Opening a can of worms

OP
Is any cable worth its exorbitant cost?

Depends on what you call ‘exorbitant’, doesn’t it?

How deep, if at all, does one wade into the pool is their own question to answer. Anytime. Everytime. On any thing.

Everything is relative. Most of my problems are relative so I stay away from my relatives as much as possible.

I have found the sonic results of wires are similar to the results one gets from calling insureance companies for quotes on car insurance.

Open the phone book, start with the A’s, and you’ll get a different price from each and every one of them. Some by a lot. Some not so much. But all are different. In fact, some won’t even insure you depending on your current carrier, and as such could loosely equate to those cables few can afford or are exorbitantly priced.

Blue Jeans & transparent? I would not say those two makers are even anything resembling extreme ends of the industries cross section based on price, or popularity. It does however, make up two wire brands…. You have a very long ways to go to make sure your hypothesis is ‘global’ rather than between one tiny segment of the industry. At least two of them are quantified and qualified now.

I recall years back, maybe ’04, ’05 a poster here said they opened the box on several wire makers cables. MIT, Transparent, Shunyata, and maybe a few more. There were posted pics which supposedly showed pretty clearly, there was nothing substantial inside the boxes. One post said they found only a stick, or peg, or rod with a wire wrapped around it.

Of these brands, MIT, Shunyata, and SR cabling and electrical renumerating power strips, do alter the sonic presentation with their proprietary technologies, IMHO.

The only cable maker in this list I’ve not had any good results with has been Transparent. I have not tried every model they make. Just a few. Certainly I’ve had EXP with many, many, other wire makers models.

I’ve posted loads of cable reviews on these pages in the past. It’s a boring, lengthy, frustrating affair, and one restricted to those who are irretrievably pedantic, and expecially true for those who wish to fully optimize their cable loom by using different makes and models for specific ends..

Blue Jeans offers a decent value but it is easily surpassed if one wishes to do some testing, it usually won’t take long to find better than BJ although it will take a fair amount more money and time.

Congrats!!!

FWIW....

I sincerely do not see any argument about run in on wires.

What I see is an argument pro or con on the notion run in will change things or not, and promoted so one or the other side of the coin has to be accepted by the opposing theorists.

There’s the real argument. Forcing someone to adopt a different perspective.

Good luck with that.

Why all the rebuttal if both propositions are offered merely as personal experience only?

If listening to a system can be improved by rubbing drawn butter on my bare feet while sitting naked in an Appalachian Rocking chair wearing a fireman’s helmet, I’d give it a try. Or not.

Probably not.

I don’t have the helmet.

Who loses? Who wins? Who cares?

It doesn’t matter.

A person convinced against their will, remains unconvinced, still.

Resistance is futile. They will seldom be assimilated.

I’ve tried $5 ICs. I’ve tried $2K ICs. Same with power cords.

I was really pulling for the $5, $100, $500 wires to be better than the $750, $1000 and $2000 wires. Really I was.

Why? Not being rich played a significant role I think.

It does take honesty. A lot of honesty. It takes notes. Honest notes. Then if the mo spensive wires is better…. A whole lot of justification and a fair time to save up to buy them.

The point is if the ‘ears’ have it, and not the heart, there is a bonafide winner. Science aside. Science was or was not working all along in the testing. It had to be. Its science. Science doesn’t take days off.

The only descrepency is no one took notes on the science portion of the process. Just the honest results of time and materials gains or losses or unnoticed changes, during the examination period.

Where then is the real proof?

IMHO? Metallurgy. Possibly ‘alchemy’.

Otherwise, please refer to the sales feedback on sold items, and or the current system lists in a member’s profile.

If the suspect was not sold, it may have trickled down into another rig. Or been traded off site. Which is my preffs budget permitting.

Proof enough for me is a $1200 wire replaced a previously adored $400 wire. Just as the $400 cable supplanted the hereto fore beloved $250 wires. Etc., etc., etc.

You can bring an audio nut perspectives, but you can’t always make them switch.

Forcing the point breeds only bad feelings and resentment. Then things get less appropriate as the less civil will go straight into the gutter with their words and inferences. Or jibe and poke adolescent inane crap. Hiding behind a faceless web, and hoping Admin won’t see it.
Directionality, fuses, wires, run in, tweaks, etc., have merit if you believe they do. If you do not, super. Good for you! in fact, good for either!!!

Real maturity reminds happiness is a greater worth than being right. This is indeed, a choice.

That said, I’m most happy when I’m right. But I’ll not sacrifice happiness so I can.

@hifiman5's avatar > An ambassador of forum peace. Ahhhhhh 😇

Blindjim > Just re-stating the obvious.
bringer of Peace? Nope.

