Hi Chuck,
My thoughts are exactly the same. FB1i is the most sensitive of all PMCs. Pass Labs website suggest Int-150 for speaker less sensatice than sensitivity 87 or below and Int-30A for 87 and above. Therefore the FB1i should be matched with the 30A for being at 90. That's why I am curious to hear people experiences with matching Pass amps with PMCs. or PMCs. Still waiting...
Drubin,
You must be a veteran in the AV world... I heard the most detail out of Krell s300i (with Bryston DAC) on OB1i and GB1i. However, the staging and the tonal texture was both false and foul. The most popping and exciting performance was FB1i with NAD M3 (with NAD M51 DAC). This combo lacked half of the detail. It made classical music sound like pop. This is especially true when I heard it with out the M3.
I am certain the PMC FB1i can bring me the symphony hall experience, but with which integrated amp?! After reading many blogs/posting/reviews, it's down to Pass Labs and Plinius. Living in Toronto, I don't get to hear Plinius. So Pass wins by default. Now the question is, will it be the Int-150 or Int-30A?! |
Hi Drubin,
You are right. I am a little out of my mind by playing this guessing-matchin game. I have yet heard The PMCs sounded exactly the way I want them to on one system. I figured since the speakers are capable of the giving me the detail from one system and the tonal texture from another, this speaker can do the job. I know the sound Pass sound, just not on the PMCs. I enjoyed the XA30.5 over the x150.5. I don't remember what speakers I was listening though. So here I am at this guessing-matching game... |
Hi Picfink,
Thank you for the tip on the meter. I never paid attention to that. I think I should pay the Pass dealer and spend more time on the amps.
I don't listen to music loud since I have very young kids in the house. That said, I hope to have all the detail and staging at a not-so-loud level. Like most people, I only crank up the music when I not getting the detail and the staging.
I just read a blog where XA60.5 was used on PMC IB2i. Quite amazing... |
Hey guys,
Thanks for talking to through this. I think I just have to "hear it" to believe it. Now I just have to find an int-30a to try. I think I can't go wrong with Electrocompaniet or Pass, especially when one of the reviews compares the int-30a to Leben. Stay tuned... I will have to report back only I final choice and share my experience. |
Hi Kz,
You are absolutely right. To my ears, the X.5 and the cooresponding XA.5 has the same power. After spending some time doing A/B comparison with XA60.5/X250.5 and XA100.5, XA really is the only way to go with Classical lovers. XA just has more appropriate soundstage, tone has more smoothness and texture, yet retains the speed and dynamic of X.5. I am officially jealous of Mark.
I heard the amps with XP20. It's very neutral. If your goal is neutral, then XP20 is what you want. To me, it sounds a little cold. But the instrument separation and details are amazing.
Hey Chuck,
Congrats! I was looking to buy that exact same unit from Mark. You beat me to it! That's makes my decision easier...
After listening to Pass again, X.5 is just too much for me. The details were too sharp with a flat soundstage. So XA it is! The shocker went to Electrocompaniet, the ECI5 MK II. Electrocompaniet's soundstage was even more vivid and 3D than Pass, but the depth of the soundstage isn't as deep as Pass. It was very interesting.. The detail was much less sharp than Pass but the tonal texture was completely smooth and round. It was a complete concert hall experience. Many people talk about neutrality and what a recording should sound like. I just want to turn my living room into a 24/7 concert hall. Some reviews also said Electrocompaniet is the closest solid states to tube. Detail vs. real lifenss... I still have more listening to do. Anyone who has listened to both, please share... |
You guys are so right. I have only heard tubes once, but I think that's the way I am leaning towards. I must admit that I am a lazy audiophile. Switching tubes and searching for them is too much. The appearance is another thing. So I think I might have to stick with solid state that are very warm. Can anyone suggest any integrated amps like that?
Electrocompaniet was almost love at first sight. Before I take one home, I want to check out other brands. Got to make sure the sound is ripe and a live while details are vivid. I heard the Audio Research integrated is quite good. Anyone has any experience? Other suggestions?
I already have a system with Classe and B&W 802D. That's already quite a warm combination. It lacked details and the soundstage is recessed. Now I am looking for something for forward and vivid. |
I went back to the Electrocompaniet dealer today with my CDs. I was there for quite a while and played through all four of their integrated amps. The clear choice was ECI5 MK II. The sound stage was huge, separation of instruments was clear and nicely placed. When I played Rubinstein playing Brahms Piano Concerto No. 1, the strings were almighty while the piano was clear and moving. Then came Mozart's two Sinfoniaconcertante for violin&viola and violin&piano. Midori's Del Gesu sounded as cut-throat as all other Del Gesu violins. Imai's Andrea Guarneri viola was warm yet penetrating. When Midori partnered with Christoph Eisenbach on the piano, I heard the chemistry between these two musicians. They meshed well. The orchestra was clearly set back in the background.
