Tvad I just bought that First Sound Pre-amp on AG Probally will go with the Vac amp as well. Ill let you know how it sounds, oh you already know dont you. |
Thanks for responding. Im useing a Belles 21a tube pre to a belles 150a HR. Mid priced sony cd player, but mainly want to use them for vynle with my Nottingham spacedeck tt. It sounds Ok but Im looking for liquid, image float with more dynamics. Im prepaired to invest more at this time to achieve that, but wanted to get with you guys, and gails first to get some input. They are new and should be broken in about now. Had them about 5 months. |
Yes I mentioned that they were new and should be about broken in now as Ive had them for about 5 months. Dont get me wrong, I love these babies. But Im not getting the liquid image float I want. I beleive it to be the electronics which is why the ?. what is everyone else useing to get that.Its a pretty large room. Maybe 25x35 or so and I have moved the speakers around forward backwards, in out, you know. Im thinking of going with a tube amp on top and the Belles hot rod or Bel Canto on the bottom. It sounds like the tube amp you have is able to drive the entire speaker. Am I right? |
I was wondering why you changed from the big Bryston, to the tube amp. Because I was considering a Bryston for driveing the bottom half> |
TVAD Im very interested in going in that direction to with hopefully findig a vt100 as a back up. Is it possable you could send me a way to get in touch with VAC an First Sound ? Im down here in Florida and am pretty much comming up empty on were to go, and the web sights havent really helped . Finding some of this stuff is crazy sometimes, let alone trying to listen to it first. |
Sounds like some good advice, and I appreciate it. I know its there with these speakers and Im even haveing fun with them trying to find it. If you dont mind what pre-amps have you been useing with yours? Im already starting to think that I dont have mine far enough off the back wall. Anyway, happy listening. |
Thanks for the info Tvad, and also all the help and time. Ill get back with you when I think Ive got all of this figured out. |
Its hard when you feel like your so close, butyet not just there. your right there is so much to like about this speaker. The main reason that I emphasized Bi-amping is because Albert states it in his owners manual, that if your a metal head, and I can be at times, then you will need to bi-amp these speakers. To get theyre maxium potinual. Please dont grade on spelling. I have been bi-wireing from the amp, and also jumping them from the top down, I just feel like the sound thins out to much that way, and Im afraid I may clip the amp. But after listening to the person who bi-amped tube on top and ss on bottom then got way to much bass,now Im in another quandry, because that is exactly what I was thinking of doing. The ARC VT100 sounds like a choice as well as the JC1 halo . Some of the others that were mentioned as well. What do you think about the RM200 driveing the whole speaker bi-wired? That liquid image float sound is important to me, I still want dynamic foot stomping music though. Techs and specs mean something, but I want engageing, envolving, and musical above all. Yes I know ,its like ice cream. Everybody likes a differant flavor. Im hopeing some of you can help me find mine. I truely appreciate all the help so far. The VR4SEIII are here to stay for me, Im just getting a little nervous again trying to find that sonic nervana, before I lay down more dard to earn green in the wrong direction. |
WoW, I want to thank all of you for your expeirenced suggestions.They were all thought out in a very careing way. Driver also had some very helpful info in his see here spot. TVAD, I did not know that the VAC amps were used for his demos. That in itselph has me leaning in that direction. Do you happen to know what pre-amp hes useing durring that time? LOUIS, I almost bought the ARC VT100MKII a while back because of all the great things Id heard about it. I had differant equipment then and decided to change speakers to the VR4SHEIII. Thats where Im at now an will keep my eyes open for another VT100. I here Brown makes a good amp too, thinking about that one also. The tube pre with the JC1 is at the top of the list If I do go the VAC direction, now your talking in the area of Classe CAM350, VTL MB450, and I doubt that my BELLES21A tube Pre is worthy of the VAC amp. I can do it at this time but want to watch out for deminishing returns you know. Heres a question for all of you that now or have owned th VR4 s Staying within my realist budget of about 10.000.00 for amp an pre-amp, If you had it to do over again bassed on your experiences with this equipment what would you get to run this VR4 system? Remember I now have the Belles 150 hot rod amp an the belles tube pre- amp. should I sell that stuff for better or add to it? |
