Intimate, warm and holographic alternative


Me another time... Sorry for the inconveniences.

Yes, recently I started a discussion here with the title: " ATC SCM150 (or JBL Synthesis) (or JBL vintage) (or new Klipsch Jubilee)". See: https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/atc-scm150-or-jbl-synthesis-or-jbl-vintage-or-new-klipsch-jub...
Last post from ohlala, advising that studio monitor type sound is not the most "enjoyable" for him, was revealing. I could hear yesterday an SCM20 (yes, I know it´s not comparable in many aspects with the SCM150) but the type of sound have not convinced me.

So now I´m more on the warm side, looking for a intimate and holographic sound with great scene. Really useful some old threadas about this, especially: https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/seeking-advice-on-speakers-that-create-an-intimate-2-channel-... 

I would like to hear personal opinions and experiences about the best speakers that give that musical sensation in which the devices "disappear". Suggestions, brand, models...

I was searching some brands and models and here are some that have caught my attention:

- Gershman Acoustics: Avant Garde
- Legacy Audio: Aeris + Wavelet
- Devore Fidelity: Orangutan O/96 (fatigue??; little too "in your face"??; fleshy bass??)
- Harbeth: 40.3 XD (not a true rock and roll speaker??)
- Klipsch
- Spendor
- Tannoy

Listening position is 9 feet from the speakers. My room is big: 41 square meters. I´m worried about bass. I hear a lot of music but specially rock, so I would like something capable.

Thanks so much to everyone. You are very helpful.

milhomes

Showing 2 responses by mijostyn

milhomes, there is only one type of speaker that "disappears," a full range electrostatic starting with the old Quad 57. This is why people have fallen in love with a speaker that so limited and fragile. Nothing does the disappearing act better than the old 57s. There are ESLs now that are some of the toughest speakers made with few limitations. But, they are large and difficult to drive. I do not include Martin Logan speakers in this elite group. They are hybrid speakers and just do not disappear like full range ESLs. Sander's Model 10s are also hybrids but from what I have read they manage to maintain the ESL magic sound stage. ER Audio makes a line of ESL kits at very reasonable prices. Then for the people with adequate resources there is Sound Labs. 

bobandcindy, you and I are obviously on the same page. You have never heard a speaker disappear until you here an excellent system around ESLs. However, Martin Logans are not the best ESLs going. Because the curved diaphragm is not linear they have to cross to a standard driver at the bottom of the midrange which steals much of the ESL magic. Roger Sanders designed the curved diaphragm as a means of dealing with the poor high frequency dispersion large panels have. You can read what he thinks about it on his web site. Sound Labs has the best solution to that problem avoiding the need to crossover to another driver entirely. All the other speakers mentioned in this post from MBL to Tekton (yuk) can not hold a candle to a proper ESL. With the exception of a few horn designs there are ESLs and then there is everything else. Modern ESLs are not the fragile, amplifier eating beasts they use to be. They are more dynamic, and play louder than most speakers excepting a few horn designs. Because they can easily be configured as a full range line source the sound stage you get is a more realistic size and because the volume drop off with distance is not near as severe it is easy to set them up so that the effective listening area is as wide as the room. No dynamic speaker can do this. People who like full range drivers are barking up the right tree. ESLs are really big full range drivers. There is a unity of presentation that only a full range driver can have. The distortion levels of an ESL are at least two orders of magnitude lower than any dynamic driver. In listening to dynamic loudspeaker based systems what you here  predominantly are the characteristics of the speaker. The music sounds like the speaker. With good ESLs what you hear are the characteristics of the recording. The speaker vanishes. In my experience they are the only type of loudspeaker that does this. I have it on authority from people I trust that there are horn systems that will do this. I have little to no experience with them.  Admittedly ESLs are not going to be everybody's cup of tea. Just their size is prohibitive for many then there is the cost including the expense of a higher powered amplifier capable of sounding good into a reactive, very low impedance (at high frequencies) load. But if you have the room and the money you owe it to yourself to find a system you can audition. People who live in the northeast are welcome to contact me and set up a date. I do not sell loudspeakers or any audio equipment for that matter and have no kick back arrangement with any manufacturer.