Ghosthouse, I was listening to "Something Else" by Cannonball Adderley, released on Blue Note Records in 1958. Also on the session is trumpeter Miles Davis in one of his handful of recording dates for Blue Note. Cannonball Adderley – alto saxophone Miles Davis – trumpet Hank Jones – piano Sam Jones – bass Art Blakey – drums https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLPW93VIVgsThis is the complete album, and I would like to know your honest opinion of this album, as well as all the rest of the aficionados out there? |
"Somethin Else" has been one of my favorite albums since it came out. I would like to point out one small detail that's easily overlooked; that's the fact that "Something" on that album is spelled "Somethin" minus the "G"; but however you spell it, it still sounds good.
The music ranges from beautiful ballads to the hardest of "hard-bop", and all the musicians are in fine form. The tunes are: "Autumn Leaves", "Love for Sale", "Somethin Else", "One for Daddy-O" and "Dancing In The Dark"; don't forget to give me your review and rating of this album.
Enjoy this music.
|
Asterwart, that LP started life in the top percentile of jazz albums, and there's not a cut on it that I don't like; they all have different grooves.
"Bangoon" isn't on the LP, maybe they got it on you tube. I'm with you on "Autumn leaves", that one is tops in my book.
Me and Randy have something in common, we both like songs sung in Portuguese, although neither of us understand a single solitary word. I found that song he sang for his grandmother.
BTW you will find "Somethin Else" in just about every aficionado's collection.
|
We are the music we like; as I stated previously, it began when we first wiggled our little buns to the music we liked; blues, rock, pop, or even Blue Grass.
Jazz is a language that speaks to some and not to others; Portuguese is the only language that seems to speak to me, even though I don't understand a single solitary word, but I like the sound of the words. Maybe jazz in general is a language that doesn't speak to you.
Now that you have sampled several different categories of jazz, you can choose which turns you on the most.
Enjoy the music.
|
There could not be a better time to be a "jazz aficionado" than the present. This is a good time to be in "Lock-down"; plenty of good music, and my rig is sounding better than ever; that's because of the quiet "grid".
Some of you may not know what that means. When commercial and industrial activity slows down, the electrical grid gets quiet, this gives you better electricity AKA "power supply". Expensive equipment is expensive because of the power supply; when the grid is exceptionally quiet, you get that benefit for free.
I find it humorous that people are complaining about "lock-down"; they should become "jazz aficionados" and enjoy it.
Happy Lock-down!
|
|
|
Ghosthouse, I noticed you didn't mention what you thought about those two Mingus cuts. They both contain some fantastic jazz, and I have come to the conclusion that you didn't hear it.
I don't think it's necessary to make an effort to hear and listen to good jazz. If you didn't hear it, forget it; it's not your cup of tea. You once said that was the case with "jazz jazz". One should not have to make an effort to enjoy music, and I could very well live without "new jazz".
You asked me about Michael Breker's, "Syzygy" and it sounds like it's spelt; we begin with "noodling" as you described it; although the rest of the crew is just fine, and the tune gets better as it progresses.
"Boogie Stop Shuffle"; the lead off sounds like a "Rock" guitar and certainly doesn't have the feel of the original "Boogie Stop Shuffle". Since this is "new jazz", I'm not the one who can give a critical appraisal; although halfway through it gets interesting.
From my point of view, these musicians would be better off without that tribute thing where they include another well known musician, unless they felt they could capture the essence of the other musician.
"Weird Nightmare" is interesting, and it might be capturing the essence of that tune. Mingus can be very complex at times, and I would have to do a lot of listening to grade Andy Summers on this album. He's got a host of musicians unknown to me on this album.
I will have to first listen to Mingus, and come back to "Peggy's Blue Sky light", and let you know whether or not Andy Summers succeeded. Without a doubt I will have to listen to this on the big rig, it's not sounding too good on this one.
|
Ghosthouse, at last, something I don't have to "pontificate" over; plain and simple; I like it and what "all" of the artists are doing as well; Michael Brecker-Tales From The Hudson -African Skies.
Brecker left out his "noodling", and he's blowing in fine form. McCoy Tyner is very much himself; I can't think of a new word at the moment, but it would amount to more "Tyneresque"; Trane fanatics know what I'm trying to say. Plus I like the African flavor.
Mingus is a lot about "culture"; he's a painter, and when you don't know the culture, you can't see the picture.