Tvad, Im still trying to find out the price of a VAC PHI 110/110. Any ideas I found there web sight but guess I have to wait for the to contact me back. Thanks Again |
PHI 110/110, still decideing because in that price range your talking VTL MB450, Classe CAM350 Big Bryston. See what I mean? Any recommendations? |
LouIs1,
Its nice to know Im not the only one going through this. The ARc MK1-MKII sounds good, but heres what Ive done latley. I purchased two Bel-Canto EVO200.2,s that were entended to go into my seperate home theatre system for My AVM20. I thought I would go ahead and try them with the VR4,s first in my music room, because thats where my ultimate goal is. First I hooked up ONe Bel-CANTO in bi-wire, sounded ok but nothing special. Uhm, ok so next I bridged them, very powerfull that way up to 8oo watts short term. Sounded good but still NO magic, Uhm, then bi-amped them one for top one for bottom that way they seemed totally out of balance. Finally, last attempt with these amps. I vertically bi-amped them. Bingo, 3-demintional I finially started to realise that these speakers could really live up to all the hype. Best Ive ever heard them to date. I knew I was at least on to something. However once I took them up really loud, more than my nomal listening level I noticed that the tops took over and was loseing bass on the bottoms, so I cant live with this eather so those amps, which due sound great by the way are going to go to the home theatre room after all. But If I wasnt getting magic from these speakers with 800 wt mono blocks bi-wired and before I go out and by the big VAC amp that Im thinking Of it still seems like bi-amping is the way to go. But I think you said you got way to much bass that way. I wonder if anyone has tried to do this but with useing an outboard crossover to balance the tube top and SS bottom. Im getting alot of suggestions to use the power of the JC-1 or the big tube VAC, BUT.... if two 800wt mono blocks didnt get right Im just not understanding how one bi-wired stereo amp is going to be able to do it. Can you or anyone reading this maybe clear this up for me? |
Drhst20, thanks for the input. I checked out your system by the way, very empressive. You are one of many that suggest the JC1, must be a great amp, if your famialer with my threads, what Im searching for is liquid so thick you could cut it with a knife. Image float correct soundstage all while maintaining detail through all the frequencies, not much I know but I know its out there. I want goosebumps. Is the Jc1 going to do that? I know your very happy with your system, and since all this is a little like ice cream, every body likes a differant flavor. So what Im asking is your system giveing you that thick rich 3 deminsional sound that Im talking about? Yes I do want the amp to take over and drive the speaker, and get that kind of bass control that you have. Take over might not be the right words, but it will or will not make your speakers disappear into the kind of soundstage that your looking for. Would you still recommend the Jc1 for liquid goose bumps over power? |
I was wondering has anyone found that useing Von-Schwiekerts ribbon foil wire hooked up to these speakers to make a significant differance one way or the other? As opposed to any other good Hi-end wire? |
Drhst20, It sounds like youve heard exactley what Im talking about.Im not real sure alot of the fine people who have been trying very generousley to help me have. This is not a veiled muted, or in any way phoney sound,and I know first hand that you do not have to have all tube to get it. Ill explain later. This is dynamic foot stomping live you are there bliss. Image float. You can here the guitar string plucked, and then it will expand depending on the amount of sustain the musician is useing. The soundstage is in front rather than pulling you on stage with them. Yet you are enveloped into almost a bubble of the entire event, and yes delicate when needed also.Point is the bass will come up off the floor and kick you in the chest, and the music seems to push itself right out of the speakers that arnt there anymore and right through your soul.Some notes feel as if you could actualy reach up and pull them out of the air. Like liquid music, and no Im not on drugs right now> If I tell you what I experienced this on your all going to want to hang me! I had this bliss for two weeks on my then system, and was never able to get it back. Thats why Im here now.I have to close now but Ill kiss anyone who can figure out how to help me get it back at anywhere near what that system Im talking about retailed for. Less than 4000.00 Anybody want a kiss. Im looking at 5 times that in front of me right now so you have a headstart, getting closer, but still not there yet. Thats my mission in life now.HA-HA, its really not funny though because its driveing me crazy. |
