New Mojo Mystique X


Who has ordered the new Mystique X being released later this year? I was going to buy a used Mystique V3 but they are just impossible to find. Ben had a possible trade in unit for me but the owner decided not to go ahead.

The new models carry quite a price and to take advantage of the introductory discount it seems they have to be bought unheard, just going on previous models’ reputations. Could those who are buying the new model please share their reasons why.
lemonhaze

Showing 13 responses by fuzzbutt17

Benjamin from Mojo Audio here to clear up any misconceptions. The Mystique X is not replacing the EVO. The EVO is still a current product and fully supported.

There are no plans to stop supporting the EVO and there will be a new EVO for 2022. The Mystique X is a new lower cost model which has better performance than our EVO Basic and very close performance to our current EVO Pro.

Now you know why we’ve been offering a 20% discount on our EVOs...we knew we were going to be releasing the lower priced X.

The X stands for "extruded chassis." Switching to a 9" wide x 4" tall x 16" deep extruded aluminum chassis with custom face and rear plates is one of the many cost saving compromises we made.

Because the X is so close in performance to our current EVO models, in 2022 our EVO is being totally redesigned and upgraded. The 2022 EVO will start at about $15K and go up to about $20K. The new X will start at only $7,777. This is where the "all the magic...half the price" stuff comes from.

Among the upgrades to the 2022 EVO will be things like dual mono power supplies, custom Lundahl amorphous core power transformers, and the PCM63 DAC chip. Since the new X is quite a tough act to follow, the new EVO won’t be available until mid year 2022.

But back to more info on our new X...

The circuit and most of the component parts in the X are identical to the EVO. There are a few almost inaudible compromises in the digital power supplies and 9 vs 16 Belleson regulators total. There are also some improvements made to all the power supplies which will offset the compromises.

For those of you who are purists like me, there are improvements to the S/PDIF inputs. The X will also have a USB input cut off switch that will remove all clocking from inside the chassis to improve S/PDIF performance even more.

Among the other cost saving compromises we made was going to all PC board mounted connectors...pretty much what most manufacturers do. There are almost no wires inside the X chassis. The compromise is that we are no longer able to suspend all the circuit boards on anti-resonant mounts. But the chassis itself has some new anti-resonant treatments. So overall switching to PC board mounted connectors is a net gain in performance.

In 2022 we are also evolving our manufacture from 100% hand built to robotically assembled. This is going to both lower our cost of manufacture and significantly increase our productivity. So for the first time in over 12 years in business Mojo Audio will be selling through an international network of retail distributors.

The Mystique X is the first of our manufactured vs hand built products which will sell through retailers.

Hopefully in a few days we’ll have engineering drawings of the new X chassis and full descriptions on our website.
I also want to clear up some comments I’ve read by people like Devertiti.

Mojo Audio DACs are engineered for natural, neutral, and harmonically coherent sound.

This will not appeal to everyone.

To over simplify, I divide high end audio customers in to two categories: the audiophile and the music lover.

Audiophiles will talk about things like bass extension and weight, high end extension and penetration, image, depth, and layering.

None of those things have anything to do with music. Those are what I call "special effects" and "attractive distortion."

Music lovers talk about things like time, tune, harmonic coherency, and the ways instruments and voices intermingle.

Time and tune: that’s music on the written page. The most basic components of all music.

Harmonic coherency is the mathematical alignment of all frequencies. When a note is struck it has harmonics at twice the frequency and half the amplitude going up to infinity. Alignment of the bass, mid, and high frequency harmonics is essential for music to have an organic character.

I’ve been told by customers "no matter how loud I play my Mojo Audio DAC it never sounds loud." This is because all the harmonics align perfectly.

This is also what gives Audiophiles the illusion (or rather delusion) that our DACs have less resolution than some of these other more impressively "voiced" DACs. When harmonics don’t align it gives a false sense of separation, layering, and resolution. Sort of like a black outline around animation. It makes things "pop" at the expense of no longer sounding natural and organic.

Those of you who actually listen to live acoustic music all know that the separation of instruments and pin point imaging that many audiophiles are looking for simply does not exist in the real world. It is a trick of the recording studio.

Let me finish by staying there is no right or wrong here. Everyone is entitled to have the sound they prefer.

If you’re looking for that "larger than life" sound that many audiophiles desire, then there are several DACs on the market with FPGAs, Delta-Sigma DAC chips, and impressively voiced output stages to choose from.

If you’re looking for a natural and neutral sound with correct time, tune, and harmonic coherency, I suggest you audition one of my DACs with our 45-day no-risk audition.
A bit more about the EVO...