Enjoy the music.
|
Ghosthouse, St. Louis has a fantastic art museum; when I took my son, (who was a little tyke at the time) to infuse some culture in the kid, I got lost in the paintings, and almost lost my little tyke. (The way the guards acted, those paintings must have been worth a few bucks)
Maybe I should go again and we can compare art to music?
|
Frogman, I noticed all the comments were made by musicians. When I went to see "Trane" live, the professional musician at the table was the only person out of five who knew exactly what Trane was doing, when according to the rest of us he went to the seventh galaxy. (that musician is still with us and performing)
Absolutely nothing against the greatness of "John Coletrane", but it has been stated by those of us who are not musicians, that "Trane" had a tendency to "experiment", travel to unknown galaxies during his performances. I didn't understand it then, and I wouldn't understand it now; when musicians travel to parts unknown, it's a musician thing.
I'm listening to pilgrimage now, and it isn't inaccessible, it's quite listenable. While I liked all of those musicians, Herby Hancock might be the only one who never lost me; (not referring to this record, but down through the years) "Pilgrimage" is a record I'll have to get. When ever the music gets anywhere near what was referred to as "free blowing" or "loft jazz" I was lost. There is a slim line between improvisation, and too far out; when the musicians speed is faster than his ideas, that's when one of us is lost.
Sometime the links require a degree of listening that I don't give them; that means I should listen to them at a better time.
|
Ghosthouse, that was thirty years ago when me and the little tyke were at the art museum. I would certainly like to go again, but did you see the steps in front of the museum. The library is even worse, the steps to the first floor are at least three stories high.
If you're ever in St. Louis, the price is right (free), but if your legs aren't up to it, ( mine aren't) don't even think about it, that's a big place.
|
Frogman, time, time and time again, the same thing has been said about "Trane"; he goes to galaxies out in the far reaches of the universe. I believe musicians are impressed by the complexity of what he's playing, while people like me are saying; "But it don't sound like squat".
Since "Trane" is one of the greatest musicians who ever lived, that statement is "Blasphemy". No matter who is blowing, I divide the music into two categories; this sound good, that don't.
|
|
Gino's was packed, and if you were a man about town who went to live venues, you would have thought you were at a professional musicians convention; every local professional musician I knew from the various clubs in St. Louis was there.
There were two couples plus a professional drummer at our table, which was close enough to McCoy Tyner to clearly see the expressions on his face when he pounded the piano.
As soon as the music started, all conversation ceased; this was an audience of serious aficionados, and it was the first time St. Louis would get to see and hear John Coltrane on the Soprano Sax.
The set began with the "Trane" standards that the crowd came to hear, which were all played with extended improvisation. Every local sax man that I had ever seen was there taking it all in.
At last "My Favorite Things", the most important tune of the evening, the one that featured the Soprano Sax, which was brand new in the Winter of 63. That tune and the piercing sound of the Soprano Sax put me in a state of instant bliss; it was almost like the sound was inside my head emanating out, nothing had prepared me for this sound live.
After 15 minutes, which is longer than the recorded version, I was ready for the next tune. After 20 minutes the audience was ready for the next tune, and "Trane" was in the outer reaches of the galaxy. For an instant I saw a look of panic on McCoy Tyners face, (Trane was outward bound) Elvin Jones made eye contact with Tyner, who returned a look that said "Just hang with me".
By this time it sounded as if two different tunes were being played at the same time, while "Train" sailed past Orion's Nebula with his eyes closed in that happy place where musicians go, but he didn't take the audience with him.
"Are you sure Trane is clean" my date asked me, referring to his past bout with controlled substances.
When "Trane" opened his eyes, the look of the audience told him it was time to wrap that one up.
The only way you can hear this extended improvisation is to buy the new recorded sets of these live extended versions.
|
Pjw, " Return To Innocence" was stunningly beautiful and thought provoking.
