Audiofeil, was your decision to drop NewForce based on its sound? Could you characterize it? |
Are you referring to Spectron Musician 3 SE V.2? What's the technology underlying the Linn Climax Solos? |
Now I am admittedly speechless. . . if NewForce has made short shrift of both Rotel and the mighty Bose. . . I shall withdraw in quiet awe of the Force of this staggering New giant! |
I just love the caginess of all these pseudo findings like "competes favorably with amps 4 times its price." And of course, our most audiophillically morbid curiosity having been duly peaked. . . we will be kept hence and forever in the dark. Who are the megagalactic heavies that have been thussly behumbled? What does the ever-so-generic "competes favorably" even mean? And then there is peap show part 2, where a yet unnamed and strangely unmentionable former 'belle'--"one of the most regarded American made solid state amplifiers on the market [. . . costing] $21,000.00"--is almost coquettishly hidden from full public view by a gauzy veil of hints and tantalizing innuendos about her most electrical of aging prowess.
May I suggest that comparative findings should either be made openly, honestly and forthrightly. . . or mercifully not even hinted at all?
Seems to me this is almost like the old drole commercial for CountryCrotch margarine which 'research proves' is invariably so much preferable to the ever unmentionable 'leading brand'. . . of course costing 'up to' 4 times as much.
Just give me a break! |
Thank you for the info Ggil!!!
AudioOracle, given my prior quotation and the following you wrote:
"The Nuforce Version 2 amplifiers are a true breakthrough, compared with amplifiers which are four times the price the Nuforce in most respects sounds better,
these amplifiers really are very special. I have to agree with JB8312, I would compare the Nuforce with many of the 20k and above amplifiers, in fact I
am actively searching to find an amplifier which really does outperform these little marvels."
I am not sure if your claims of holding 'certain loyalties" have much merit. Declining to reveal the identity of 'leading brand X', does not hide the undeniable fact that you seem to favor NewForce over your other more expensive brands. Nothing wrong with that in my view, except for the self-delusional coyness.
yet, I am positive that there are aspects in brand x that may be desirable over NewForce. If would be helpful to both us and to your manufacturers if you could enlighten us over the relative strengths of New Force and the yet unnamed leading brand X amp. |
Right on, controversy is a terrible thing. . . and that's exactly why it was rightfully barred for 70 years in the USSR, 25 years in Italy, 7 years in Greece, 11 years in Germany, 59 years in China. . . disperse now good people and cease disturbing the peace. . . or else! |
Hi Rumadian, have you had occasion of comparing the latest NewForce and H2O Signature 150 or any other class D/T amp? What are your impressions? Do you see any 'giant killer's in any of the new technology amps? |
Stltrains, my amps are 2 20 years old JRDG 7M golden giants, and I am starting to get an education in view of upgrading, hence my presence on this and other related threads. I am intrigued by potential of class D/T. Yet I am a seeker, never a 'believer'. For me NewForce is yet another device worth examining. . . critically, that is. . . like everything else I listen to, including the gear I own and love, and any amp that I may have fallen in love but do not own. If audiophiles love Newforce, I wish to find out why, when and how. What amps have they compared it to? What were the differences? Pros and cons? Makes sense? |
Rumadian thank you, your post is very helpful. Stltrains, please tell us more about the relative strengths of the New Force amps you own. What other devices have you compared them to? In what music do they excell, and why? |
OK guys/girls, I can understand Audiooracle's shiness. No prob. If someone can tell me the URL of his business, I'll scout out the $21K poor old dame and will post her most probable identity here. |
Very impressive Audiooracle. You forgot to mention the identity of your current business. . . If you were wondering about the origin of my morbid curiosity, I am still itching to find out the name of the $21K SS sacred cow which NewForced creamed with such aplomb. Or does thy moniker connote that classically minded propensity towards eternal obscurity, indirection, and even misdirection, like in the pronouncements of Delphi, sybilla, and all other true oracles of old?
