Mapman was absolutely right saying,
"If you want Class D to sound good to you bad enough, maybe try building your system around a Class D amp of choice."
I have the same class D amps, the H2O for 7 years. My system now is clear through every frequency point. That was not so over the first 4 years. It was great in the 2 years between then and now, with now being spectacular.
I continued making changes in my system around my class D amps as Mapman suggests. |
I agree with others, I can't hear any second order harmonics distortion on my system. I do know what that term means. I have heard all tube systems where their coloration is quite noticeable. Spectron is just tooting it's own horn IMO. |
Dob and Athmasphere, your amps sound clean. So do the others. I have used a number of AB amps, and though the builder of such amps will say they have canceled out all distortion, they don't hold a candle to the clarity my ICE amps have.
I found this interesting quote muttered by John Atkinson:
"It's not that they (class D) measure badly, it's because I have to be extremely careful to ensure that I don't end up measuring my test equipment's limitations."
Oh, now that is quite a telling confession. |
This from a person who has borrowed my source duo. He has the same amps and preamp as I.
"I have been listening all morning and YES!!! It is incredible. It is unreal how good the Flatfish and the Audio note sounds. It has the right amount of ambience, air, staging. Bass is beyond description. Very tuneful and meaty with right amount of pitch definition. Vocal is NIRVANA to listen to. Nothing is exaggerated. No wonder you have been screaming how good your system sounds, unfortunately mostly to unbelievers. Oh well, Too bad they missed out big time. Top end is so exxxxxquisite...." |
Dan92075, class D amps need patience to bring out their best. Or, you can copy my recipe. ;-)
I have found what you say is the opposite of truth. That is, A/AB amps, with zero global feedback, distort the transients, not the best class D amps. The well tuned ICE amps will have no audible distortion, and will dig deeper into the CD than ever thought possible. |
Ok, Dan92075, what CD players did you try? On my system all oversamplers failed miserably, especially in their highs. I use a 47 Lab Flatfish transport and a much improved Audio Note DAC. I cannot stress how important that is.
All speaker cables that are not nearly bare will flood the signal with noise. All power cords must be fully insulated against EMI. Saying that, only my speaker cables made the ultimate difference for me. They are ultra thin metal ribbons. I use Speltz ICs because what he says on his site is right on.
None but one solid state preamp will do their best with class D. The rest will diminish the music. Tube preamps do much better. It is a mismatch thing. There is one solid state preamp made especially to match class D, and that is the H2O Fire preamp. That is what I use. It will kick ass the sound into a music that shows flow and big impact.
I can go into great detail, but not here. Drop me an email if you are still interested.
See my friend's comments above. |
Audiofeil, you know how low ICE impedance runs. Solid state preamps have great trouble with this. It is not just my opinion that most solid state preamps deteriorate the sound. That is why people use DAC volume, and others line level preamps. Tube preamps are fine. |
One true statement weaves it's way through these comments. Class D amps only sound as good as you make them sound. |
Audiofeil, I look at my gear and see there is not one item that can be bought in a brick store. Everything is direct ordered, or I made myself. Everything got better when I stopped listening to advice from audio medial. That includes you. |
Might you suggest a preamp that can do better than I have? Perhaps I can get a dealer near here to bring one over for a listen.
I was asked for details of my system. On hindsight I should have directed the query to private messaging. |
"(audiofeil) offers no nonsense, sound advice."
Unsound, Audiofeil barges in every time I post. He does this to denigrated what he DOES NOT sell. That is nonsense. Sound advice cannot be made about something one knows nothing about. |
Atmasphere, I have walked away from that part of my discussion. The move to the preamp I am using was made years ago when the audio picture was different. I am just happy with the way things turned out. |
Audiofeil, the truth of the matter is, you can't make any worthwhile recommendation on my system unheard. Perchance you hear my system I suggest you would not have the temerity to challenge any component comprising my system. |
"I can assure you from speaking to customers with systems far more sophisticated than yours"
This one I missed.... There in lies the proof of Audiofeil's agenda. What makes him think he knows any systems more sophisticated than mine, or Mapman, or any of the others here? What is meant by singling his customers out? It is because they spent a lot more money than I. He has to justify their purchases. Money don't buy love and money doesn't insure you of getting the best.
Atmasphere, your amps are lovely, and I am sure they sound wonderful. I have had the pleasure of hearing a six figure tube system a number of times, and the sound is quite lovely. |