|
|
Frogman, my opinion of Mr. John Coltrane, or his music has not changed one iota since that night. You do an awful lot of writing about something you have never heard, because he only went on those excursions on live sets, which you have never been on. What I mentioned was only released for the at home audience recently, because no one had a high opinion of it; but you can now purchase it and give your review. If McCoy Tyner, and Elvin Jones didn't know where he was, how could me or the audience know. Aficionados, I don't know how long that marvelous live set lasted, but his journey (by himself) into the outer galaxies only lasted for a few minutes, maybe less than 3 ( but it seemed like a long time) Although that was 50 years ago, my present rig sounds fuzzy compared to that live set; that soprano sax "live" was absolutely unforgettable. His journeys into the outer galaxies was much talked about, but only heard if you went to a live set, not available on records until long after his death. I enjoy every note of "Trane's" music now as much as I did then, which is to say, a lot; he has such an awesome variety, including those incredible solos when he was with Miles, that I can never get tired of "Trane's" music. Naturally "My Favorite Things" sounds like squat on CD after that night, because his soprano sax seemed to be resonating in my ear, making the recorded version sound dull and lifeless, but everything else still sounds good. Here's a seldom talked about side of "Trane". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r594pxUjcz4Enjoy the music. |
Acman, Michael Formanek - Wide Open Spaces, is synonymous with the words "good jazz".
|
"I don't want to get bogged down and go in circles and risk getting into a contentious argument."
So Frogman, why do you always risk it?
This has been discussed/debated here about half a dozen times now and we are very familiar with the account of that night.
Since you always misunderstand, you are not familiar enough with that night.
Moreover, you have often expressed the opinion that this was a period in his career when Coltrane "went too far" and this has been stated with a negative slant.
This was in 63, and he never quit doing what I described, he was still doing it late in his career, even more.
Frogman, since you are so aware of what I'm talking about, why don't you find an example of this on "you tube" and all of us can debate it.
No, that set was not recorded.
That audience had followed "Trane" for all those years he was with Miles, and since he started his own independent career; they were not the least unfamiliar with "Trane", that's why they put down decent bucks to see him, he was not a new item in 63.
I hope I have addressed all your comments. Please find a "you tube" that will exemplify what I'm speaking of, that you claim to be so aware of, in order for "our audience" to make their own independent determinations.
I hate to be so blunt, but put up, or shut up.
|
|
Thank you very much Acman; I consider that very appropriate for the present conversation.
"Trane", McCoy Tyner and Elvin Jones, are like one musically. The sound of the soprano sax, is the sound of India, and projects the Eastern groove "Trane" was in at that time.
Track 1 India, was recorded live at the Village Vanguard in 61; his live tracks are longer, and they have a different feel; that's because of audience feedback, which gives the performance high energy.
|
Ghosthouse, the crowd was almost every professional musician in St. Louis, and serious aficionados; a lot of whom I knew. That was a very big jazz event that no one serious about the music would miss.
For sure his performance didn't sound like the records they (we) had at home, but that's not what we came to see. What I spoke of, that someone is inferring was what the whole performance consisted of, was probably less than three minutes, and neither McCoy Tyner nor Elvin Jones were prepared for it. This was mentioned about most live performances after that one.
Enjoy the music.
|
Learsfool, the title of this thread is jazz for aficionados, not music 101. I have suggested to you and Frogman many times, if you want to start a music class thread, you both have my blessings.
You and he both have taught some music on this thread; the problem arose when at the same time, you and he decided to teach me music, and I stated feel free to teach, and those who want to learn can do so, but if I want music lessons, I'll find a music school.
An "Aficionado" is a person who is very knowledgeable and enthusiastic about an activity, subject, or pastime; in this case, sharing the best jazz music available, whether it be on record, CD or live. Nowhere does that include learning music; however, I will appreciate any comments you have, that you feel are appropriate to sharing an appreciation of listening to music.
|
Someone mentioned a tribute to Mingus, before I got sidetracked, and the question was; did it capture the essence of Charles Mingus. That was a huge task for sure; he would have to carefully divide the works of Mingus by category, and not by time. Some artists, Miles Davis in particular, changed in regard to time frame. Mingus chose various subjects that he painted on his musical canvas. The "Sanctified Church" was a recurring them; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvj1E7xyWsg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1WQR8Ti1vk"Goodbye Pork Pie Hat" was released on his album Mingus Ah Um. Mingus wrote it as an elegy for saxophonist Lester Young, who had died two months prior to the recording session, and was known to wear a broad-brimmed pork pie hat. It is one of Mingus's best-known compositions and has been recorded by many jazz and jazz fusion artists. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IsNHDuwJrMEnjoy the music. |
That only musicians are capable of understanding late period Trane. Frankly, it all seems a little ironic to me. That statement is slightly incorrect because you stated "Period "Trane", when I was referring to those 3 minutes when he lost McCoy Tyner and Elvin Jones on that set that the professional drummer at the table explained. Maybe this is the late period "Trane" you are referring to; this is "Trane's" last concert, which you can explain if you care to. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ7fC3vnPYI&t=1265sBeing a musician, you have the ability to explain this technically, and I'm looking forward to your explanation. |
Schubert, the tide swims against jazz folks, consequently they're going backwards by just standing still. |
Here's a winner I haven't seen; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2i-vAINqUgBass – Ike Isaacs Drums – Elvin Jones Piano – Sonny Clark Recorded By – Rudy Van Gelder Tenor Saxophone – Billy Root, Jug Trombone – Bennie Green There's that Jones fellow again. |
Frogman, the silence has been heard; it's time to move on forever more.
