@auxinput
Impressive.
Certainly appreciated. Thanks.
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@in_shore > Anyway I find this cable subject interesting especially Audioengr comments and test results which got me to order his reference coax cable .
Blindjim > I’ll echo the need for you to clue us in on your subjective appraisals of the reference wire.
Plese. Thanks.
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@lowrider57
Thoughtful.
Many Thanks.
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@teo_audio
Thanks for the input.
Jim will need something else….
10 – 4!
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Yep. I’m still here.
I’ve decided to get a couple wires and some BNC to RCA adapters for my Oyaide BNC cable and do a wee comparison test among the three. One of the new wires is decided. The other one is still a question mark, but the dust is settling.
Although the Oyaide BNC on site is a 1.3M (4.27ft) cable, I’ll shoot for lengths of 1.5M (4.92ft). the application in this case simply does not warrant more investment IMHO.
Stay tuned for feedback on things going forward. Hopefully this will not turn out to be a matter of preferred differences, rather than improved performance given the constraints of the associated gear at this interval. We’ll see.
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I just noticed, Oddly enough, in the clip I added, from the film 'miracle mile', I recognized a voice, and it was in the aerobics room, in the clip.
It was an uncredited speaking role in a film (one line), for
Marina Sirtis
(Deanna Troy from Star Trek TNG).
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I haven't tried i2s interface. However, I think the Wireworld HDMI cables are probably the best design overall. Many have touted how good USB is and several are of the opinion that USB is the best digital audio connection. Of course, you can only do DSD audio over USB (or i2s). In my experience, digital COAX performed much better than USB, but I was just using the USB straight from my motherboard with a poor USB DAC. I have not tried any of the upgraded USB cards (SOTM, JCAT, Paul Pang). I'm sure the quality of the USB receiver in the DAC has a lot to do with it as well (the better ones being like Amanero or Singxer). |
LowRider I never did use any other cable with the PS Audio player and PS Audio dac senior except the factory supplied I2s cable then later changing over to the WireWorld platinum starlight which btw is exceptional with video .
As you most likely know users of PS Audio components are well aware SACD playback via the I2s outputs the DSD signal with licensing agreements though some discs I have are detailed , smooth and inviting I have a pile of red-book CDs that rival sacd playback including DVD Audio and so called hi-res downloads that I listened to .
Changing dacs is a long story however currently with playback I’m getting a downsampled PCM version using the PS Audio DMP and Denafrips Dac at 88.2KHz 24 bit and with direct comparison between the two dacs the Denafrips easily surpassed the PS Audio dac for a much , much more enjoyable playback presentation , well that’s what I hear,..
Finally Im just curious to listen to a very good coax cable in direct comparison to the I2s . |
blindjim,
I skimmed though this thread and didn't see any mention of a optical cable. I know there are many people out there that don't like optical, BUT I found one I use in my system (connects my streamer to my Ayre Codex dac) that I found that sounded incredibly good. It's the Wireworld Super Nova 7 glass optical. It retails for $200. I got mine new for $150 for a 1 meter length. Not sure how it compares with the better coax cables out there, but this one impressed the heck out of me. IMO. Worth a try??? |
@in_shore
My curiosity grows on the PSA WAVE setup. Albeit, given the biz with DSD vs all other formats, I believe I’ll aim for merely Red Book playback DACs. If they have more attributes or support more BR and SR then fine.
Have you found via comparison sake, between two identical titles, one off SACD disc, one streamed via the I2S one is best on all accounts?
That question seems loaded, as there are a few variables, but generally speaking if the I2 and USB cables in play are the exact same level from the same maker, it should be a close enough experiment I would suspect.
LowRider
RE “its great with video”
At $700, it ought to be. I’ve found too merely adding a nice upscale Power Cord on the rendering device vastly improved the video. Good to very good will suffice for my needs, its mostly for company or a date night anyhow. I tend to use the Narrative Audio track now on many BR discs. Using this optional audio track, it is almost like old time radio. Most things are verbally explained during the film by a separate voice. Even in the chasing, combat, and fighting scenes. Description rests in between the standard dialog.
It’s a brave new world sports fans!
. . . . . .
@mr_m
Thanks. Yeah. I did not mention optical on purpose. Although I’ve had somewhat similar results to your own with various low end TOS links.
One issue arises in what your post says… ‘glass’.
It is my understanding the glass refers to a different connector or interface than simpler TOS cables.
Is this your own EXP with the one you mention? Did it come with adapters if so?
With various iterations of el cheapo TOS links from the early ‘s, $20 - $40, the sound was hard on most discs, and from CATV boxes via bit stream except for greater sampling rates above 44K.
Surprisingly, a 6ft TOS I picked up at Wally World in a pinch eased up the stern presentations of the shorter thinner 1M links from Best buy or online outlets. In fact that wally cable became my go to TOS for CATV boxes and Megga CD changers. $15 I think.
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you can buy glass tos cables, not just glass ST link cables.
speaking of that, I must have a few thousand feet of st link glass terminated cables. Found a pile of it a few months back, can't bring myself to throw it out....
