all the same stuff but with some noticeably extra depth in the sound stage so I made a change. Keith Herron is the best. I still have his line stage and amps.
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
I have used super low noise new stock tubes from Kevin at Upscale. I got a 10-20% improvement in noise and a -25% penalty in sound quality from the NOS smooth plate Telefunken 12ax7s and the Brimar 13D5s that I prefer. Lots of tradeoffs in this hobby!
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
dhcod, It would take a severely defective tube to cause a 25% decrease in sound quality. 


That would completely depend on what a person enjoys in their listening and their associated equipment. Maybe I was being a bit hyperbolic but I just wasn't enjoying the sound nearly as much.
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
Interestingly, changing from my Herron VTSP-1/166 to a Lamm LL2.1 made a big difference, and not because the Lamm itself is quieter because it isn't. Could it be something with input impedance?
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
That's great news about the Gold Lions. Now that you know that you can improve the VTPH-2a with different tubes, It may be a interesting  experiment to grab a pair of smooth plate Telefunkens from ebay and see if the improvement in sound quality is worth the extra noise. It was for me. In my VTPH-2a, they just did a better job of presenting the music, more soundstage depth, more of a feeling of hands on instruments, truer vocals. Still great dynamics. But a little more noise. 
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
I think it's more about what sound you want than tubes that are worn out. Right out of the box, different tubes make the VTSP-2a sound different, even better in my opinion. Others may be just fine with the stock tube sound. It's a matter of personal taste and also how much time and money you want to invest in listening tests with other tubes.
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
I change something and if in a couple weeks i want to go to bed at night instead of listening, the change was bad.
dhcod OP
710 posts
 
Sorry to OP for my off topic trip.

No worries. Enjoying the diversion on this horrible day.
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