|
Learsfool, I want you to know that in no way am I challenging Frogmans authority to explain "Trane's" last period, because I know he has studied extensively and can write about it very clearly, and it's his profession. (Did I leave anything out? if so I'll include it in my next post)
Is this civil enough? BTW, I just looked up "Rancor", that is one ugly word; never let it said that I have been "Rancorous", and with that, I'll get some pop corn and await Frogman's explanation of "Trane's" last period.
|
Under the current circumstances, and considering how long I have waited for this NOPE!
|
"The sarcasm embedded in my request"? Could you expand that? "Forevermore" means the opposite of what we're doing now; it meant let it rest until the devil starts looking for his long johns. "How can one recognize what isn’t there if one can’t recognize it when it is there? Is that anything like the sound of one hand clapping? "His tune "Giant Steps" with its complicated and very fast changing harmonies has received more analysis than just about any other jazz tune that I can think of." What did "Giant Steps" have to do with this piece of music? This is not about John Coltrane, it's about "The Olatunji Concert". Our debate began as a result of 3 minutes of extended improvisation that went past where most people wish it had stopped in the Winter of 63. "However, I think that what gives our personal likes and dislikes relevance and meaning in the larger scheme of what art is all about requires that one consider things of this nature." I have already considered it, I was asking for your consideration? This is about this piece of music; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDiKea1r7sw&t=309s |
Frogman, I understood the music better than I understood your post.
|
Martyfriedman, I liked your list: Basia, Dianne Reeves, Eliane Ellis, Al Jarreau, are artists that are extensively represented in my collection.
Somehow I've had a hard time finding classical music that I like, but the strangest thing is that when I'm looking at a movie, where one of the characters is listening to classical, I like it.
Post some of your favorite classical along with the jazz.
|
There are more than usual the number of jazz reviews in "Stereophile" this month: Chicago/London Underground, A Night Walking Through Mirrors; Gerald Clayton, Tributary Tales; Chris Pottter, The Dreamer is The Dream; Jason Rigby & Detroit-Cleveland Trio; followed by Ralph Towner, My Foolish Heart.
Since I have a busy weekend, feel free to review and inform us of any of those that you choose.
Enjoy the music.
|
Heavy Soul was recorded November 26, 1961; his death was in January of 63. Soul Samba was recorded in 1962, released in 1962; both albums were released in 1962, but Soul Samba was also recorded in 1962 Heavy Soul was released in mid March of 62, and I remember owning it in the Summer of 63; but I can't remember if I had Ike Quebec before the "Trane" set or not. Winter; was it before or after January, I can't remember; Winter 62 or 63, can be days apart. if it was after January it was 63. Since my mind tells time by the four seasons; Summer, Winter, Spring, and Fall; first I have to pinpoint the season the event occurred in. (that's the way my memory works, confusing, ain't it) I thought "Heavy Soul" was the last album, because the artists knew Ike had cancer, you can even hear it in the music; especially in Freddie Roach's organ, but it wasn't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7h85fVLvG8Enjoy the music. |
And there I am right behind you Mary_jo; I like nightclubs on Saturday night.
