Low end TT vs. Hi end CD

Dennis, you have to visualize the 1200 not in stock form--but on *steroids*. Then and only then will you get the most out of it. I have not finished the full modification process on mine. How far will it really go? I have no idea. Will it outperform a WADIA? I recently found out someone who's got one lives some ten miles from me. Maybe when I'm finished...

Kevin Barrett(KAB Electroacoustics) sent me a Beta release of his modded Stanton Trackmaster II for evaluation prior to final marketing. Believe me, I have had no need to switch back to my Ortofon X5 moving coil. The 1200 on steroids has to be seen as a whole. The Stanton is an integral part of this, I'd say. Superb. Also, Kevin told me over the phone that he's coming (finally) with an outboard power supply this spring. YES!

Now, there's two issues that I'd like to address:

First, the subject of the phono stage. I believe phono stage is more important than turntable. I learned this from Dejan V. Veselinovic of Yugoslavia (www.zero-distortion.com). The above mentioned references are from turntable equipment manufacturers--and biased, of course. With all due humility, I think my 1200 (once all the mods are finished) could be rigged to an entry level Klyne phono stage and it would not be wanting.

Second, one needs to know what to listen for in a turntable. I believe a lot of the belt drive cult following arises from a *personal* preference for huge, deep soundstage. Moving coils will give it to you and as a general rule your average DD will be just too noisy for this. The tradeoff is in speed and rotational stability (Wow & Flutter, en inglés). You WILL lose a lot of musical details. Unless one is using a belt drive with immense speed and rotational stability (like a VPI w/ flywheel) you will pay the price. Kevin Barrett has taught me this and I'm very grateful to him. When I switched from the Ortofon X5 MC to the modded Stanton Trackmaster II ( a moving magnet design) I noticed that the soundstage collapsed somewhat. Once the Trackmaster II broke in I started listening to an unbelievably detailed and live sounding midrange. This cartridge allowed me to hear a lot of microdynamic information as notes and voices were sustained, as in salsa horns and vocals. With higher wow and flutter this would be impossible to discern.

I use a Monolithic Phono stage plus excellent line conditioning and the results have been nothing short of outstanding. See if you can borrow a good phono stage and outline a flowchart for your mods. You will not be disappointed.

You're welcome, Dennis. Now you're beginning to realize the 1200 on steroids is NOT a low end deck. It is low priced, nonetheless. For just over $1000 (brand new) you can purchase the following:

1) 1200 turntable
2) Tonearm fluid damper
3) Outboard power supply (soon)
4) High end integrated headshell cartridge.

What a deal! No other deck comes even close...

As to cartridge choices, I do trust TWL's analog *expertise*. He's one of a kind. I would give Kevin Barrett a call, since he is also an authorized Goldring dealer. He can tell you what will work best w/in your budget. Tell him I sent you: www.kabusa.com

Last, the tonearm fluid damper is more than just a tweak...

There's always 1200 bashers in every audio forum. The problem is they can't back up their thoughtless comments and just make fools of themselves. These same people are also unable to look at something rehardless of brand and get some idea of how good it is. No wonder I get e-mails from people wanting to mod 1200s but who are uncomfortable publicly posting their views...

In my previous posts I have expressed some serious, valid and coherent points. A few hours ago I got the dual mono power supply for my Monolithic phono stage. The sound has changed drammatically in all areas: soundstage, dynamics, bass, PRAT, noise floor, etc. More than ever, I still think phono stage is more important than TT. I called member Jahaira and my 1200 was playing. He said to me--"It's sounding faster!" My reply was that PRAT had substantially improved, as well as the bass. He could hear that vocals were clearer, too. And this was over the telephone!

These are exciting times!

"Good grief, now we've got audiophiles hearing "PRAT" over the telephone..."

Caribbean audiophiles--that is. Jahaira & I have been raised listening, singing and dancing Afro-Caribbean music. We have an unbelievably good sense of rhythm and timing. When I was in grade school we used to piss off the teachers by using the desktops as drums and improvising rhythms(descargas). Where I come from people bring their drums and instruments to the beach and happy hours on the street and sing and play for hours and hours. It's not coincidence we have the highest number of Latin Grammy nominations.

What I wrote might be impossible for you, but not for us. I mean, there's people in Fiji that walk barefooted over red hot rocks...good grief!

