MSB Reference or Audio Research Reference 10 ?

Beside a Linn CD12 and the YBA I use a rare earlier (still the discrete R2R ladder network) MSB PowerDac Gold 4. (doesn’t have true balanced outputs, that I never use anyway)
It’s is a huge heavy brute as you can imagine it has 5 x gel-cell rechargeable batteries inside, doesn’t have the glitzy readouts or machined chassis ect, it’s more a KISS approach from MSB, but with super power supply being pure battery.
It’s said to be like a no frills version of the Platinum but with battery to be even cleaner in power supply department.

Cheers George

Hey George can I ask  which MSB do you own?

ARC usually use Delta Sigma based dacs, where MSB are discrete R2R ladder dacs. To me they have their own sounds.

On great recordings my MSB discrete R2R can't be touched, but on bad recordings it shows them up as so.
My YBA dac is Delta Sigma, on great recordings it's not as good as the MSB, but on bad recordings it's a bit more listenable than the MSB.

I listen more to the MSB, if I have a dinner party where all the old stuff is played in the background I use the YBA.

Cheers George 

That’s what I was getting at. I bought the MSB because of the passive pre. Having owned a bent passive I love the sound of passive pre amps. I agree that the MSB Reference is maybe the way to go but looking for people who use this equipment with big JBL horn systems. The ARC combo synergy is very impressive to listen too, however MSB is the best digital source I’ve heard to date.

garbage in <-> garbage out.........

your post is a bit obscure as far as exactly what question you are asking. as best as i can determine, you are wondering if a dedicated preamp upgrade to the Ref 10, keeping the older Platinum V MSB dac as your source, will be preferable to replacing the Platinum V with the MSB Reference dac with it's really fine built in passive preamp? will the jump in dacs give you more than the change in preamps?

as a MSB Select II owner who uses my $45k darTZeel preamp, but......who has compared it directly to the passive pre in the Select, i'd be immediately switching to the MSB Reference dac.

like i said, garbage in <-> garbage out. the source rules. and the MSB Reference is a big step up over the previous generation Platinum V......to my ears. and that passive pre is outstanding. you still have your ARC amps for some bloom. personally i'd probably prefer the MSB passive pre--ARC amp combo over one with the Ref 10.....but that's me.

OTOH the ARC Ref 10 is a wonderful preamp. if that big bloomy sound is what floats your boat then there you go.