Viclondon, I was not aware that the thread was open to true believers only. . . is there something I am missing? |
Stltrains, I have not heard the NewForce amp as yet. I was attracted to it and to this thread because of its promise of a low cost, musical and crisp sounding solution. Still am, in spite of having found on this thread a small minority of 'true believers', which remind me of the strictures of the regimes mentioned above. Autocratic regimes are not at all only about mass murders, violence, political repression, invasion of other countries, etc. . . They are also about the slow smuthering of open discourse in the fine arts, and the choking of differing aesthetics and philosophical schools of thought around the fine arts--musical or otherwise, by those who have aspoused the Truth. Please do look up the life and times of Zdanov, the ideolog of social realism in the arts. Please do rest assured that I will still post to this thread and others like it, and I will eventually have the opportunity to listen to the NewForce and evaluate it critically and with a completely open mind, in spite of any minor stridencies encountered in these pages. |
9RW, quoting once more the sage of Appenzell:
"one often has problems with experimental seekers of the small and sadly subjective truth (note small 't'), when one has already been so fortunate to grok a-priori The ultimate absolute and ever objective True Truth(note Cap 'T').
The only residual problems experienced by all lucky holders of the Grand True Truth to end all Megagalactic True Truths is. . . . that they do not seem ever to agree on what the darn thing may be!"
[Aloysius Q. Schmaltzenstein Gavronsky] |
I do not rightfully know, Stltrains, all the reasons behind the acrid posts. Perhaps dyspepsia? . . . in fact, I was just wondering myself why some folks were getting their musical shorts up in a bunch. |
Dyspepsia is an other word for upset stomach, a perfect 'family values friendly' condition. My musical happiness is tempered by current hot weather. . . my Rowland 7M golden oldies do become rather warm during Summer in my loft. So I won't use them much until Summer's end. . . hence my interest in class D/T amplification. |
Arbuckle, which NewForce amp iteration have you compared with which Pass device? |
Interesting reviews Stltrains. Do you happen to know the damping factor for the Ref 9 V2 SE? I could not find it on the NuForce product page, although damping factor for the previous model 8 is indicated at 4K. |
Audiooracle, what's the name of your High End company? I'll be delighted to look up the $21K failed sacred cow by myself, if justifiably you feel shy about revealing the name of the poor old dame. |
having visited Audiooracle's web site -- audiodoctor.com -- I now have reasons to summize that the $21K solid state amp that David (Audiooracle) has been cross-listening with NuForce may be an Edge Electronics model. Since then, I have exchanged a courtesy call with David, which has cleared a lot of ground on this issue. David is the first one to state that, rather than NuForce being an absolute best -- under certain configurations and for certain users -- like when being directly driven by a AA Prestige CD/SACD player, the NuForce may be found by some to be competitive in some ways with the Edge. While Edge yields indisputably superior silkiness and musicality and subtle warmth, NuForce may be found to yield a perhaps more open sound, three dimensionality extension and detail, at perhaps some expense of ultimate smoothness and 'musicality'. David further conceeds that different users will have differing opinions. Sounds fair to me. I further discovered that in 2004 and 2005 David was my patient, kind and knowledgeable host at Sound By Singer, and was the one who unwittingly caused me to fall in love with--and eventually 'wed'--Esoteric X-01, while he was singing the praise of the admittedly highly seductive sound of the Bel Canto PL-1A. . . and how is that for an ultimate paranymph 'malgrais lui'? |
Apologies JB, your use of 'it' is ambiguous. Did the NuForce sound thin, or did the Krell instead? |
JB, let me understand: there are two configurations:
1. A Krell integrated used on its own.
2. The same Krell integrated used as a linestage in conjunction with a NuForce and a yet unspecified IC between the two.
Observations: there exists a 2nd hand report, according to which One of the two configurations above may have sounded thinner than the other, but we do not really know which one. Given the ambiguity of the findings, and the necessity of there existing an additional unknown IC to add to the variables, I am not sure if this finding is bringing us any new knowledge quite yet. Could you clarify with your friend? |
Or is perhaps the problem a religious one? One of 'believers' vs 'unbelievers'? In which case the issue is in danger of becoming aprioristic, and as such a specious argument by definition? Whereas a different and technologically agnostic way to look at the entire matter may be to start from a set of personal sonic requirements or practical constraints, and empirically determine which particular device or devices match such sonic requirements and constraints. This last approach may avoid the frequent pitfall of broad generalizations, which tend to be flawed either way. |
Does anyone know if Nuforce amps will be shown in any suites at RMAF in Denver next month? |
My apologies Tda2200 and all for my spectron/Nuforce confusion, I should remember not to post on any matters of substance unless I have had enough sleep. Glad you enjoy the Linn Klimax Solos. Unfortunately I find Linn sometimes to be a little exhuberant in the treble region for my particular preference. . . . Perhaps I don't understand true Hi Fi. |