The icing on the cake was a female vocal recording. I was completely surprised. The typical solid state sound would have been a strong image standing in front of you, singing to you through a microphone. The ECI5 MK II had a very different presentation. The voice was strong but not over powering. It was absolutely exquisite. Her voice was very refined. It was if she was seducing me, not just singing to me. It also felt as if she was singing straight to me, not through a microphone. Alright, I exaggerated a little, but you get my point.
I heard the integrated with the Thiel SC2.4 and Pro Ac Response D40R. I am looking forward to hooking up the Electrocompaniet with my FB1i.
Will let everyone know in a bit... Seems to be very promising that I found I can really enjoy... |
Hi Charles,
Yes, I thoroughly enjoy the electrocompaniet... But I must also admit I miss the Pass XA. The Electrocompaniet gave me a big soundstage and puts me at the 5th roll of the concert hall. The Pass XA puts me on the conductor podium. Its soundstage is even bigger and the instruments almost feel lie they are situated around me. That intimacy is quite amazing. I just wish the tone is warmer and rounder, like the tubes... Ahhh! So I haven't completely given up on Pass yet...
Does anyone use pass XA amp with tube preamp or a very warm solid state preamp? |
Ooo... That's a tricky one! Realistic speaking, it will probably be the Electrocompaniet integrated ($5500, or $6000 with DAC) because the tone is smoother and much comfortable to the ears... Plus, to reproduce the Pass system effect I heard, it would most likely take more than the Pass integrated amp ($7150) since I heard heard it on the XP20 preamp and XA100.5 through a Berkeley Alpha DAC. That's a $30,000 worth of electronics... Musically wise and money wise, the Electrocompaniet wins...
I just got my PMC FB1i today... I hope to get the Electrocompaniet gear soon. Would love to share my experience with other Classical music lovers on here. I hope there are many more music fans out there who enjoys the musical experience of a system rather than the neutrality of the electronics... |
Hey Chuck,
How's the int-30a treating you? |
Hey Chuck,
The XP10 and XA60.5 should be plenty for you. Frankly, I am shocked the Int-30A wasn't enough for your Focals. I know that Telarc recording well. That recording has been the extreme testing for audiophiles for the last 20 years!
If you are sure to end up with 1038 in the near future, you may want to wait to upgrade your electronics. You may need XP20 and XA160.5 or even XA200.5. Start saving!
Other than the strong percussive moments, did you have other problems with the Int-30A? I don't ever listen to big stuff... The biggest pieces I listen to are Beethoven's 5th and 9th. Maybe some Brahms... They are loud, intense, but not aggressive. Do you think the Int-30A will hold up? |
Oh boy! Sounds like I really should find an int-30a to listen to. When I heard the X100.5 with XP20 (listen through a computer and Berkeley Alpha DAC), the tone was still somewhat of a solid state sound. It's definitely warmer but I wouldn't say it's close to tubes. Do you find the same with Int-30a or does it really sound like the concert hall with real instruments? Do you listen more to the vinyls? |
Hey Chuck, sorry to hear the amp went back. I think you will enjoy the analogue playing with the XA amps. The sound staging is much more 3D and the bass sounds natural and real. Please do let me know what you end up with.
Hey Kz, I am trying to work out a deal with my Electrocompaniet dealer. Not sure what I will end up yet... I am also eyeing on the Lyngdorf TDAI2200 that's up for sale on Audiogon... |
Hey guys, before you get hung up on the Pass, try Hegel. I listened to Hegel H20 amp with Resolution CD player as transport/dac/preamp. I first listened to the system with Amphion Ion+(small book shelf) then Magico V3. I was very impressed. The detail, neutrality. And the realism is top notch.
I thought I was ready to take Electrocompaniet home until I heard Hegel... Hegel is slightly warmer than the XA100.5 but more endearing. All the same detail are there. All the dynamic is there. The liveness isthere too. Hegel is just a little easier on the ears. XA100.5 still has more vivid details and sharply located imaging. Pass is a lot of money! I am almost ready to order their new integrated with build-in dac, the H300.
I think my research will stop at Hegel... Will keep you guys updated... |
