Opinions on why this system is uninvolving

if the old EAD T7000 isn't reliable and isn't available, what then?

The new C2 and C4 don't require the same kind of power...that is one of the new characteristics of the new line. As I said I heard them first on a $1000 intergrated 30w EL34s...marvelous.

cd

Assuming break in, a couple of thoughts:

1. Get some sound treatment to deal with First reflections to avoid any brightness caused by the windows.

2. Most important, IMHO:
The Revel, Hovland, and Metronome are all VERY revealing pieces of equipment. Anyone of them (less with Metro) would potentially make you feel the system was "univolved" or "thin" at times since there is no coloration and they reveal so much of what is up stream.

To shoot at cabling only is like throwing a rock into Lake Michigan and hoping to change the water level. It needs to be done but not until you deal with the synergy of the R/H/M. Something or two, needs to go. The tube amp is not enough to counter the effects of these 3 peices.

Also, the Revel's alway get such mixed reviews... I wonder. My guess is that they are just a VERY difficult speaker to match. So when you match wrong, you get the bad reviews and when you match right, you get the great reviews.

I would start with changing the speaker. No speaker, IMO, is worth the hassle of trying to find the perfect synergy. I want a system that comes together eaiser than that.

Frankly, I think the Hovland is close to the same as the Revel is in being hard to match. When you get very transparent revealing stuff like this it presents a unique issue in dealing with making the sound "live or warm".

3. The other issue is how long you lived with your last speaker. This makes it hard to accept a new sound as being complete. I won't say more but it is going to, probably, haunt you to some extent no matter what you do.

4. Did you audition this stuff at all? Individually or as a system? These are pretty popular names/models right often people buy the name without thought to the synergy aspect of putting something together. When buying at this level you should have a very clear, and very personal experience, with what the sound characteristics of each piece of equipment you are investing in. If you don't have a dealer where you can hear these things you are at a serious disavantage. Best case of all is to hear the system you want, at home or at store, to fully understand the dynamics.

5. Related to all these things, especially #4, is synergy and picking equipment that works together...regardless of name, price, or style. It is hard to do this but worth the effort. I have been forunate enough to have a good friend who owns a shop who has the magic touch when it comes to this synergy issue. This balancing everything and bringing in cables at the end to touch things up a bit here and there. Don't depend on the cables to transform the system. It will play a part, a very important part, but it is the icing on the cake so to speak.

Hope this helps, have fun.

PS If it was me, I would sell all the stuff and start over.

Zank,

So what you are saying is that you got your gear at a dealer? Even though I love AGON there is no replacement for a good dealer, yes, we pay more but we get more...A LOT more.

With this in mind, the speakers are probably not that old right? If not, I would go back to the dealer and tell him you are having problems with synergy and suspect the speaker is at the heart of the whole thing. Ask 2 things:
1. Can I try the Vandies, or whatever else you are interested in, at home? If the answer is "No" there is a problem. But from what you have said, I assume they will be cooperative. My dealer buddy has driven 3 hours to drop off equipment and has mailed out Lamm ML1s and Art Audio Mono blocks for a person to test in their system - at the same time no less. So hopefully your dealer will work with you.
2. My dealer will take your current purchase back within a year and give you the full price you paid toward an upgrade. This is not unheard of (though I am afraid it is getting much rarer). Either way, I would ask if you can trade them in on something simliar and you pay difference if they are more and he gives you a credit if you trade down.

Now, before you go that far I would:
1. Make sure your equipment is REAL broken in.
2. Get that first reflection issue taken care of.
3. Insure your speaker placement is optimal (dealer should help if you are stuck) if you are confident in him, do some research to get at this. People on AGON can help.
4. AFTER 1-3...Now this is going to sound like I am talking out both sides of my mouth but I am not. I would get your dealer to lend you cables (broken in cables) that are warmer - usually solid core but not exculsively and try out different combinations to see how much impact this has. If 1-3 moves you in the right direction, a fair amount, then this last step would probably provide the answer of changing speakers.

You can still toy with different speakers while you go through 1-4.

good luck, it sounds like fun,
charles

bwhite or anyone,

I have spent the last 20 min in frustration looking for some place online where I could check out the EAD gear (including pricing) and have come up empty...can anyone help?

Bwhite, when you talk about liking the EAD, are you aiming at the T-7000? I thought I picked up in my travel around the www that there is a MKII and MKIII version? Are these the latest, do you recommend one over the other? Ya know, basically, tell me everything ya know. :)

Also on the Audiomecca (which I have no problem finding infor on), you said OR Audio Note...Which Audio Note do you mean, the line is quite large (and can get expensive)?

I am nearing some significant changes in my system which I have been thinking about and looking into for nearly a year. I am on the verge of having pretty much all the cash flow I would want (10k - 20k) with which I am going to build a system. If I can save in the digital front end, and get better sound, YEA. I have had my mind focused on the EMC-1...I was tempted by Audiomecca (too expensive but aesthetically (sp) just what I want)...the Capitol is way to high and is ugly...IMHO.

After owning and hearing all kinds of speakers I always gravitate back to JM Lab. So I have been debating basically between the Micro and the Mini with plans to add a REL sub someday out. I have owned the Mini's before and regrettably sold them. The difference between these two is almost imperceptible so I have a hard time justifying the difference. With the new Utopia line looming both of these are a better than ever value.

I recently heard the new Dynaudio C2s and was blown away. That was the most gripping experience I have had for quite sometime (first time I heard them it was on a 1k Consonance Integrated). I lean toward the "warmth" musicality of the Utopia line but am always impressed with the detail and purity of lines like Kharma (owned the Cerm 2). Do you, bwhite, or anyone else know anything about the C2 characteristic over a longer period of time?

Bwhite, anyway, what I am getting at is to give you an brief idea of my listening bias so you can tell me if you think the EAD/Audiomecca front end would match well.
[side note: I have not decided about amps though I am drawn to the Joule Stargate because I fell in love with Lamm's use of the 6C33 tube (ML1) and hoped that the stargate might lean in that direction. I have learned to love tubes but I like bottom end too and so I vasilate between which I will miss most. The midrange warmth or the bottom end roll-off.]

Anyway, your thoughts are appreciated. I don't mean to hi-jack this thread and so I would take comments offline but maybe some of the answers might be relevant to this thread also. Either way thanks for the help.

Charles

Asa,

Thanks for the response. I have checked out the Supratek Pre and Amp. The Pre is on my list of purchases. I have thought about the Amps...my only hesitation is that

1. I haven't heard them but...I haven't heard the Stargate either so that would not keep me ultimately from buying and
2. I can get the Stargates for under 3k and the Supratek would have to be purchased full retail since they are never found used and I don't have any connections.

If I can swing it, I would prefer the Supra monos (4 6C33 each). Anyway, great feedback, thanks.

charles