Our current EVOs use the same circuit boards as our original EVO sold from 2019-2021. The chassis is new but the guts are identical.

It was only because of delivery issues with our former chassis manufacturer that we made this product change.

Hopefully we’ll have actual photos of the new chassis on our website in the next week. We’ve been so busy getting out EVO back orders we’ve not had a spare DAC to photograph.

We will have some trickle-down technology from our new top-of-the-line DAC in 2022 that can upgrade any 2019-2021 EVOs.

Boards with our new S/PDIF upgrades, power supply upgrades, and the PCM63 DAC chip, will be available for your EVO mid to late 2022.

During the upgrade we’ll completely remove and replace your current boards with these new boards.

If USB is your high-performance digital input, there would be no benefit from the new digital input board. The only advantage would be if your reference digital source is a high-end CD transport.

The new analog board will include the PCM63 DAC chip and power supply upgrades. This will be an excellent upgrade to any 2019-2021 EVO.

These upgrades will be an excellent high-value upgrade option for customers who are not trading in their EVO toward one of our new top-of-the-line 2022 DACs.
Photos of our new 100% machined chassis are now up on our website:

https://www.mojo-audio.com/mystique-evo-pro-21-d-a-converter/

Our next gen EVO63 will use a similar chassis.

Later today I’ll post a spread sheet to address any questions some of you may have as to the differences between the Mystique X and the X SE.
I understand how it can be a bit confusing.

I want to thank you Branisalv for pointing out that there was some confusion as to the differences between the X and X SE models.

I was considering a spread sheet to clear things up but opted for highlighting the bullet pointed features list already at the bottom of the X SE product page.

I added "UPGRADED:" in front of each item which was upgraded compared to the entry-level X model.

Another thing to note is there are upgrade options on the X model. Each of those come standard on the X SE model as well as a few things you can only get with the X SE model.

For future reference Branislav, if you want know the differences between different models, go to the bullet point features list at the bottom of each product page.

Easy peasy.

For those who falsely stated that our DACs have a high noise floor, I suggest you don’t embarrass yourself any further.

Between the discrete AC input filtering, LC choke-input power supplies, massive 4-pole main capacitors, and 16X Belleson SPX ultralow-noise ultrahigh-dynamic discrete regulators, our noise floor and the speed of our power supplies are among the lowest and fastest in the industry. Well below -127dB and 0 to full current output in less than 10uS.

For those of you who don’t know what -127dB means, you would have to play your music at a volume 127dB above the noise floor in your room to hear it. And that would be a volume which would cause permanent hearing loss.

Similarly, the comments about "slow...syrupy...smoothed over details" and the like are exactly the opposite. Our DACs are so much faster and more detailed than most they allow the harmonic structure to perfectly align and the voices and instruments to blend and interact.

I could see how all of those never before heard harmonics and spacial cues could appear to be noise or slow and syrupy sound on a system which is not capable of reproducing them. And how a person would need a larger than life sounding DAC to bring a bit of life to a lifeless system.

Interesting how all the people who criticized the Mojo Audio sound listen to electronic rather than acoustic music. I’ve never read any comments on how violins or piano or horns sound off in some way. Only electronic music.

My guess is those guys don’t realize how many "voicing" decisions they made when they set up their system and that they were compensating for the harsher, harder, more digititus sound from former larger than life sounding DACs.

Think about it: if a system is voiced to sound tonally balanced with a DAC that has a larger than life sound, then wouldn’t it sound relatively slow or syrupy if you replaced that DAC with one that sounded natural and neutral?

And for those of you who don’t want to learn something and Google things like "amorphous core chokes" or "Silicon Carbide Shottky diodes" or the dozens of other highly specific technical terms I use in the descriptions of our products, I have an easy solution. Simply assume that if I made a point to mention it, that it is notably better and more expensive than what most of our competitors are using.

Of course I could always do what most of our competitors do and sell cheap parts that are not worth mentioning in a fancy chassis and then put total BS in my marketing rhetoric to confuse and sway the uneducated consumer :^P

But I’ve always found the educated consumer is my best customer.

Thanks for the more in-depth description of harmonics RockRider.

Our DACs don’t align or change or filter or correct ANYTHING...that’s the whole point. All they do is decode what is on the recording and attempt to preserve and amplify that musical signal.

Our philosophy is "error prevention vs error correction" and that is achieved with incredibly fast and incredibly low noise power supplies, proper shielding, and proper anti-resonance.

