neutrality vs. realism

Phew...I thought they were the same thing!
OK, inasmuch as "perfect measurements" don't sufficiently exist to guarantee full "neutrality" (or realism, by my acceptance), then good science doesn't necessarily provide sufficient realism. Granted. But since when does neutrality not equal realism? By striking a difference between the words we continue to muddy up these psychoacoustic waters.
Amps do things that aren't yet measurable that make them more "musical", which is assumed to be approaching purer neutrality to the upstream source. Otherwise a preferred "musicality" that's NOT neutral is simply a euphonic distortion (tube's 2nd order, for example), or coloration (HF droop, e.g.). Let's not confuse photography with painting.
Those who say that spectral neutrality is a prerequisite for a "musical" presentation also miss the boat, in that one can have the latter without flat frequency response, for example. Can we not just say that what we like may not be the objective "truth" electronically all the time, and be done with it?
Sure it seems that the very best systems are as neutral as possible, by definition, but there are as-yet unmeasurable criteria that are ALSO optimized that then lead such systems to be described as musical, as well, to out ear/brains. I need more coffee....Ern

Paul, great post!
Muralman, whereas I fundamentally agree with your premise, but even in a live situation (actually, quite often for me, in some of the cheaper seats!), the INaccuracy of the first-arrival/secondary arrivals mix DOES get in the way of that mind/music (or better: ear/brain) catalyzation.
Just recently I heard the glorious Andre Previn conductiong the BSO and Thobodeau in the Ravel Left Hand Concerto, and the orchestra sounded SPLENDID from 6th row center. After the overture the 9' Steinway's way OFF-axis sound was anemic, lacking body and normal spectral protrayal! As a pianist it took me quite a few minutes to get past this, and I was reminded again that one doesn't listen to pianos too close at Symphony Hall!..................
Likewise a week before I heard my friend Marty Pearlman leading his marvelous Boston Baroque in his orchestration of a Monteverdi opera in my favorite Jordan Hall. But instead of my usual center balcony perfect seat (!), I had to sit front left orchestra, which provided more detail of the period strings, especially (orchestra was on the left, soloists on the right), but too many times the acoustic ping-ponging of a vocalist as he/she turned while holding a note, resulting in a sidewall reflection overwhelming a first arrival, threw me off the "total music appreciation" cart. Such a bouncing acoustic image would NEVER be tolerated in the recording of the piece (which should be available next spring. So unless one sits in line with the mics, for example, live music in even the best halls can be a dicey affair to us who are trained BOTH by such AND our audiophilia. Live sound is perfect? By no means, unless you're sitting in the right place (seat)in the right place (hall) in the right place (frame of mind/receptivity)!
Yet there's of course something still so magical about a live performance well done despite acoustic impurities, thank god!

61, isn't that a compromise between recording the performance somewhat "as heard" by the audience, but as well with a higher s/n ratio than would be possible if the mics were lower? Also, in MANY halls the first balcony yields a better natural "mix" than the orchestra.
Also the mics CANNOT deal with the Haas Effect (re primary vs secondary arrivals. Even in a small room (mine) I had to get my Earthworks omnis right on my Steinway's strings in order to remove the room sufficiently to actually BETTER the sound than what is heard from my playing position. Sure, the piano is too wide, but spectrally and dynamically its HYPER-real! (There's one for ya, Asa.)

I've occasionally had esteemed, graying jazz musicians play live alongside my Steinway, between my Parsifal Encores.
Mostly standup, acoustic guitar, voice, and violin.
I'm impressed by the fact that I can REPRODUCE my piano by careful mic placement such that its bottom end sounds BETTER than live! Ha! There's no mystery, here, afterall, as the left Earthworks mic sits so close to the soundboard and lower strings that I can "make" my beloved "B" sound bigger and better through my Encores than the set of wavefronts that hit me when I'm playing the thing. It's all about wave propagation and summation at the listening (playing) position. Sure the top octaves are more complex live, with that truly wonderful "B magic octave", etc.
So the more-neutral (huh?) reproduced position sounds BETTER (thanks to purely-objective, science-proven stuff about physics, mic placement, Earthworks' transient response, a fully-Class A amp chain, etc.) than my oh-so-"REAL" 800 lb, 7' friggin acoustic transducer IN THE ROOM!
So the above discussion's "it's so nice that them poles should meet" near-waltz resolution and male-bonding now has to address THIS redefining of the turf! Would ya?...could ya? (And PLEASE keep Jung, Mazwell (my collegiate days fave) and Kant (especially, you engineers!) outta this.
And Asa's only allowed 20% of the thread-inches (sorry, I love ya too, buddy, but my eyes grow tired at these early AMs).....
So I'm a pig cryin' in shit: I'll be able to make recordings of MYSELF IN MY ROOM that sound as good as the near-best commercial ones (except for room ambience, of course), so I can't complain...'ceprt I can't figure out how to use this Alesis Masterlink....
A grateful and happy Thanksgiving to all!

Onhwy, I bought a used GRACE 2ch Lunatec mic pre for $800, rather than two glitzy 101s. Glad I did: the small Lunatec velco's under the piano out of sight, its detented knobs are finger-friendly in the dark, and its TOTALLY silent.
Get one used NOW as it's been replaced by the Lunatec V3 with a DAC in it for $300 more. The Alesis has a fine DAC, so it'd be redundant. Readers should note that I made 40 foot cheap-but-great Canare XLRs from mic thru pre thru Masterlink to Aleph P! $0.44/ft! A pro favorite, and now I know why. Yet when it came time to connect the Masterlink to the beloved Aleph P pre, my left/right brain balancing act between Asa's subjectivity (Nordost?) and pro engineers' (TWO of 'em watching me intently, laughing all the way) objectivity (more Canare) resulted in a crisis of audiophilia nervosa...so I made the Canares AND bought a 1/2m Blue Heaven XLR (at least I didn't get SPM, eh?).
My new/old piano teacher insists that I perfect getting my lower back energy projecting into my Brahms' chords, instead of sweating the wire. Man '0 man is she right? No wonder we marry these other-chromosomed types, eh? Cheers.

Where'd everybody go?