Jazz for aficionados

@alexatpos

I’ve only listened to it on youtube.

I didn’t realize this material had been released before, so I can’t offer a comparison.

If the sound were better, I would’ve bought it on CD already, but maybe this is better than other versions? I simply don’t know. Sorry I can’t be more helpful.

@curiousjim 

OK. 

I was simply letting you know about a certain Aqua DAC available used from a dealer I directed you to in the past. It is perhaps the same unit I'd seen on their website but was gone  the next time I checked.  It seems to be back, now, FYI.

Stuart

@curiousjim

Yes sir. The thought occurred to me that it might be a good way to audition one, as the restock fee based upon the used price is less it would be to try out and return a new unit. However, if you're in the enviable position of being able to buy a Wavedream Reference, then such minor financial considerations would appear to be a moot point!  ;o)   

@curiousjim

Well you never know. After my recent bewilderingly underwhelming audition of a 10K DAC, I no longer know what to think. At this point, the only thing I’m certain of is that cost is no guarantee of satisfaction.

@curiousjim

I haven’t bought anything from a local dealer in about 20 years. They went out of business not that long afterwards.

I bought a system from them that sounded good in the showroom but proved unlistenably bright at home. I decided from then on to not buy anything I couldn’t audition at home with a return policy. I’ve stuck to that with two exceptions, my Silverline standmounts and Jay’s cd transport. Fortunately, both have turned out to be "keepers".

There was another dealer in town but as they didn’t allow home demos, they got no business from me. They subsequently shifted their focus to home theater installations.

I did buy gear from a guy who ran his business from home. He lived close by and would bring gear to my house to hear. Sadly, he couldn’t make a go of it and ultimately closed down.

I’ve subsequently bought gear from brick and mortar stores that also sell online and offer returns: Alma in San Diego and Listen Up! in Denver.

Where are you?

Will PM you, so this thread can revert back to the topic of Jazz!  

@tyray , @mahgister 

You're welcome!

Finally discovered a M. Brecker CD I like enough to purchase. It’s contemporary without sounding overly commercial and it’s all acoustic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wp3TSgdEa4&list=PLm4I8tP6UbWad15rthLO-huvRvKerJI0d&index=4

Perhaps, now that I’ve gained a "toe-hold" in his discography, I can use it as a "springboard" and move onto appreciating more of his recordings. If this one has been mentioned here, before, I don't recall it. 

Another recent acquisition I’m enjoying:  "The Montreal Tapes: Charlie Haden, Paul Motion, Gonzalo Rubalcaba" .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1esQx5ilNH4&list=PLQdVEoo1TcuJhHGi4jm0llGXvGXjlQQ9r

@curiousjim 

Yeah -- it's a gorgeous performance. Makes me want to check out the rest of C. Haden's groups from that same festival. 

Cuban Jazz piano players can often sound like McCoy Tyner on steroids but here, Rubalcaba's playing is more measured. 

@frogman 

Thanks for the Brecker suggestions. 

@mahgister 

Thanks for the links to Latin American Jazz pianists. 

@ho249 

Thanks for introducing an artist I wasn’t familiar with. 

All excellent examples of why I value this this thread and appreciate those who contribute to it! 

@frogman 

Thanks for that. Well worth watching. Certainly lots to think about. The reminder that, although we tend to start out with the belief that we are right, in realty we often don’t actually know where others are coming from, is, needless to say, highly pertinent to the mess we find ourselves in at present. 

@mahgister 

RE: Estate, I love this tune!  

RE: Estate: 

Bobby Hutcherson's interpretation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_DuWzO5CE8

@wharfy 

Incredible NHOP Trio Live:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8T25Lei58A&list=PLc7Km-77ALdHuEZe6S7CJxLHh63Tvh348

@wharfy 

That trio is incredible. 

Yes, indeed. A killer performance. Glad you’re enjoying it!  

I’d never encountered Wakenius before hearing this recording. I enjoy his playing here as much as NHOP’s.  

@jafant 

when was Freddie not on fire?

His discography is somewhat uneven but it’s fairly large, so there’s something for everyone. 

My favorites: Ready For Freddy, Goin’ Up, Breaking Point and the stuff he did with Blakey. 

@jafant 

Thanks for asking. Yes; I did finally track down the sibilance to an unexpected source -- cement pavers I had under my Target stands. An easy fix and what a relief! 

I’d also had a fatigue issue that I traced to my (Burr-Brown) Aqua DAC, which I sold. In its place, I began using the onboard (AKM) DAC in my Hegel H390. In the process, I lost some highs (the Hegel DAC is somewhat rolled off) and some bass extension, as well. 

I was able to get back some of the bass with an ac cable upgrade but still need to work on restoring the highs without reintroducing fatigue. I recently auditioned a Mojo Mystique XSE DAC but it sounded very dull in my system. It would appear I need to try a less warm-sounding DAC. 

