kimber, ps audio, mit,cardias, murrow, shunyta, pangea, and 50 others are just selling snake oil power cables????please! get a grip. and they show up at industry conventions and keep straight faces while they scam an entire industry?? please!!! |
the question of why does the last 3 feet matter when there are miles of the other stuff out there has not been answered yet |
last night i put a ps audio powerpunch [40 dollars] ac cord on my decco/mmg bedroom system. straight to the wall/ no power conditioner. if there is anyone here that says i didn,t hear immediate improvement in 3d, openness, musicality i will ship them the stock cord because i am going to throw it away with the garbage. |
i would like to know if it is the wire, the configuration/design or amount of wire, or the better plugs. maybe it is a combination of everything. |
don,t we discuss this once a month? haha i think,,,can,t prove,,, that when i swapped my moderately priced ac cords out of my cd player, pre and amp and replaced with the stock cords that the bass sq went south of he--. i have also done this with the ac cords one at a time with similar results. i gave them a day and it never got better. when i put the moderately priced ac cords back in and listened after playing for a few hours tight defined musical bass returned almost immediatly but got much better over the next day.. can,t prove it but i heard it.. so i have decided that all my cords, cables and wires are going to be the best i want to spend on and leave it at that for now. i also don,t do a/bs because i think i can hear and know what my system and good systems are capable of. i could be wrong. |
some very well made arguments here. i once went 100 mph in a vega automobile and later went 100 in a porsche. psychologiclly the vega ride scared the hell out of me and the porsche seemed like i was going 42mph. maybe my analogy isn,t perfect but better stuff seems to just work better. ha |
er,,,??? why does the bass sound quality improve with better ac cords? placebo effect? ha lol! i.ll stick with my better ac cords but i am a victim of hype and advertising. wow |
last week i took my morrow sp3s out and put my kimber 8tcs in. for the next 2-3 hours it was pretty rough to say the least. i let the system play all night and the next day it was nice and smooth and musical. so for those keeping score,,,ha!!! the murrows sound great too btw.
1. i am certain i can hear a difference between cables
2. i have experienced sound getting better when they "settle in".
3. i too have experienced placeabo effect and other psychoacoustic phemonena
4. my stereo sounds better when i am in a good relaxed mood.
5. my stereo sounds better at 3am.
this may turn into one of those long threads. peace |
in the late 70s i was a rep for some very high end companies and the company i worked for was the first monster cable reps in the midwest. sorry. ha. after using different speaker wires, cables , ac cords for 30 plus years i am simply amazed that there are audiophiles who think that this is a placebo effect. just shaking my here realizing i wasted all that money when i could have used lamp cord ...... |
i totally agree. but the bass gets better with upgraded ac cords! |
what were you going to record on? and would you listen to the recordings with or without better ac cords. and what cords would you record over? this sort of throws everything into more questions. i am sorry i didn,t say that a/bs can,t be done. i meant to say it has problems and has been dismissed by many. i would never buy anything at a store that uses a/bs as a tool for decision making. maybe you are on to something and maybe reel to reel would offer better recording data. i worked for nakamichi and sony microphones for several years and recording has to be done right as i am sure you know. thanks for continuing the discussion. very interesting. and i didn,t mean to lump all recording engineers into one pot. but the ones that keep compressing the music for louder horrible sound should stop. |
i know because i can hear. i understand music.i have been a industry professional since 1975 with many systems. i listen for a week or so and don,t just switch back and forth. i don,t have a team of roadies to make the switches and run a/b tests. i don,t plan on installing a soniclly transparent curtain in my living room. that is how i know. has anyone here done all this? come on,,if it sounds better trust your ears. if it doesn,t just go buy some ht theatre stuff, drink up and listen in the dark and give up. why buy sophisticated gear if you can't hear a difference? |
you don,t get it do you? i can hear. you must let the power cord have some energy thru it for a while for it to settle in. this makes a/bs virtually impossible. if you can't hear a difference then that is your problem. a/bs have been discredited anyway because the initial brighter sound may be more impressive at the beginning but after a while may not be what an improvement at all. this is why people that know what good sound is do not do a/bs. they listen for a few days and understand and comprehend what they are sensing. yes,,sensing. as in hearing. try it.as for liking a cable because it is attractive and expensive you need to try some various products out there. some of the best sounding are not jewlery for your system. |
doesn,t matter if the lights are on or not. there are always some distractions like glowing meters, ugly leds, computer screen, traffic outside, kid plotting a sneak attack from behind. i hope you will accept my apology for my strident response earlier. i think you could hear a difference in better matched cables. you surely have good taste and accumen with the nice system you have. the a/b issue is loaded with difficulties because i do not think it is possible to absolutely control the variables. and the subjective comparison process is suspect. please answer this. why do audio enthusiasts doubt a cable making an improvement but many have little idea what their crossover is built with, or how their speakers internal wiring is designed? there are many other analogous questions in electronics construction. almost every audio product has some cost/performance compromises built in. an example of this is a stock pair of magnepans and a modified pair. even the owner of the company has said a metal frame would make them sound better but is not feasable due to cost, shipping etc. so just try some ac cords and turn the lights down for a double win. thanks and i enjoy your entries. jbc |
pcoombs, great idea. i don,t know why kimber or another cable company with resources has not done this. maybe they are concentrating on their cables and theory and experimentation. maybe they are letting us have our own fun out here. only fanactics really care about this. the rest of the world doesn,t care as they are looking for skins or cases for their ipod/iphone. |
i was talking about trying to do a/bs in the typical hobbiests listening room. it is not easily done. ever hear about coloration caused by other speakers in the room? look at the set up required by the people that have attempted it in the past..none have been conclusive either. use your great imagination and you might be able to figure something out given your incredible brain power. and I havn,t seen any recording engineers chiming in on ac cords on their living room gear here lately. wiggle on that. the hard part is not in drawing conclusions. any idiot can do that as your post exhibits. the scientist knows that controlling the experiment is the part that is crucial. google "scientific process" if you want to inform yourself.then accurately measure the results with bias removed. a/bs have been discredited. this is a fact. where have you been. as for recording this on a tape deck which one would you use? is it 1978 and you are gonna use a pioneer ctf500? ha. even the best nakamichi or tandberg can,t make a tape good enough to settle this w/o argument. ever heard about bias/eq issues? or head alignment? what tape would you use? when was the last time you cleaned/demagnitized the deck? do you know what you are even doing? we are talking about cables performance and now we are going to measure it on antique technology? no wonder few get it. yeah i,m gonna listen and evaluate ac cords on a tape decks recordings to listen for nuances and inner musical detail. thats laughable. if you can,t hear the difference listening no a/bs or reading or gurus are going to help you. stick with stock cords they are wonderful and you don,t need anything better it is a waste of money and snake oil. ha, right... |
yeah you are mistaken. typical person that throws some stuff but can,t take any. ha a/b that |
if you can't hear a difference how would listening to a recording help? that is all i am asking. ps audio has some readouts of tests for the more scientificlly inclined. but you can't trust them because they are selling wire. ha |