Since you like proof, dear Zaikes, I'm giving you some:

When Columbia records decided to record their first crossover album with the Fania All Stars (1976-77) they sent one of their executives to the first rehearsal. Fania All Stars is composed of pretty much the top salsa players in each instrument--and most of those are percussion instruments--even the string bass is played upbeat! Anyway, the record executive showed up with a *metronome* --so that the Fania All Stars could "keep their rhythm!". Such is the ignorance level out there. If a Columbia Records executive did that, I'm not surprised nor offended by your comment. Next time you get to go to a Caribbean party for Anglos watch how they dance--maybe you'll understand. Because of that incident w/Columbia, the album was titled "Rhythm Machine".

Regarding my unhappiness if I didn't "have anyone to pick up a fight", I have forwarded you a copy of an e-mail between Kevin and I, where I state that I was glad that the 1200 bashers were gone--and directing him to this thread. I was wrong.

Will you also be "sure" about me being "insecure"?

"Psych do you honestly think you are giving Denis the best advice based on his equipment."

Yes, I think so. It was him who mentioned *purchasing* a 1200 to begin with. If he's got such an expensive rig he should know a little bit about audio--or risk falling prey to unscrupulous salesmen.

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"Can a $500 turntable, better a 6k cd unit, used on a very revealing system. The answer to this question is only common sense."

I think the thread's title pretty much answers the question were in not by the fact that I have ordered two "Wadia Killer" CD transports (AIWA XC-35M & XC-37M, less than $100 each). There's simply too much overrated gear in *high end*. Therefore, I don't look at equipment in "$500 vs 6K" terms...

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"The rest of us think he would be better served saving his money for something more complementary to his other components."

He already has the TT! Like Deano taught me, "Never pass up an audition." I bet "the rest of us" haven't auditioned a modded 1200 vs other higher priced decks. Like it always happens. I wrote I might do the Wadia/1200 comparison in the future--once I've done all the mods.

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"I know only to well, what a revealing amp and speakers, can make a entry level front end sound like."

Just because amp and speakers are revealling does not necessarily mean more musical. I do have revealling and musical amp and speakers (Melos SHA-1 linestage, Forté 4A amp & Modwright Swans M1 speakers). I purchased the Forté 4A per Sean's recommendation. He said if my front end was good enough I would be able to reap the Forté's benefits. After letting it run for three days straight I e-mailed Sean what I was hearing. His reply was that I had given "a pretty accurate description of how that amp sounds". Therefore, my front end is up to speed...

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"you guys are throughing good money away, trying to polish a turd. I guess you guys are dj's, in that case DD Turntables and Stanton cartridges are the ticket. good luck!"

"I am sorry I hurt your feelings with my thoughtless comments, but I do not think I am the fool here."

No, you haven't--how could you?

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Oh, not all this Planet's caucasian men are Anglos, BTW. For example, 80% of the Arab world is caucasian--so much for the "sand n*****" stereotype. Anyone seen recent pictures of blonde Afghanis with green eyes? I was referring to "conditioning" to rhythm and timing as we grow up (that's what the grade school reference is for). No intention to attach racial stigma. Much of our musical heritage is Arab--not just African. The Arabs conquered most of Spain for some 800 years.

Have a great weekend and...

POP UP THE VOLUME!!!

OK, I'm back...

Zaikes, you've made me have a laugh with your message--for real! I was just talking to Jahaira earlier today--we *can* hear subtle changes PRAT--with our music, most definitely! Maybe you should take a vacation in Fiji--or the Caribbean!

Music is not the only activity I do for pleasure. Fitness boxing and training has been, although I've been retired from that and gaining weight like crazy...

Roni, this is what got you in trouble: "I guess you guys are dj's, in that case DD Turntables and Stanton cartridges are the ticket. good luck!"

If you would go to the reviews section and read Zaikes' review of the tonearm damper for the 1200 you would realize who Zaikesman is. His rig is well put together and his eloquent review demonstrates a command of the English language and a very keen ear. A visit to www.kabusa.com would immediately tell that Kevin is a non-commercial, non-Voodoo guy dedicated to the preservation of analog recordings. He has also designed and marketed the most complete transcription phono preamp on the market. His choosing the 1200 as a main workhorse might at least raise some questions and give you some insights...

As to why I buy CD's, hey It's time consuming to clean records & styli, flip them, etc. A WADIA quality CD changer-transport is very appealing to me, especially if it's less than $250. I have some 700 LPs vs 300 CDs, so I need a TT that will make things easier for me while providing adequate high end playback performance. I can start fast, clean records on top of the platter, have light for the stylus, continuous VTA adjustment, service manual, parts availability, etc. Without question, the modded 1200 fits the bill in its price class like no other deck. When I started shopping for a TT I was looking at the "glass and particle board" crowd until I ran into posts of people modding the 1200 for high end use. I approached the subject with an open mind--that's all...