That’s where things are at, currently. The system is emotionally and physically engaging but too dark.   

@wharfy 

Thanks for your suggestion. I've read reviews but my understanding is that Musetech does not have a repair facility in the US. This a non-starter for me. If I'm mistaken, please let me know. 

@wharfy 

Looks like Midwest Audio in Mishawaka Indiana, who sell gear on usaudiomart, are a musetech dealer.

@wharfy 

Yes; that is indeed the question!

@jafant 

Have you heard this one?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5nmVEwZ85s&list=OLAK5uy_lQyhGfgf3P7C0NpEbxFRN1zPmuJoYa6n4&index=2

@acman3 

I haven’t listened to him extensively but I’ve had difficulty engaging emotionally with what I have heard. Whether rightly or wrongly, I’ve come away with a sense that he’s rather cerebral. Of course, this is not to say he’s not a master. I’ve heard him with Evans, with Rollins, with Carter and the live trio... I think it was called  "Jim Hall Live". Perhaps you can recommend others.

@acman3 

Thanks!  Will do. 

For those interested in exploring the work of Roy Du Naan, here is a listing of recordings he engineered:

https://www.discogs.com/artist/407308-Roy-DuNann?srsltid=AfmBOopYBTsfayo3EOEhkvUd-7gRtBHJjOv6CgtY6zIW3eT7RWATNXVl

@audio-b-dog 

Is this your first time visiting this thread?

If so, your willingness to pass judgement seems a bit hasty,. 

Perhaps I misunderstand your poem, but are you suggesting Jazz is, by definition, all church on the one hand and alleyway funk on the other?  Do you believe Parker, Coltrane, Davis, Shorter, etc. were adverse to leveraging their intellects?  

@audio-b-dog 

FYI,  also write poetry.

I’ve also played guitar (not Jazz) for many decades. As you know, in art we have inspiration/intuition and craft/application of techniques and concepts. The point I was trying to make is that there are no dumb Jazz musicians. For even the most naturally gifted, Jazz requires a sophisticated understanding of harmony and its application in improvising. This isn’t typically handed down by the muse.  

While emotion is number one for me in enjoying music and as an artistic man, I identify with and value the inner feminine more than men of other persuasions, I think it’s important to not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Mental discipline and the ability to analyze and conceptualize have an important place in all the arts.  

Of course, Jazz covers a very wide range. Some styles/genres are more complex than others and needless to say, individuals vary according to their natural expressive inclinations and natural talents. Some incline towards cool "intellectual" abstraction while others are more earthy, emotional and blues-based. And these factors are not necessarily mutually exclusive. I was speaking of Jazz players who have the ability to cover a wide stylistic spectrum, including the most harmonically sophisticated scenarios. 

Perhaps @frogman will join in and provide an inside-out perspective. 

@audio-b-dog 

I agree-- we are very much on the same page although I do think you are romanticizing a bit if you really believe there is not work involved in mastering Jazz. Like any art form, it takes commitment and and discipline and the further one wishes to go, the more it requires of the individual. The Coltrane’s and Shorters may make it seem easy but for most of us, art is not easy.

Having said that, I was watching an interview with Diane Seuss (digressing to poetry, here) the other day and she said writing poems has never been "effortful" for her.  I wish I could say the same about my writing process!

BTW, I don’t find you to be a pain at all. That never entered my mind. 

@audio-b-dog 

In that case, check out Night Dreamer, Adam’s Apple and JuJu, as well. These are all pretty accessible. Etcetera is as personal favorite but may not be your cup of tea. Of course, Shorter was part of Miles’ "2nd Great Quintet".  

The All Seeing Eye is pretty out there, avant garde. Odyssey of Iska and Moto Grosso Feio are long, spacy, meandering jams. I haven’t heard Schizophrenia and The Soothsayer in a long time and don’t remember them much. I’ve never heard Supernova. As you strean, you should be able to check these out. I'd still start with the initial three I mentioned, though. 

RE: Hubbard, thanks. I’ve heard those. Have you heard Ready For Freddie, Breaking Point and Goin’ Up? 

@audio-b-dog 

stuartk, writing poetry was never difficult for me because I was bursting with something to say and I wanted very badly to say it.  I studied with Gary Snyder and other notable poets, so I had a technical foundation. 

Lucky you! Looking back, now, I regret not having tried to get into an MFA writing program but my life went in other directions (BA in studio art and an MA in Counseling Psych). My writing is getting better but largely working on my own, progress has been slow. I’m currently working with a mentor I found on The Brooklyn Poets’ "Bridge" site. BTW, like Snyder, I live in the Sierra Foothills. 