The LC choke input power supplies we use are the only (yes, ONLY) type of power supply which both puts current and voltage in perfect phase and stores both current and voltage.

Any other (yes, ANY other) type of power supply is an attempt to be smaller, cheaper, and/or more energy efficient, with as close performance as possible to the LC choke input power supply.

Capacitive input power supplies that are used in most gear on the market put current 90 degrees out of phase behind voltage and only store voltage. It doesn’t make a difference how much capacitance you have or if you’re using so-called "Super Caps." The physics remains the same.

Because capacitive power supplies only store voltage this makes the energy of the music always in a state of "becoming" rather than being instantaneous as with an LC choke input power supply.

This translates to the more current a passage of music requires the more off time and tune it becomes relative to the other passages. So when a note requiring a lot of current is struck the fundamental of the note is most out of phase and time, and then as less energy is required to reproduce each harmonic, the subsequent harmonics are more and more in phase and time.

Does that make sense?

This phase and time distortion from capacitive power supplies compounds as more and more are used in the recording and playback chain. So the tube amp I use in my reference system also has LC choke input power supplies.

The really funny thing is when I play people some of my favorite well recorded 1940’s and 1950’s recordings, which were done in studios using LC choke input power supplies. Then I compare them to modern recordings of the same instruments. You can see their eyes bulge and their jaws drop when they actually hear the energy and harmonics of the instruments aligning near perfectly for the first time.

As I always say: the educated customer is my best customer.

@Branislav

That’s why I took your advice and added "SE Upgrade:" in bold letters in front of each feature that was improved over the entry-level X in the X SE.

 

And that’s why I added the "Optional:" in bold letters in front of features in the X and X SE which are optional.

 

Good suggestion for us to make it easier for people to see those differences at a glance Branislav. I plan on continuing with that format on future product pages.

 

As for your B4B vs X question, that’s a good one. .

 

I did clearly state in the product description even the entry-level X sounds better than the EVO Basic and that the that the X doesn’t sound quite as good as the EVO Pro.

 

But the B4B is one of those more complex "depends on" situations that I wasn’t sure how to express on our website.

 

The big "depends" is which Lundhal chokes are in the analog power supplies.

 

Of course the second factor is the S/PDIF upgrade, which doesn’t help the over 80% of our customers who only use the USB input, or those who purchase the entry-level X without the S/PDIF upgrade.

 

And a third factor has to do with which verion of the EVO B4B we were comparing to since there were originally different inputs, outputs, wiring, and shielding options.

 

The EVO B4B has the same Lundahl ferrous core chokes as the entry-level X, but the EVO B4B has all choke input power supplies for the three digital supplies as well as the two analog supplies. So the EVO B4B would sound better unless you were using the upgraded S/PDIF inputs, which are optional on the X version and standard on the X SE version, and then the entry-level X would sound better.

 

If you get the Amorphous core choke upgrade in your X or have an X SE and use the USB input it would also sound better than the EVO B4B and cost about $1K-$2K less. But the X realy isn’t upgradeable like the EVO B4B, and the EVO B4B has a much nicer chassis, so those are considerations that offset the value the X’s sonic performance.

 

The X SE comes with amorphous core chokes in the analog supplies, so it would sound better than an EVO B4B, unless you got the amorphous core choke upgrade option on the EVO B4B. Then we’re back to the are you using S/PDIF or USB input scenario.

 

Now let’s really mix things up: from 2019 to 2020 we made several different versions of the EVO B4B with different output stages, input stages, wiring, and shielding. I would say even the entry-level X would sound better than some of those EVO B4Bs because they didn’t have the same class A output stage. But if the EVO B4B had the class A output stage upgrade option then you’re back to what I wrote above.

 

See what I’m up against Branislav?

 

How would you suggest I explain such a complex set of scenarios on my website?

 

Sort of seems more like the kind of thing a person might ask on a forum and hope to get a response from people who owned the products or from the company.

 

But I am open to any suggestions any of you might have about how to explain complex scenarios like that on our website.

@Branislav

 

I can't agree with you more.

 

That's why there are so few options for our new X series.

 

And that is why in 2021 we included the most popular options in our EVO and we cut the options literally in half.

 

At the same time, because we think differently here at Mojo Audio, we're not going to put out a line of a half a dozen DACs like our competitors, most of which are an attempt to meet a price point and feature package based on what the marketing department tells you will sell.

 

If you want a line of DACs inspired by a focus group and marketing projections there are lots of other companies to choose from.