|
Schubert, that thing you have in your hand when using a computer is called a "Mouse". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_mouseFirst "left" click on "You tube". After "you tube" pops up, type in the heading what you want to hear: Ralph Vaughn-Williams "The Lark Ascending" Once you have typed in the heading what you want to hear, "left" click on that circle at the end of the you tube heading. After you have done this, you will be given options of which "Vaughn Williams" you want to hear. "Left" click on that selection, and it will begin to play. While it's playing, go to the heading, and hold the left clicker down, while moving the "mouse" across the page over the heading until it's "Blue". (both actions at the same time) hold left clicker down while moving the "mouse" across the page until it turns "Blue". Now go all the way to the top right of the page where you will click on (customize google) it's a drop down box that will have options in it, "Left" click on "copy". After you have done all that, you can "paste" it onto your response box in " Audiogon" This is done by left clicking onto the response box. When you see the line in the left corner flashing, that means you can "paste" your "you tube" entry into the response box. Now we use the "right" clicker on your mouse to do this. Click on "right" (while the line is flashing in the "response" box, and a selection box will drop down. Out of all the options you select "Paste". Once you select "Paste", like magic, your click on from "you tube" will appear in the response box, and we can all hear Ralph Vaughn-Williams "The Lark Ascending" . After you get used to doing this, you can do it in less than a minute; get busy. |
What's new? How is the world treating you? You haven't changed a bit Lovely as ever, I must admit What's new? How did that romance come through? We haven't met since then Gee, but it's nice to see you again What's new? Probably I'm boring you But seeing you is grand And you were sweet to offer your hand I understand. Adieu! Pardon my asking what's new Of course you couldn't know I haven't changed, I still love you so Most standards are a short story in and of themselves; if you've lived the city life, they're a page out of your very own diary. Picture this; while strolling past your favorite lounge, you decide to go in and have a couple. Your eyes are still adjusting to the dim light, but in the middle of the bar, you see the love of your life that you haven't seen for a year, and the song goes on from there; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ct6PJ8ZUd8Enjoy the music. |
Schubert, I could teach a fox terrier how to do this, quit making excuses. You're telling us you have a computer different from everybody else.
I'm sure you know someone else with a computer. If you are afraid to ask them for help, that makes you are "not too bright". Unless you can do this, you can not fully participate in the thread; quit writing these failure notes and keep following those instructions.
It's ok to ask questions, but failure is not an option.
|
Schubert, your problem is, You got "Quit-itis"
"Google" has what's called a "Drop-down-box" as far to the right and as high as you can go; when you have your marker over that box, "customize google chrome" will appear click on it and see what happens?
|
Art Blakey, "Night In Tunisia" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHKyVJ5YfNUArt Blakey – drums Lee Morgan – trumpet Wayne Shorter – tenor saxophone Bobby Timmons – piano Jymie Merritt – bass Sometime I dream about these guys, I can hear them in my sleep; they will never leave us. |
|
Rok, I ain't never got the Blues. If you noticed, I never mentioned the West Side of Chicago; that was the "uncool" side of Chicago. The only reason I went to the Blues Clubs in St. Louis is because that's where the "uncool" females went. There were no "cool" females in St. Louis; consequently I had to see Chuck Berry, and Albert King, but I was too young to get into the club where Tina Turner appeared, and so was she. Although I must admit I did like Albert King. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyBZnLuNJ7k |
|
Mary_jo, the best place for you to be is here, and here is where you belong. You can come "here" whenever you feel like it, and share your thoughts and feelings; you can share your music whether it's jazz or not. I would like to share some music with you that's not jazz. This music takes me back to the very best time in my entire life; it was when I felt the most secure, it was before I knew anything about this horrible world in which we live, it was when my favorite aunt read me fairy tales from a thick white jewel encrusted book. She would take off her big diamond ring that I liked to twist and turn under the light to see it sparkle while I nestled snugly in the crook of her arm. Fairy tale land was where all things were possible and there was always magic in the air, and that's where we were going. "Andreas Vollenweider" takes me back to that time; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onp_uRj6FNEI saw him live once where I had a seat center mezzanine in a big theater, it was like being in the center of a gigantic speaker. I brought long range, and wide angle binoculars so that I wouldn't miss anything; the percussionist alone had a truckload of equipment and watching him was both enchanting and hypnotic. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rywJpDYgAhQNo one knows better than me what a horrible world in which we live, and that was before the virus. I choose to leave it whenever I feel like it, and you can be my "Jade Princess" and come with me. I know Rok will object, but so what. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uZUnjGQ7-oWe have only just began our journey into other worlds between here and there. |
|
Tablejocky, I appreciate your thoughtfulness in sharing that find; not many of us left who can appreciate such a find, and to think they are still around.
Ages ago, I began replacing albums such as that one with the original, and still have LP's that have hardly been played, and that makes a big difference; I don't want to hear one scratch, it ruins the mood.
I wish you continued success in collecting those original LP's which are the best.
Enjoy the music.
|
Tablejockey, before computers, I recorded my best LP's to reel, now I down load them to "hardrive". There is no loss in fidelity provided it's done right; it's not too difficult or too expensive, and that way you can listen to those precious LP's over and over without any damage.
Just wondering if you had done the same?
|
|