@frogman 

I think it is very important to remember that one’s reaction to the amount of “emotionality” that a musician is perceived to express is very often as much a reflection of the listener as it is of the musician in question.  

Words of wisdom. I suspect this recognition may be more difficult for those of us who naturally gravitate to players who are more emphatically effusive. ... But then, maybe not. I don’t think anyone would describe Bill Evans as effusive but his live V. Vanguard version of "My Foolish "heart" has always been a very emotive listening experience for me.  In fact, it’s one of my very favorite Jazz recordings. There seems to be little logic involved, when it comes to our  likes/dislikes, or if there is, it’s subtle and convoluted. 

@mahgister 

Thanks for the intro to Nakamoto. 

@audio-b-dog 

I’m an old guy and I’ve heard a lot of music, and I’ve come to a point where I like what I like.

What I’ve found is that, with age, it’s become more challenging to avoid being constrained by preferences developed over decades of listening. I don’t know whether this is inevitable or to what degree this may be circumvented but for me, at least, it’s a real issue. It’s become harder and harder to discover music that really grabs me. This is one reason I lurk around this thread.  ;o)  

@audio-b-dog 

 I like music you want to dance to

Ah, OK.

For me, rhythm is very important when it comes to listening in general,. When it comes to Jazz, I want the strong sense of rhythm that is one of the strengths of the genre present, but I want to be able to focus first and foremost upon the melodic/harmonic improvisational aspects. I wouldn't call this cerebral, though. Thinking is most definitely not what I want to be doing when listening to music!  

@audio-b-dog

I don’t enjoy Rap for a variety of reasons. I haven’t listened to female rappers, so I don’t know whether they display a different perspective than the male rappers I’ve heard. To my ears, Rap sounds more like a spoken-word genre than music.  

Brazilian music is an area I’d like to explore more deeply. My favorite Brazilian recording is Milton Nascimento’s Clube Da Esquina , which is, of course, not jazz. 

You mentioned Flora Purim. I find much of her most popular work dated-sounding due to the Fusion influence that was dominant in the mid to late 70’s. However, I do enjoy her work in Chick Corea’s first, Latin-tinged Return to Forever group and her later "Perpetual Emotion’, which is in more of a mainstream Jazz vein.

@tyray 

You might also enjoy this other Blue Note quartet with Hutcherson and Hancock: 

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=bobby+hutcherson+Oblique

@audio-b-dog 

Agreed -- no lack of melody when it comes to standards.

Wayne Shorter is one of my favorite Jazz composers; although the chord changes can be fairly complex, the melodies can often be whistled. 

But perhaps "melodic" is in the mind of the listener. What sounds melodic to me might sound abstract to you. 

@audio-b-dog 

Well, you can always resort to youtube or spotify just to see whether you enjoy a particular album, irrespective of sonics.  

I'm actually not much of a P. Barber fan, based upon what audiophile friends have played for me, so far. But then, I feel the same way about D. Krall. Heresy, I know... ;o)

@audio-b-dog 

I only mentioned D. Krall because there seem to be many audiophiles whose "collection" of/familiarity with, Jazz singers is limited to these two artists. Please don’t interpret this as anything directed at you, personally.

I’m familiar with "live music" being the preferred baseline for building systems but I haven’t heard such a system. What I’ve heard are systems that present recordings differently. The music has always sounded like recorded music, not live music. And that’s not an issue for me. This doesn’t mean that I don’t care about sonics. Sloppy bass, dry mids, fatiguing highs are examples of issues that distract me from focusing upon the music. If I’m emotionally and physically engaged, then I’m OK with "good enough". I don’t have a dedicated room, anyway, so from a practical  point of view, it wouldn’t make much sense to strive for "you are at the venue" sonics.

@audio-b-dog 

To clarify, if I had a dedicated room and the financial resources, I suspect my curiosity would most likely tempt me to explore the possibility of building a system whose presentation mimicked live music. I’m not fundamentally opposed to this but neither do I require such a presentation to be fully engrossed in music. 

Some Jazz vocalists I enjoy: Tina May, Betty Carter, Jackie Ryan, Anita O’ Day, Sarah Vaughan, Helen Merrill, Sheila Jordan. 

My listening tastes...

Besides Jazz from 50’s to present day, I listen to a Classic Rock, Country, Blues, Old School Americana (The Band, G. Dead, etc. Classical solo piano (a new avenue of exploration for me) and a range of acoustic music from past and present that includes Newgrass, Celtic, singer-songwriter, Bluegrass, Folk (American and UK), and various blends of these genres. 

I tend to be album-focused rather than artist-focused and it’s not at all uncommon for me to own only one recording by a particular artist. An example is Aifoe O’ Donovan. I adore her "in the Magic Hour" but to me, everything else I’ve heard by her pales by comparison. 