 

On the other hand, if you want a higher performance DAC with fewer features. One which is engineered for optimal sound quality as opposed to marketability. And if you want to  buy from a company  who spends more on the parts inside than on the chassis and packaging outside. And spends more on R&D than on advertising. Then you may have to learn a few technical terms you never heard of before, and you may have to ask a few questions you never had to ask before.

 

At Mojo Audio our customers expect more from us, and in turn, we expect more from our customers.

@Metaldetektor

 

We are in the process identifying and contacting retail distributors.

 

Between now and the first of the year we are literally tripling our production capacity.

 

Even then, there is no way, at least not in 2022, that we will be able to meet the demand for our Mystique X if we had several dozen distributors. Let alone resellers like Crutchfield who have contacted us.

 

So we have to be very picky with who our first distributors are and we have to be very careful not to bite off more than we can chew so to speak.

 

We're going to start with the big cities, like NY, LA, Miami, Huston, Philly, DC, and Chicago, and branch out from there. We already have distributors lined up for Europe, Australia, and some parts of Asia.

 

So if any of you have a recommendations on high-end retailers in your area, please email me :^)

@Divertiti

 

I agree with you about "audiophiles" vs "music lovers" is a gross over simplification. Most of us are going through a perpetual evolution as we learn and experience more.

 

At the same time, there are types of music and types of systems which are not capable of discerning the subtlety and nuance our DACs are able to deliver.

 

And the people who listen to those types of music and who own those types of systems would likely not be our best customers.

 

What you are calling "homogenized" is what I am calling "harmonically coherent." The more naturally the harmonic structure of the music is, the more the sounds blend. That's what the musicians are trying to do when they play together.

 

Much of what you are preferring (and you certainly have the right to prefer it) is actually off time and off tune which give a more separated, layered, and distinct effect.

 

My guess is you have multi-way speakers and sub woofers, right?

 

Well even though you get excellent extension and smoother/flatter frequency response you have sacrificed phase and time coherency. Simply the nature of cross overs and the comb effect and cancellation and reinforcement of multiple drivers.

 

It doesn't make a difference if we talk about an expensive Wilson, Magico, or Focal. This is the nature of cross overs and the nature of multiple drivers. You can't get around the physics. They do some things better and others worse.

 

Personally I can only listen to full frequency transducers. Single driver speakers...electrostatic speakers...planer-magnetic headphones. I'm willing to give up extension and penetration for time, tune, and coherency.

 

And personally I don't expect recorded music to sound like live music. How can it? First you have the inertia of the microphone diaphragm...then all the mediocre pro audio cables...then all the mixing and mastering stuff such as dynamic compression.

 

Did you know that your average good recording is compressed down to less than 40dB dynamic range?!?!?!? Most pop music is compressed down to 20dB dynamic range because it is engineered to sound best on Bluetooth headphones and car stereos. The best of recordings are 70dB dynamic range at most..very few of those around. All quite far from the 120dB dynamic range of live music.

 

When people try to compensate for the compression and other things lacking in their recordings with what I call "attractive distortions" there is always a price to pay. You gain in one area and lose in another.

 

This is why my personal philosophy is to do none of this in our DACs. Because once you've lost time, tune, or harmonic coherency, there is no way to regain them farther down the signal path.

 

You can always find some way to add "excitement" farther down the signal path.

 

Think about it.

We finally received the chassis which had been holding up production of our new Mystique X DAC. Currently those parts are being powder coated awaiting laser etching.

Now that we have everything in-house we are expecting to begin shipping back orders the middle of May and begin shipping new orders, dealer demos, and reviewer demos the end of May or beginning of June.

Photos of the prototype Mystique X we took to AXPONA and updated information are now on our website.

Even though the Mystique X uses the identical circuit and nearly identical parts to our Mystique EVO, due to the new chassis typology, shielding, and anti-resonance, the Mystique X has a notably lower noise floor than any DAC we've ever offered.

As you lower noise floor you not only reveal low-level details which were formerly masked by noise, you expand dynamic range. The Mystique X has insane micro-dynamics.

The bad news is that the cost of our component parts and chassis have gone up significantly in the past year. 

On June 1st Mojo Audio will officially be selling through retail distributors, all sale prices will end (we can't undercut our distributors), and prices will be going up by +$3,000 on the Mystique X and +$4,000 on the Mystique X SE.

In May we expect to have inventory of DACs on the shelf for the first time since 2017. The bad news is that once our retail distributors get their demos we're expecting to have to return to a waiting list once more.

As for additional DAC models, we have a few in prototyping which are more advanced than the Mystique X, but we won't be releasing any new models of DACs until we are certain we can keep up with demand for our new Mystique X.

