Koetsu vs Dynavector

I feel that there is no "best" piece of audio gear. There is only a best for a specific listener, in a specific space with a specific setup. This is why I always try and post as much context as possible about my preferences and associated gear when I post on a forum. For me that "real person" feeling in the core of midrange is the most important thing. This is the range that the human ear is the most sensitive to for a variety of evolutionary reasons. It is also the area that conveys the bulk of the emotional meaning of the music. While I certainly appreciate the bombast of the bass drums in large scale orchestral music and the subtle timing that a well played high-hat can add to a rock or jazz number, they are always secondary to me. Sure they still convey some emotional meaning (the bombast tells me to be scared or elated for example) but I think the bulk of the meaning, even in a generally large scale work like the 1812 Overture for example comes from the musicians working in the middle of the sound range. In an ideal world it would be great to have that midrange covered beautifully as well as the extension to the extremes of the frequency range with perfect timing accuracy. Unfortunately this ideal is not realistic even for those on the most extreme of budgets (which I am not). We all make choices about what is the most important to us and chose to maximize those priorities (this is true in all aspects of life, not just audio).

To tell the truth, even if one of the posters to this forum had exactly the same system as I do and a very similar room and similar tastes in music, I still would not blindly follow his recommendation. The choice is far too individual. The reason I post is to hear some of the differing opinions and try and synthesize a view on the world that works with my own preferences. So keep it coming with "Koetsu's are grossly coloured", "Koetsu's are made by magic elves with special magnets made from metoers that were sent to earth in the Great Age of Sound by the God of HIFI (and that is not J Gordon Holt and certainly not Harry Pearson). You should bow down before them and not even subject them to the insult of playing anything less than the most Holy of music (Famous Blue Raincoat by J Warnes, I think).", "Rega is crap and shouldn't have anything more valuable than a cactus needle for a stylus" and "Rega is the only true tonearm and all other tonearms are actually machined from the femur of the devil to ensnare us into spending too much money".

What would you like to know about the Rega? None of the commonly done Rega mods alter the arms characteristics in any meaningful way. The effective mass is the same with the mods as without. The dampening is the same with or without. Until you get into some of the radical mods that are really beyond the average consumer (drilling the arm to change the mass or filling the arm with dampening material) the basic characteristics are fixed by the basic design. But in the interest of complete disclosure. The arm is a basic RB250 with the Incognito wiring kit that has been upgraded with Eichmann RCA jacks. The counterweight has been replaced with the Michell TecnoWeight and the arm has been fitted with the VTAF Teflon upgrade to allow easy optimization of VTA. The arm has not been stripped of its paint as I am suspect as to how much dampening a thin layer of powder coat can supply, so I haven't bothered to take the time to mess with such things.

In terms of the Mod Squad Phono, I can't be that much more specific. I don't have exact gain figures for it and I am not really sure they would supply much additional info anyway as I also don't have a gain value for the amp. If you are implying that total gain may be an issue, I would agree with you. That has been a concern with both the lower output Koetsu and the Dynavectors. The confounding variable here though is who do you believe in terms of cartridge output. The Koetsu Vermillion lists at 0.2mV on the KoetsuUsa site but the Stereophile review of said cartridge list it at 0.4mV. So I guess overall system gain is indeed a sticking point for our discussion but I don't think there is any easy was around this. The other criteria that you may have been looking for is loading for the cartridge. The Mod Squad has variable loading but off the top of my head I can't remember the values. The loading is easy to change via a simple knob so I suspect that I could easily find something that was at least in the ball park for most cartridges.

Currently I am a bottom dwelling of the cartridge world. I have a Grado Reference Platinum and a Zu modified Denon 103. The Grado is on my old Oracle Alexandria and the Zu is on my Lenco L70. The Zu is a bit of a challenge for the phono stage but it seems to get by without to much trouble but I will admit that I don't have any room to spare on gain. I love the Grado with voices. There are much more reach out and touch them than the Zu but the Zu has a propulsive sound that really keeps things going. I like the Grado for the majority of my listening as per my previous posts I gravitate to smaller scale vocal work but I must admit when the urge to crank up some classic Hendrix or Clapton strikes I would always lean towards the Zu. I intend to keep the Zu around and perhaps get a transformer to allow me to use it into the MM stage of the Mod Squad.

Hope that clarifies things enough to satisfy the detail oriented posters on this forum.

Don't think I forgot anything relevant.......perhaps only that my favourite colour is orange.

I think I am leaning towards the Koetsu's to be quite frank (not sure about the suggested jump to something in the Platinum line, I think my wife would send me to the curb for that) but just for hypothetical fun let's propose another option. If one were to be able to find say a Te Kaitora Rua for about $1500 (used obviously) and a Koetsu Black (Not a Urushi just a simply Black) for say $1000, one could have both cartridges to play with. Now the VTAF upgrade on the Rega allows you to swap the arm just by lifting it out of the mount and fitting another in. So lets add another $400 for a second modified Rega arm. For just shy of $3000 (which seems to be about fair market value on demo and used Urushi's and XV1) you could pick and choose between the family sounds. Granted you wouldn't have scaled the heights of the cartridge mountain to quite the same height but it could be another fun option. (Not really sure how practical this would be from the wife approval point of view as she is already a bit reluctant to play a record on her own, imagine if I told her she had to chose a cartridge first....Oh Boy)

I really have to laugh at all the out of hand dismissals of the Mod Squad as a phono stage.

