Is the Berning ZH270 revalatory?

Hi Mew

I for one have gone ga ga in my enthusiasm of this amp since I first acquired it almost 2 years ago and no, it hasn't waned. My only criticism on an absolute level is that it still doesn't sound like live music :).

I do understand your initial skepticism Zaikesman but I can assure you that there is a demand for the amps that exceeds supply. Allan is an extremely honorable man in my personal dealings with him. He wouldn't have to go to this extreme to get his product noticed, he doesn't have to since this is a word of mouth product. I will say that his enthusiasm for th ZH270 is at least on a par with other users as evidenced by his continual tweaking to enhance its performance.

The only amp I have personally heard that I feel is equally good but different, better or should I say preferable to me in some ways and less so in others is the Joule Electra. Neither of these amps would fall into the tube characterization of euphonic, dark or mushy. The transient attack of SS with the dynamic realism of the best tube designs.

Hi Lugnut

While I find it generally true that ultra resolving gear often exposes poorer than average recordings in a less than favorable light, I would think that this amp would be less critical than many in highlighting this so long as the cabling, and speaker/amp interface are satisfactorily addressed. It has a natural warmth and clarity.

My experience is that compressed poorly recorded rock and pop music sounds better with inexpensive less than revealing components. Who really wants to listen critically to what a horrendous job that was done on many of these tracks? I never want more than that when listening to for instance Steppenwolf or Motown, oh how it hurts so bad, unlistenable. Just my opinion but I do hear where you are coming from.

Hi Fiddler

The mods include selected and matched cryoed 6jn6 output tubes. The input driver tubes should be procured through Andy of Vintage Audio who has the correct electrical characteristics per the manufacturer. ERS "stealth" covers which minimizes the effect of RFI interference and covers the impedance converters and is also added on several locations inside and on the bottom cover of the amp. Upgraded coupling caps which are also cryoed treated.

Saving the best for last or should I say pulling it all together and taking the amp to a greater level of performance than I could believe was possible is the hybrid silver wire for the inputs and power cables inside the amp. I had this mod done almost 3 weeks ago. I heard the improvement immediately but true to his word, Allan told me to wait about 2 weeks to realize the significance of this mod. I must say that I really heard it last night to the degree I expect he was referring to.

To owners of this amp that have had the other mods done, each has brought something different to the performance of the amp. The wire, which should be saved for last is easily the most significant. The sense of ease and greater inner resolution is readily apparent. Instruments and textures are better delineated and much more realistic, closer to the performance. I have never heard such transparency from an audio component. I had the opportunity to listen to this mod in my system through Fourproof's mono amps. I can certainly attest to Vetterone's comments concerning the bass performance of 2 of these amps on the Merlins. It was almost too much. But on material with low bass information, there was a sense of ease and power that one amp couldn't match. I was continually bombarded by puffs of air coming from the ports of the Merlins at 9' away, this at quite moderate listening levels.

Oops, Sorry John, I meant Oneproof.

In the truest definition of the term "troll" I expect that Mew could be considered one but in the context of trolling for responses from other users. So by that definition, trolling isn't always a bad thing, is it? I have posted several "trolls" myself for similar affirmations, nothing wrong with that me thinks. The lesson learned here might be that it is best to get the facts of a concern by doing it quietly (a personal e-mail to Mew or Allan maybe?) rather than yelling fire before the smoke is evident.

Zaikesman, I generally hold your opinions in very high regard for both your forthrightness and content but I expect you assumed too much too soon in this case. If I were in the position of Allan Bhagan I would be more than a bit offended.

I ordinarily wouldn't comment any further on this matter but it isn't the first time I've seen exactly the same thing happen to a dealer unjustifiably. While there wasn't a direct accusation there was very strong inuendo that this thread was initiated to promote the amp to the benefit of the dealer. We are all interested in maintaining a site where the users are not being snowed by a bunch of self serving dealers Zaikesman. I think Audiogon and the members have by and large done a very good job of maintaining this site away from that end. In kind, we must do are part to be responsible before making remarks that could tarnish the reputation of folks that make a living from our hobby.

I suppose our approach is different Zaikesman. “Could be” raises a question in ones mind and obviously it did in yours and maybe others as well. Everyone that makes a living through sales or peddling of a product or service attempts to influence in the direction they want us to go, whether it be lobbyists giving sums of money to political campaigns for future favors or at the very least future considerations towards their interests or audio dealers to “Beta testers” for their respected opinion with if not expressed then certainly implied understanding that it will be favorable.

The issue at hand relative to this thread might be, How does one raise the question without sounding accusatory without any evidence? My whole point is that if there is a suspicion on your part or anyone for that matter, it should be explored behind the scenes before it is raised for all to see. Suspicion by many in our society is viewed as guilty until proven innocent which can be very difficult to overcome once it is associated with an individual, the examples are countless. In our little world it could spread like wildfire. My father drilled into from the time I was a young child that personal honor is the most important asset you have, don’t lose it. I say in turn that it is equally important to protect each other and gather facts as quietly as possible before raising a question for the public to see about the personal integrity and motivations of an individual. This is an important point to keep in mind and while I appreciate your coherent response I feel the essence of what I was attempting to point out in my last post was skirted over. The “process” of getting to the bottom of the issue, not the suspicion itself. True democracy, of by and for the people is a utopian ideal that can only be realized when people are truly equal and viewed by each other as such which is to say mutually respected.

Zaikesman you are being too hard on yourself in your quest for integrity. We can only be true to ourselves and let the chips fall where they will so long as we don't unduly step on anyone in the process. You should post the review based on your assessment of the product on its own merits. The fact that you received a discount is irrelevant so long as that doesn't interfere with your honest assessment of it on its own terms and there is no local dealer who is unaware of the arrangement.

You may want to keep in mind that retail price and wholesale are completely different. Since you purchased directly from the manufacturer often times you will get a substantial discount, 30-40% is not uncommon. I don't think anyone would hold it against you but the concensus of your positive review better be on your side :)

Mew when I first got the Berning prior to making a committment to purchasing it, I did exactly the same thing for exactly the same reason. I was so taken back by its performance that I had to question that what I was hearing was maybe too good to be true? This was posted on Audio Asylum for anyone interested in reading the comments from other listeners. One compared a Berning to Atma-sphere system with a comparatively favorable result, equally good but different. After reading the kudos from several owners, all were happy, I purchased the amp and have been thrilled ever since. Of course its performance is much better now with the upgrades. Based on what I have heard and this includes among the best Lamm ML-1's, Tenor, Joule Electra, BAT, Conrad Johnson, Audio Research and a few SS amps including Halcro albeit in different systems and audio show conditions, the intrinsic virtues of the Berning is there. While I would hesitate to say it is at the top tier until I listened to all the contenders in familiar systems, I am confident enough that it will provide long term musical satisfaction to all but those that can and are willing to pay considerably more without the itch rearing its ugly head as is often the case in this hobby.

For the record, the only reason I replaced my previous amp, a Transcendent T-8 LN 25 watt OTL was the power issue. I was quite satisfied otherwise. Not only did the Berning give me more power but freed up space, lowered the heat in the room and proved a major improvement in every area of performance.