No point in having waiting lists for multiple products with component part delays.

Benjamin from Mojo Audio.

I wanted to clear up  a few things and update everyone as to the status of our DACs.

Originally we had planned to continue with our EVO series and to introduce our X series as a lower cost alternative with similar performance. The X had the potential for robotic assembly allowing us meet several times the demand for our DACs.

About that same time COVID hit and everything changed.

Of course we didn't know just how much COVID would change things or how long COVID would affect our business. Fact is that electronic parts availability is still significantly effected by COVID and everyone in related industries (appliance, automotive, home entertainment, etc) are still having problems sourcing certain parts. :

Back in 2021 several of the electronics parts we needed for our DACs were either in short supply or unavailable. So back in 2021 we purchased all the inventory we could find from several electronics wholesalers around the world. Back in 2021 they were predicting there would be no new inventory of these parts until the end of 2022. As of today many of these parts are still unavailable and now they are predicting to have new inventory late 2023. I'll believe it when I see it. 

So we could only find quantities in the dozens for many of these parts used in our EVO series. In order to continue production of our EVO we would have had to redesign circuit boards and chassis so that we could use a substitute part. This is not only time consuming and expensive, there is no guarantee that those substitute parts would continue to be available. 

At the same time in 2021 there was a serious shortage of aluminum as well as many of the machine shops we used to make our chassis were busy making chassis for medical tech due to COVID. We had to wait several months to get a chassis order that normally took only 4-6 weeks. Though no where near as bad, there are still shortages of aluminum and still significant production delays by machine shops. 

That is why we couldn't continue manufacturing our EVO series: we could only get dozens of certain parts, there were serious delays getting aluminum and getting chassis machined, and to adapt to substitute parts would require a total redesign of circuit boards and chassis.

So we manufactured the few dozen EVOs we had the parts for and discontinued production. We still support the EVO and you can still have us upgrade an EVO Basic to a B4B or Pro or a B4B to a Pro. So the EVO is still upgradable, just not beyond the last version of the EVO Pro.

We had plans to offer different digital input and different DAC chip upgrades for the EVO but since these required replacing the entire digital or digital-to-analog boards there were only a few customers who were interested in spending thousands of $$$ to yield such a subtle improvement in performance.

Combine that with our new X series having a notably lower noise floor and greater dynamic range than our EVO series and most customers who heard an X SE next to their EVO sold their EVO and upgraded to the X SE rather than considering paying a similar amount to upgrade their EVO.

At the same time we found that the prices went up significantly and availability went down significantly on the PCM-63 DAC chips we were planning on using. So the PCM-63 is no longer an option. We have a small inventory of PCM-63s that we're planning on using for a limited edition top-of-the-line DAC some time in the future, but no plans for a new DAC model or EVO upgrade that using the PCM-63. 

Now it brings us to our new X series...

When we engineered the X we utilized electronic parts which were more retally available. And aside from the chassis extrusion (which we purchase from Japan) the face and rear plates for the X series require less than 20% the amount of aluminum and less than 20% the machining time as our EVO. So all things being equal, we have the potential to manufacture roughly 5X the number of X series chassis as EVO chassis. And we've found the X series chassis sounds better and is significantly lower cost to manufacture. 

Higher performance, lower cost, greater availability, not to mention much smaller and lighter weight...we are already planning on using the same X series chassis for future DACs. 

But with electronic parts shortages there is no way we could convert over to robotic manufacture...we simply can't get the parts we need in quantities that make robotic assembly worth doing. So for the unforeseeable future the Mystique X will continue to be hand assembled. I seriously doubt anything will change until the end of 2023 and more likely not until 2024 based on what I'm hearing.

Now for the good news...new DACs for 2023 :^)

Considering over 80% of our customers only use computer audio servers and streamers as their digital source we are planning on a USB only single-input version of our X series. Because it won't require an input selection board, an S/PDIF receiver circuit, or a demultiplexing circuit, we can lower the cost of our Mystique X USB by about 25% over our current X series. We are predicting the X USB will start at about $6,000 and the X SE USB will sell for about $7,500.

We're hoping to have our new X series USB available by the summer of 2023.

We are also working on a new entry-level DAC we hope to be able to sell for around $3,000. It would be USB input only and single-ended output only but this would be ideal for over 80% of our customers. 

We're hoping to have our new entry-level DAC available by the fall of 2023. 

I hope this clears up many of the misconceptions in regards to our EVO series, current production of our new X series, and our plans for the immediate future.