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Blindjim,
The glass optical cable has the standard ends of a inexpensive toslink, but are highly polished on the Wireworld. Standard cheap toslink ($15 to $30 variety) usually comes with one thick plastic line to transmit the signal. OTOH, a high quality glass optical is made up of hundreds of small glass threads to carry signal. The Wireworld has approx. 330 of these minute glass cables bundled into one. This makes for a much more expensive interconnect, but is vastly superior to a standard cheap toslink. I have done extensive comparisons with both. YMMV. |
BlindJim
Like some I prefer physical ownership of my music and I guess I could rip my CDs and store my collection away however I don’t mind plopping a disc in a tray.
When it comes DSD , Sacd and jacked up music files sold as Hi-res music I’m highly sceptical of it well most anything the industry pushes I’m weary of .
Back to the subject I did manage to borrow a DH silver sonic coax cable and compared it to the I2s and found little difference with the I2s I’m hearing it in low level information and perhaps a bit more realistic sounding human voice and vocalist however that was just one evening of listening . |
When looking at dac cabling one has to also look at the given reclocking scenario that may be in play.
Quite a bit of the modern gear reclocks at one end of the transmission chain, or both.
this will narrow the differences in cables to some degree.
Then one is left with figuring out if the reclocking on board the given device ...is substandard or not. And whether that given reclocking is messing up cable qualities analysis, or not. Or by what degree, is the usual reality.
This is why one has to be careful in what one thinks they hear with a given cable/dac/source combination which is in play.
Beside the issue of whether the given listener has the mental/physical wherewithal to have discernment or preference for the given scenario that is at hand.
traditionally, relocking is not there, so older dacs with lower resolution can many times have more of the given cable’s intrinsic qualities come shining through.
This is due to the external coaxial cabling and system of transfer, was originally intended to never leave the confines of the given CD player. It was meant to be an internal hardware method of moving the bits off the cd proper and into the DAC chipset proper. It was never meant to be externalized into what it is today. Most importantly, the clocking data was embedded into the signal and transferred by the internal cable. Which is now an external coaxial cable. so the jitter of the transport/read... became the jitter of the dac. bit-word timing was determined by the cd read hardware and the spinning disc system itself. Coaxial is legacy hardware from the literal first days of digital audio on the CD format. Modern implementation has re-clocking at the DAC receiver end of things. If you read carefully, you see that the jitter of the cable, it's complex set of overall characteristics... comes into play in such a system of signal transfer.
Just...sort of ...restating the argument of the whole process, with regard to fundamentals.
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The glass optical cable has the standard ends of a inexpensive toslink, but are highly polished on the Wireworld. Standard cheap toslink ($15 to $30 variety) usually comes with one thick plastic line to transmit the signal. OTOH, a high quality glass optical is made up of hundreds of small glass threads to carry signal. I have compared good glass Toslink cables to a high-quality plastic one and this plastic one beat the glass: https://btpa.com/TOSLINK-XXX.html Steve N. Empirical Audio |
Then one is left with figuring out if the reclocking on board the given device ...is substandard or not. And whether that given reclocking is messing up cable qualities analysis, or not. Or by what degree, is the usual reality.
This is why one has to be careful in what one thinks they hear with a given cable/dac/source combination which is in play. An unfortunate state of affairs IMO. If the DAC S/PDIF input would only go to a good S/PDIF receiver like the AK4114, many DAC’s would at least have the capacity to sound a lot better with a low-jitter input source and a good S/PDIF cable. Instead, you mostly hear the Master Clock of the reclocker inside the DAC, which is usually of dubious quality. A reclocker or a good S/PDIF cable before the DAC can still be beneficial because the PLL of the reclocker in the DAC is usually still sensitive to incoming jitter (the filter of the PLL). BTW, many modern DAC’s do not have reclockers on the S/PDIF inputs, but some do use older receiver technology, so their ability to reduce or maintain low jitter is compromised.
Steve N. Empirical Audio
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audio sensibility a very good digital cable. Get his best dont look back. AND its pretty reasonable (well who knows whats reasonable in this hobby anymore)
Best
Char2
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I second the Black Cat Silverstar recommendation. Can use as RCA or BNC. |
Thanks to all. Especially teo_audio & Steve N.
Furthermore, many thanks to those whose comparisons have been included so far.
I’m sorry I’ve not been paying more strick or timely attention of late.
I’ve been learning the UDP 203 and thus far am pleasantly impressed. I’m bringing in two wires next week to begin the trials. Figured it a decent idea to get the 203 a bit of time spinning discs and integrating . it into the present bare bones outfit. Everything has been sitting idle for months as I’ve been leaning on the personal confuser and headphones or a pair of so soLogitech desktop speakers for any listening.
That is, of course, in between Dr visits and Atty visits, and as well I’ve been learning to play my new/used Kurzweil Model Pc88 88 key and controller
keyboard. The keyboard needs a better powered speaker for sure, but for now its good enough.
BTW.. any and all anecdotal info is welcome regarding RCA or TOS links. As well, subjective user accounts in terms of A ‘versus’ B comparisons are quite welcome too!
Ya simply don’t know what ya don’t know! Until you do. End user input always helps. Consequently so does maker feedback!
Many many thanks.
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What did you end up with here? |