Prophet, philosopher, queller of wars, puller offer of wool over eyes. Echo of other people’s important audio experience and cool audiophiliac sayings.
lol
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@geoffkait > “….exasperated knuckledragging angry angst ridden ruffians plotting to bring the whole juggernaut down and pervert the whole scientific process and squash the joy of discovery. Killjoys, name droppers, name callers, pill poppers, drive by shooters…”

Blindjim > keep your day job. This one ain’t paying off!
BTW how you allowed yourself to continually post such mediocre juvenile, condescending embarrassing nonsense astonishes me.

7K posts… minus all the inane jokes and senseless prattle and you’d have what? 500 or 600 worthwhile posts?

As to your baseless insinuations…
When ‘joy’ was killed I was not there and have pictures to prove it.
I ride horses, not angst’s, and am seldom angry unless forced to suffer fools, like at the DMV, or with the Cable provider..
my knuckles do not drag the floor. I wear gloves.
Science is perverted only on Wednesday nights and then only if it is holding a western saddle, a pair of jumper cables while wearing a welder’s mask and bunny slippers.
I’ll leave the name calling and pill popping to those who it appears are better at it than me. I got past all that noise sometime after 5th or 6th grade.
Until, and unless you’ve been involved in an invasion, or drive by, and coped with it favorably with near no sight, you’ve nothing to offer, and should not, unless some inner compulsion to demonstrate sheer ignorance is beond your control.

BTW… I’d see somebody about that OCD thingy, soon. Its only funny to you, and you should mention that to the Dr on your initial visit.

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@dynaquest4 > “For someone who seems to want to squash this discussion….”

Blindjim > say what? Where do you get that? Its obvious you did not read what I said, no prob. There’s ton’s of that going on around here all the time. Its why arguments ensue, persist, and unfortified assertions fly around like bees at a hive.

Every post here is as worthy as the next one, isn’t it? Its as worthy as your’s.
I offered merely perspectives. Agree. Disagree. Makes me no mind.

Infer something which is not there and we have a communication breakdown. Or perhaps a reading and comprehension issue.

Of course, another explanation could fit, if a member has an issue with another merely due to bias, presumptions, input from others who know nothing more, or at all, well, then that’s understandable. Silly. Stupid. But understandable to think one knows someone when one actually does not.

Projection gets folks into trouble as it is ‘scientifically’ irrational. Unless they are a mind reader!

Quick! What color am I thinking of?

What? Too many words? Why? Did you have to catch a bus?

If ADD is an issue, I’m sorry. But really, 3 or 4 minutes? Shheesh.

Lastly: …if you feel all that plagiaristic folderol geoffkait strucke was clever , it explains a lot. Even to a friend I’d draw a line on that much bull.

To each their own.
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@samzx12 > “…around the block…..”

Blindjim > Thanks. Very kind.

Block? yep. Several times and still rolling by some unknown Grace.

Although, I’m not trying to convince anyone to bat for the other team here. Just demonstrating a more practical side of life for those of us not employed by N.A.S.A., or M.I.T. and or are currently having their Oscilloscopes recalibrated.

I gave mine to the Salvation Army. I think. Maybe it was a kid On Halloween. Dunno.
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The jury is out anecdotally or scientifically on the wire run in biz. I mean if you add all of them up I feel it will be a draw. Inconclusive. Too close to call.

Sure that is speculation, but I sure ain’t scouring the web, to add them all up and find out.

Which means, you be the judge. We be the judge.

I feel I’ve been able to discern changes with time passing a signal in external cables, or from electricity in power cords. But that’s just me.

But people read or hear what they want to, regardless the truth or proof, same thing.

I showed how preposterous some lengths can be with the rocking chair demo mentioned earlier.

It always comes to one thing. You. me. And our ears, biases, and preffs.

Loads of other factors exist and persist no one ever mentions lately. Temperatures. Time of day for the listening sessions. Humidity which affects are hearing and speakers. Physical health. Emotional well being. The family cat sleeping on the speakerwires behind the rack. Least of all, is anything wrong or declining in our hearing?

Its our best judgement at the time. Hear it? Like it? Can afford it? Then freakin’ buy it. End of story.

Well, not for the ones who are argumentatively predisposed, bi polar, manic, OCD, or simply must oppress any notion not their own.

If Bill Nye, the Science Guy came to my house with cables, told me these were the hot ticket none better on this rock, well, I’d try them to see. Meaning I’d still be skeptical until I was satisfied they were better than what I had.

But best in the world? No. I’d still be skeptical regardless. ‘cause I’ve not tried every wire in the planet, and don’t plan on it..

Its said here a lot, take it with a grain of salt. How did that adage get kicked to the curb when it came to what wire makers say of their wares?

It holds large when folks review reviews and or reviewers articles on gear and accessories.