First of all I doubt that most people have ever heard it as it was not a product with large distribution, so I am not sure how qualified most people are to speak on it's merits and likewise weaknesses.

Second, if we take it that most people are basing their opinion (and my sincerest apologies to anyone who has had significant experience with the unit and has made comments) on something other than actual first hand experience, I wonder where these opinions are coming from. It certainly isn't that people are basing them on the published reviews. The only review that I have found pitted the Mod Squad against the cult classic John Curl Vendetta. This was in Stereophile in January 1989 and was written by John Atkinson. In the review he clearly states (and the review in on Sterephile's website) "The main audible difference between the two phono preamplifiers was caused by noise". He admits that the Mod Squad is very slightly noisier with very low output MC cartridges than the Vendetta but that the noise is only obtrusive when music is not playing in a silent room. He then goes on to catalogue the various strengths of each stage and for every area that the Vendetta wins the Mod Squad wins another. There is clearly nothing in this review to suggest the Mod Squad is a second class citizen.

I wonder if it is just that the phono stage is old. If it were a CD player I would concur whole heartedly that it can't keep up with current players but in phono stages (and really in amplification in general) this can't really be said. Many of the "great" phono stages of that era like the Vendetta and certain Counterpoint models have gained a cult status and are closely guarded by there owners. If we accept that the Mod Quad might just be a member of this class, then one must also dismiss those legendary stages as subpar as well. Just because something is old doesn't mean it is less good. Think of the Japanese FM tuners of the 1960's and 1970's. You are hard pressed to match the classic Sansui's and Kenwood's with the best of todays tuners (and certainly can't come close to a value comparison). The phono gear from the late eighties was many companies swan song in terms phono gear (or at least that is what they thought at the time). They thought that the LP was dead so they threw all the resources they had (best parts, full balance of accumulated knowledge, etc) at making the "last great" phono gear. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the phono products from this era.

As I said in my post, I welcome the opinions of those who have had direct experience with the Mod Squad. I am simply commenting on the general trend in these posts for people to make broad ranging comments based on little, if any actual experience with a product. For those who this is not applicable to, feel free to comment but a comment with some "meat" more welcome. Simply saying that a product is bad is of no use at all. Do you think it is a compatibility issue? Do you think it is a sound quality issue? etc. I would also say that the personal attacks on my character are not welcome. I never attacked any individual in my postings. I simply commented on the general flavour of some of the postings.

Now on to specifics. The Zu has an output of 0.3mV. The cartridges that we have largely been discussing (the Koetsu Urushi and the Dynavector XV1s) have this much or more output. The only cartridges that I mentioned that have less are the Vermillion at 0.2 and the Kaitora at 0.26. So at least half the cartridges are of greater output so gain should not be an issue with them. For the other two, I again reiterate that a compatibility issues is very different than a quality issue. I have also clearly said that I agree that overall gain might be an issue with the lowest output cartridges. I doubt anyone is implying that phono stage quality can be simply gauged by overall gain, so perhaps we can stop dismissing the phono stage simply as having too little gain.

I would suggest that $4000 on a cartridge rarely makes any sense. This is not however what we are really discussing here. I have said that I am looking at a variety of cartridges at demo, used and closeout prices. This makes the cartridges much closer to $2000-2500. I don't agree that in such a price context, the cartridges that I have mentioned are out of line for the system that I have.

I would also argue that the typical idea of the turntable being the most important piece followed by the arm and then the cartridge is flawed logic. If you subscribe to the Linn school of thought that "Garbage in, equals garbage out", the logical extension is that the most important piece is the cartridge. It has the most difficult job in many ways as the only piece that has to actually change physical energy (groove modulations) into electrical energy. The other parts of the system can only serve to mess up the info retrieved by the cartridge. So I would say put the cartridge first and then allocate less to the rest of the chain (at least until you get to the speakers which have the next most difficult job, transferring electrical energy to physical energy).

Signing off.

I have realized that life is too short to engage in these audiophilia nervosa discussions.

At the end of the day all that matters is each person feeling good about their own choices. That can never happen in a forum like this unless you shape your opinions to fit the masses of the forum.

So I leave all of you to you opinions (and suggest to Audiofeil that "fact" is an awfully strong word to throw around. I am not really sure that I know any "facts" and I work in a world that is supposedly driven by science {I am a ER physician}).

Just to tidy things up a bit further, I have decided not to go to the exalted heights of the Urushi. I am going to stay at the Soundsmith, Cartridge Man, Grado level. Is this because of the discussion here. Yes but only indirectly. I have decided that life is too short to worry about getting the best and all I want to do is have some fun listening to music. Perhaps I will keep track of all the albums I am able to buy with the $1000 I save and post to this forum as the biggest justification in the world for a "lesser cartridge".

Thanks for all the opinions (even the ones I strongly disagree with, for the only thing that really allows you to truly understand yourself is be challenged on your beliefs; Socrates was correct "An unexamined life is not worth living)

Dan

Just a final parting thought. It was Socrates not Thoreau. Socrates said it at his trial for heresy. He was given the option of living a life that didn't involved questioning everything (basically he was told to shut up and quite questioning his betters or die). He choose death because he was unwilling to live "The unexamined life". Thoreau may have said it latter but it was most certainly Socrates that this sentiment was originally attributed to.