John Dunlavy On "Cable Nonsense"

I have no way of verifying this rather astounding claim, but perhaps someone else does:

Virtually no high end cable company makes its own cables. Some don't even design their cables. Most of the cables come from the same factories; they choose among the factory's options of colors, materials, designs, termination styles and length. They are quoted a price and that's it. Some may do custom terminations, but that's all the "manufacturing" they do.

See http://www.high-endaudio.com/magaz.html#Cab

This is a question of fact, not subjectivity. Saying "But I can hear the difference" is irrelevant. Can anyone convincingly verify or debunk this claim?

As the instigator of this thread, I'd like to point out that no one has yet responded to Abe's observation:

"With regard to AC power cords I cannot understand the logic of spending hundreds of dollars on colorful fat cables to plug into a wall outlet that has cheap wiring behind it throughout the house."

I'm discovering that the reply from true believers to a logical statement such as the above runs along the lines of, "But I can hear the difference!"

Of course, all debate stops when one side becomes completely subjective. Just as devotees of psychic hotlines swear their fortune-teller is genuine.

Do you ever get the feeling that this is the audio version of the age-old debate between rationalists and religious fanatics?

I'll be interested in seeing a coherent response to Abe's statement.

Abe, what a great idea. If I thought audiophiles had any money left over for lawn care, I'd go into the $5,000 garden hose business. An easy sell.

Maybe this explains it all -- or at least part of it:

"Auditory memory is said to last for only about forty seconds (average) and this possibly explains the diverse auditory perceptions."
From:
http://www.innerear.on.ca/editorials/editorial-v9-3.html

A few people have asked me, as the igniter of this unexpectedly voluminous thread, to state my opinion. I've held back, but after almost 150 postings on this topic, and now that it seems to be slowing down...what the heck.

Based on my 30 some years in audio, many of those years spent as a musician, and the past 15 years as a financial writer observing the degradation some people will fall into in pursuit of their god of money, I see the same pattern in huckster get-rich-quick pitches as I see in high-end product advertising, particularly in cables, interconnects and, most shamelessly, in power cords: Snake oil. The only difference is that the financial con men appeal to their audience's desire to get rich quick, while the audio con men appeal to their audience's desire to get audio nirvana quick.

Before you ask, have I spent tens of thousands of dollars and auditioned every interconnect, cable and cord out there? Of course not. Have you? Even if I had attempted such an absurd venture and pronounced my opinions, they would only be MY opinions, and many would disagree. The 40-second rule applies.

I have tried some high end speaker cables and compared them to Radio Shack 12 gauge oxygen-free copper cable at what the salesman thinks is an outrageous $1.00/foot. I find no appreciable difference.

Horrified? Get in line.

If it comforts you, I hear a big difference between 12 gauge and 14 or thinner. Other than that -- snake oil.

I think that some people are convinced that they hear a difference between, for example, one cable or power cord versus another. I can't get in their head to verify this. But my common sense, which I am learning more and more to trust, tells me that most likely they *want* to hear a difference. Maybe it's because they bought it and have convinced themselves they have to defend their extravagant purchase to their wife and thus to themselves. Maybe it's because they read a review and have convinced themselves that if they allow themselves to disagree with the respected reviewer they wouldn't be taken seriously as an audiophile, by their friends or perhaps just in their own minds. Whatever it is:

High end audio is largely about ego. That's why it's a male hobby.

We all want to think we have the biggest and the best. Or that we are on the way to getting it. And the latest and greatest cables and power cords all promise to be the new Viagra. Until you get the next issue of Stereophile which pronounces the newest latest and greatest.

And to those who have asked about my system (golly, I hope mine's bigger than yours)...here's what I am currently listening to:

Thorens TD-160 Mark II table
Audio Technica AT440 cart
Audible Illusion Modulus 3A pre-amp
JoLida tube CD player
Theta Casablanca
Spectron Musician II amp
Martin-Logan speakers
12 gauge Radio Shack O2-free speaker cable at an outrageous $1.00/foot
TMC interconnects on some components, Radio Shack gold terminal interconnects on others (haven't made up my mind on these, except the TMCs are stiff as a board and very difficult to work with)

FYI, the Spectron/Martin Logan combination is truly magical.

Of course, that's only my opinion. But I make no money giving you my opinion; unlike the cable and power cord manufacturers. Snake oil it's not.

Amen, brother Steve. We can make a mint by starting the Church of the Heavenly Power (Cord).

Jadem6, you appear to be criticizing me for not believing there is a difference, and then criticizing me for trying to be fair. I bought the TMC's because they are the highest-rated at audioreview and was willing to give them a chance, and change my opinion if there was an improvement in sound. I've lived with them for about a week and I think a week isn't a fair trial. Unlike some who disagree with me, I try not to jump to conclusions.

Grungle, you're a pessimist. I think we can squeeze 500 posts out of this. If you're gonna be a bear, be a grizzly.

P.S. Nobody has yet explained the logic of plugging a multi-thousand dollar power cord into 50 cents a foot Romex.