Suddenly, makers accounts, reviews, becomes ‘Scientific fact’ if it can even remotely be applied to some other area of audioland to support one’s view point on any subject..

It seems just another black hole for endless contention.

I’ll begin buying the purely based on science aspect for every instance of audio gear, when I find a pocket sized, talking, evaluating and measuring device that runs on batteries I can carry into a a listening room at the dealership and use to eliminate the pretenders from the contenders.

Maybe Amazon has some.

Till then I’ll do it the same way anyone else does it, by using my own eears EXP, as much honesty as I can muster, and my wallet. Although it’s a well kept secret here, I’m betting the overwhelming majority of audiophiles do it the exact same way when it gets right down to the nitty gritty. .

dynaquest4 > Please try to pre-think your responses and attempt to be succinct and concise enough that others here will actually read what you have to say. 🐑 🚶🏻🏃🏻🚶🏻🚶🏻

blindjim >

@dynaquest4 > Wait! What? are we running out of server space?

. No one told me. Sorry. Should we chip in to add more? You start, everyone else will follow your lead.

Its hard to let go of the playground or your vision of it, ain’t it?

By your own admission you chose not to read my post. So you have nothing to base your objections to apart from its duration and unremarkable suppositions?

Hmmm. How cordial. I would have used imogees were I able.

I communicate. I don’t grunt. Cheer on. Backslap. Nudge. Or leave much to conjecture whenever I post. At least I try not to. Why? It saves me and others time for explanations after the fact.

Neither do I expect anyone to read what I write. Albeit, some may. If just one person finds my input helpful, then outstanding!!! ,

I also tend to enjoy adding when possible, or appropriate some humor along the way.

In your case, it seems to fall on self imposed deafened ears and or blinded eyes.

OK. I apologize. I was unaware you were the forum spokesperson. The consciousness of mankind. That any attempt to communicate MUST adhere to what makes sense to you, and in some unknown crieterium of exceptional brevity so you can ignore something quicker.

My bad.

OMG! You don’t even know me. Know nothing at all about me I would think. Yet you demonstrate an obvious bias based on some fantastic unsubstantiated, known only to you, possible heresay, characteristics people must follow to gain your blessings?

If you can not maintain a train of thought long enough, or tolerate sufficiently a disposition apart from your own, the world you live in will forever frustrate you. that’s too bad.

I don’t roll with the ‘plus 1s’, the ‘absoutely’ or the ‘yeah, right on’ crowd. That jazz is sheer fraternal good ol’ boy back slappin’ cliquish drama. It fosters no positive outcome to a conversation, debate, contention, agreement or argument. It merely separates the fold. Culls the heard derisively.

Mostly though it signifies a closed mind, or a groundlessly and likely erroneously prejudiced one. Again,that’s too bad.

If you are unable to agree or disagree with grace, and demonstrate some maturity and open mindedness, perhaps these forums are not for your temperament.

But, again, I sincerely apologize if my benign discourse aimed solely on the topic or response to another’s post, upsets you. or any others.

Keep holding onto the idea of ‘succinct brief ambiguity and watch as this culture and others devolve as many have in the last twenty years or so. And everyone wonders why there is so much anger. Acrimony. Grief and misgivings.

Communication. Its communication or its absence. No one wants to know where anyone else is really coming from any more. We just suspect, project, or claim we know but we don’t because we’ve lost the ability to communicate and tolerate. Understand And empathize.

If you’re gonna express your thoughts. Please…. Express them as well as you are able. Always.




taras22> brilliant and much much fun....

blindjim > @taras22…. thank you.
so… you’re the one who read my post, it seems now, you are the last of a dying breed!! Lol

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Sorry, I must digress to this thread’s orig topic….

I like the idea of mixing and matching cables in the loom to fit better the component they are attached to, or to improve upon the synergy of the whole system.

Sometimes with wires, it is nothing more than a hunch or WAG as to how they get into the mix.

As for same same across the board, I’ve yet to find one brand and model of cable which has everything and does everything exceptionally well.

So it always ends up being some sort of conglomeration of various brands and models of wires and cords..

well, so far anyhow.

As for deletions or removals of post, maybe its just filters. Certain words. Phrases. Maybe too Admin is tired of some folks forgetting free speech doesn’t mean you can say anything at all and is attempting to remind people about that side of the coin.

@randy-11
Thanks.

> clique, not click
> maybe call the group CCP (for Cable Clown Posse)

blindjim > auto correct got me there. Sorry.
CCP works. However, Having to spell out posse could be an issue to if not very, very careful. Adding one more ‘C’ opens another bag of annelids.

Gee. That’s gotta qualify as succinct.
I’ll make a footnote of it in my novel’s first volume. I’m trying to be good, but its so difficult dealing with so much ADD and mindless free floating disjointed spam.

To review:
Mix up the wires! It’s better!