@audio-b-dog 

Have sent PM 

@audio-b-dog 

PM = personal message. 

You should see a notification at the top of your screen to click on. 

I sent PM because you and I have gotten off main thread topic of Jazz and  etiquette dictates we not "hijack" the thread. 

I'd prefer to respect etiquette. 

@audio-b-dog 

Perhaps look under "my profile"?

Perhaps it shows up differently on different devices.

The Ken Burns video is, in my opinion, somewhat flawed in that he spent a disproportionate amount of time on early Jazz then rushed through subsequent eras/styles in much less detail. Still worth seeing but in my estimation, a rather lopsided presentation, as a whole.

Briefly, on two other topics 1) for better or for worse, I prefer physical media and

2) I have a 5 cd set of Debussy solo piano works by Bavouzet and a single disc of Debussy Etudes by Uchida. 

@audio-b-dog 

PMs are entirely fine. Sharing contact info is the no no.

We use private messaging all the time on this site.

I’m mystified as to why you cannot access PMs, but I’m admittedly not very computer literate.

I will respond to your question re: what I listen to, besides Jazz. Mostly acoustic genres: singer-songwriter, Americana, Folk, Celtic, Newgrass. These days, the lines between such genres are growing increasingly blurred. My current favorite relatively recent acquisition is Aoife O’Donovan’s "The Magic Hour".

I’ll listen to Blues, Country (not the slick Nashville Pop with cowboy hats stuff) and classic Rock, as well.

I’ve barely dipped my toe into Classical solo piano and would like to further explore the genre but it can be so time consuming comparing different versions of a particular Classical work in order to decide which to buy and I have to be in the right mood for Classical, which, admittedly, doesn’t occur very often.

Another acoustic genre is the ECM sound, a more European take on Jazz with Classical, avant garde, European Folk and other ethnic influences. Similarly, I enjoy the group Oregon. I also like John McLaughlin’s acoustic work including My Goals Beyond, Extrapolation, Shakti and the trio with Al di Meola and Paco de Lucia. I could go on but I’ll call this enough for now.

@acman3 

I know I’ve heard Gigi Gryce with Richard Williams before, but I swear it wasn’t either of these recordings. Good stuff! Looks like they’re still available used on CD, if one is willing to pay the price. 

I sure wish A'gon would iron out the bugs in the "@" tool. 

@audio-b-dog 

Well, that's a start!  ;o)

@audio-b-dog 

Try Cannonball's "Live at the Lighthouse", "Things Are Getting Better" and "Somethin" Else".

I assume you’ve heard him on "Kind of Blue"...

@audio-b-dog 

I have to write my passwords down-- no way could I possibly remember them all. Like many folks, I’ve got quite a list, at this point.

@audio-b-dog 

Well, we all have our favorites. After your earlier comment about liking music that makes you dance, I was not expecting you to state a fondness for Alice Coltrane, J. Coltrane and P. Sanders!  I like some of the recordings by these artists but not the more outside stuff. As I’ve aged, my enjoyment of atonality has subsided. Expressive techniques like overblowing are fine within an overall melodic context but the Free stuff is not for me, at this point.

Here’s a tune from Kenny Garrett’s "songbook" album. I like the whole album but this is one of my favorite tracks that has a kind of trance-like effect. I guess you could dance to it, if you wanted...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Qkno-GGjms&list=OLAK5uy_nzRDhTQsYxrCuBNAomx-pAqToHlmWhfYg

(I’m a sucker for modal grooves coupled with latin rhythms...)

And here’s a live version, from an excellent show (the tune in question kicks off at  about the 42 minute mark):

:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVrb2uaOXC0

RIP Kenny Kirkland

@audio-b-dog 

Yes; I’m familiar with both of those albums. 

I like Purim, too, but prefer her in this sort of setting:  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0x0Tgf4ZHk&list=OLAK5uy_kCXtbLfAYXY8Rl-Mm8A43kVI5zu2XLd38&index=3

As Sly said "Diff’rent strokes..."  

;o)

@audio-b-dog 

PM sent

Just discovered a group previously unknown to me...

Paul Desmond/Gerry Mulligan Quartet "Blues In Time": 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuFG5O8zW3Q

@mahgister 

I’ve only heard Klemmer’s more commercial radio fare from the 70’s. I seem to recall him using electronic effects on his sax. I wasn’t aware he’d done anything else.

@audio-b-dog 

Silverline SR 17.5. (Equipped with Dynaudio drivers). Bought them in new cond. on A’gon back in 2005. The current version is the SR 17 Supreme. At 7.5 K per pair, they are beyond my mean’s at present. If I get to a point where a speaker upgrade is possible, they will be a prime candidate. Silverline Audio is located in Walnut Creek, CA.