Musicians?

Hi Nnyc - I am a professional musician, I play the French horn in a major symphony orchestra. My system is posted here. I have always found that horn speakers driven by tube amplification result in the most life-like recreation of live music, particularly for large scale orchestral and operatic works, but also for piano or chamber music or pretty much any type or size of ensemble. I do not claim that the system I have right now is the best that one can have, but it is what I have started with. Many of my fellow musicians who have heard horns driven by tubes agree, even those who had previously heard electrostats, which are the only other speaker type that I have ever heard come close. However, I am definitely in the very high efficiency/low powered amplification camp rather than the other way around, for various reasons. Your set up sounds like it would be great for near-field listening, especially for something like classical guitar. I personally would add a turntable to it, and get yourself alot of guitar LP's - there are many great ones out there. I think you would find that analog playback will resolve the timbre of the guitar (or any instrument, for that matter) much better than the digital set up. But if you want to stick to digital, the set-up you have looks pretty good to me - you certainly have some good equipment there.

Eric - have you ever heard a horn system do percussion - stunning realism - percussion on my Klipsch Cornwall's sound better than on any other speaker I have yet heard, except for even bigger horns. At least a couple of percussionists I know would agree.

Nnyc, as for your latest question, in my experience the digital recording of large ensembles where there are many more microphones (even sometimes one on every instrument, believe it or not) are usually terrible sounding. I would agree with Rballdude that this is normally the fault of the recording itself, not the system playing it back. As I have said here before, if I had a dollar for every audiophile who has heard a bad recording job but thinks that something must be wrong with his system.....

IMO the best, as far as most realistic sounding, orchestral recordings were made back in the 50's and 60's when they just stuck a couple of mikes out in the hall (or perhaps far above the orchestra as Mercury was fond of), and there was as little mixing as possible. Part of the reason for this is because then you get a much better sense of the original recording space, and it's ambient noise, and of how the music filled it. More mikes are not usually better, they usually greatly diminish this sense of space, which is very important to the realism.

Frogman, I agree just about 100% with everything you have said. I too, tire of the myths surrounding musicians, audio and otherwise. Thanks very much for your fantastic post. As far as the speakers go, I know several musicians who like electrostats as well - for me, the horn speakers have all the advantages you speak of, plus have the advantage of a much bigger "sweet spot" - they are much less finicky in placement, as well. They can also be driven with just about any type of amp, as they are not nearly as power-hungry as the stats. But I do agree that the stats are the only other speaker type that comes close to approximating what live music sounds like. Looks like you have a couple of great set-ups, there. Enjoy, and thanks for the great post!

Hi Frogman - yes, there are many out there do not use live music as a reference. I think there are many reasons - some audiophiles become so obsessed with their equipment that they haven't even been to a live concert of any kind for years, and have truly forgotten what live music sounds like. I am constantly amazed at those who place the equipment above the music in their priorities. Or those who won't listen to a recording if they don't think it was recorded well, or is not on the right label. Others simply don't want their music to sound live. I have seen that comment many times here. Then there are those who say they don't want any "colorations," usually the same people who are after "complete neutrality" in a component. Yes, I do understand what they think they mean, but to me, and I would guess the vast majority of working musicians, this is a truly ridiculous concept (as if anyone really wants to listen to colorless and neutral music??!), and in my experience, these folks have systems that don't sound anything like live music - they want every recording they own to sound exactly the same, and very sterile sounding, though they usually call it "analytic."

On the other hand, I bet Tvad is right when he claims his system sounds better than many concerts he hears in arenas and stadiums, assuming it is electronic and/or amplified music he is speaking of, which the vast majority of it would be if he listens mainly to rock and jazz. Especially in the rock world, the music is so grossly amplified at pretty much all live venues nowadays. So many people have grown used to this electronic sound that they think that that is what all music sounds like, and they develop very unrealistic expectations of bass in particular (Subwoofers are among the most misused pieces of equipment, in my opinion. Not that they can't sound good, but to my ears I have yet to hear a system including them that sounded like real, live, acoustic music). Even concerts in a great hall can be ruined by over-amplification, as my orchestra's pops concerts often are. Far too many people think that louder is always better, as you must know well, playing in Broadway pits.

So there are a whole host of different reasons, of which I have just scratched the surface, and it can indeed be frustrating. I try to either ignore it or laugh about it, but it's hard sometimes. As Tvad said, one size does not fit all, and there are many different perspectives in this hobby. Sometimes the most important one to us musicians gets completely lost in the process. I guess that's true of alot of different hobbies. I used to homebrew with a friend who got obsessed with the equipment instead of the taste of the beer. Eventually we compromised - we used his equipment to make my recipes, and got some very good results that way. But I've gone on more than long enough, so I'll shut up now. Enjoy the music!

Another great post, Frogman! Agree completely with your comments which, as you say, apply no matter what type of venue the music was recorded in. Whether or not a system can give this sense of sound traveling from/in a real space is very important. The best recordings/systems will give you a sense of the original acoustic, including the ambient noise, and how the sound travels in and fills it.