It is not chump change to me. If it did not represent a substantial effort to obtain. I would not have bothered with this post.
Is the Audio Ref-6SE worth 7K more than the BAT VK-80?
Greeting all,
I looking to replace an venerable Sonic Frontiers Line Stage Once Pre-Amp. I been looking hard at two products. The Audio Research Ref-6SE $17K and the newly released BAT VK-80 $10K.
These will be mated with a Pair of EVO-400's set up as Mono-Blocks and re-tubed KT-150's I like their snap over the stock EL-34's. My tastes in Pre-Amps is it has to be good with vocals but so overly warm and syrupy. That it cannot flesh out the detail within and recording, or sacrifice tightness and punch in the bass. In short it needs to provide resolution over sweetness. The Amps drive a pair of Legacy Focus SE speakers. These things do not like anything in the signal chain that fattens the low end.
Music preference are Rock, Metal and Classical. Think: Pat Benatar, Heart, Def Leopard, Evanescence, Lacuna Coil, Metallica, Bach Organ Works, and Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture and you get the picture the bombastic material I like.
I enjoy how both Pre-Amps mate with my system. However, it seems that Ref-6SE dances with my setup a little better that the BAT. My crackpot theory, is its more at home with sonic character of the KT=150's which is what their Reference 160-M/S amps use.
Nonetheless, The BAT's build quality is more impressive, and I feel I really get something for my $10K. So it seems to me that I am paying a lot for that Audio Research prestige, than quality. Not a fan of a $17k Pre-Amp that comes with a plastic remote. That to me is a major turn off. So what other chintzy things are they doing with this component, in order to increase their profit margin?
Any additional thoughts and opinions are appreciated.
Showing 5 responses by walkertm
Sorry but not really. In my system they do sound different but are equally enjoyable. Overall, I think the AR pre sounds better. However, great sound alone is not my sole deciding factor. The concern here is not just how good the sound is. Albeit, I have to like how it sound in my system. The answers I am looking for pertain to build quality and worthiness of the additional expense. To put it bluntly the Ref-6se appears to be a bit of a rip off. What I see inside of it does not seem on par with what the BAT is built with. |
@ chorus Are we talking Jay from You Tube? Each to their own. No one has to like BAT gear in order for me to enjoy it. I am a bit of Maverick I like what I like. Do not care if others do. |
@runwell Auditioned the LS 28se, even lighter build. I found it sounded thinner, more analytical, not having the same amount of body as the BAT. To my ear, the vocals did not have the same leve of nuance, that the VK-80. could flesh out. Not saying the 28se it not a worthy peice of techonolgy. The BAT preamp costs nearly the same and suited my tastes to greater degree. I found I had to go to the Ref 6se, in order to have something that surpases the BAT. The gear you speak of was produced in a differnt era when AR was under different ownership. Great stuff, you have something I consider special. Since the Italian's took it over I am not sure it subscribes to the same standard of craftmanship as it did in the late 90's. Granted what I am expressing are nits, and do not carry much weight within the grand scheme of things. I am still at a loss why the remote they offer on the Ref 6 SE is a plastic thing that is more of an after thought and not integral part of its design. You would think on a peice of this caliber they would go all out. This make we ponder if they are the same company that I remember from their heyday. If you get the chance to audition a BAT Vk-80 and compare and contrast it to the current LS-28se. You will see my hesistancy to invest in one. |
@cleeds4. Thanks for taking the time to respond and setting me straight.I am am a fan boy of ARC, and really needed to know that they have not started to chintz out o Really glad to have this pointed out to me. Thank You, THANK YOU. ARC now ships with a nice metal remote. ARC offers Ref 6 owners who received the plastic remote the new metal remote at no charge. Perhaps that tells you something about the state of ARC today . When I refer to the Italians I am referring designer Livio Cucuzza who I believe is the Chief Design Officer at McIntosh Group that comes from the Sonus Faber arm of the group’s holdings. My wording here is very poor, so my apologies to all. This is no way should be construed that I believe Italian engineering to be sub standard. Though it certainly came off that way. Pathos and Sonus Faber make wonderful products, that are top notch in both design and quality. The concern is when things change hands. Design goals and priorities change as well. To my point, think of early Dan D’Agostino designed Krell’s versus the Krell amps of today. I find that they are not engineered the same way, and prefer the build quality and sound of those early products. |